AbsolutNET
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A QB who has problems pulling the trigger when he needs to doesn't exactly fit Holmgren's style. And by that I mean it would be a disaster.
endzorn":1670aojh said:The Niners are a pre-snap determined, one-read passing offense? Bullshit. Even if that were true, and it isn't, that doesn't excuse Kaepernick from staring at one guy the entire time until he bails. This one read crap sounds like fans making an excuse for a glaring deficiency.
Marvin49":1byhxl61 said:How did Harbaugh turn Todd Mortensen, Josh Johnson, Andrew Luck, Alex Smith and Colin Kaepernick into very successful QBs VERY quickly after they took the reigns? Simplicity..
Sgt. Largent":dw467mfo said:Marvin49":dw467mfo said:How did Harbaugh turn Todd Mortensen, Josh Johnson, Andrew Luck, Alex Smith and Colin Kaepernick into very successful QBs VERY quickly after they took the reigns? Simplicity..
The difference is all these QB's other than Kaep are pocket passing high completion percentage and accurate QB's. Kaep never was, and never will be an accurate pocket passer that can go through progressions properly and then complete passes into tight windows.
Harbaugh did a great job of figuring out what Kaep could do well when he decided he was the starter. Then defenses figured out how to scheme that, so Harbaugh DID TRY to make Kaep more of of a traditional pocket passer this year............the result is a massive failure.
Bottom line, the Niners could dig up the ghost of Walsh, hire Mike Holmgren, and have Kaepernick live with Young and Montana 24/7 Real World style............but none of it matters, because in the end you can't coach accuracy.
Whatever coach comes to SF, if they keep Kaep then they need to go back to the pistol offense that everyone knows can score 21 pts a game, and focus on rebuilding the defense and finding another RB. THAT can work. But trying to make Kaep into something he'll never be? That my friend is failure before you even begin.
Marvin49":1u3dtzw3 said:You could very well be right, but Niners will never be sure what they do or don't have in Kap till he is asked to do things other QBs are asked to do.
Sgt. Largent":1ll10ce8 said:Marvin49":1ll10ce8 said:You could very well be right, but Niners will never be sure what they do or don't have in Kap till he is asked to do things other QBs are asked to do.
He was this year wasn't he? You're closer to the Niners than me, but all I've heard over the past 10 games is "there was a concerted effort this year by Harbaugh and his staff to make Kaepernick into a more traditional QB, which is why his running stats are way down."
Becoming an accurate progression QB is not something you learn over an off season. It's ingrained into a QB by literally throwing thousands and thousand of balls within that style of offense for entire high school, college and pro seasons.
This is why I don't think Mariota will be a good pro QB. He's like Kaep, all he's ever done is a one read pistol style offense where if he's throwing the ball it's because someone's WIDE open. Just doesn't happen in the pros.
IMO Kaep is a very talented athlete, and you gotta play to his strengths..........run the pistol and run like the F'ing wind. End of story.
Marvin49":11pgymu6 said:Steve Young is kinda a good example. He was a running QB who had to break his tendencies and learn to play QB from the pocket. I think its the only way to enjoy long term success.
I think Kaepernick can get there with a more conventional QB coach, but I have to fairly admit that is really an unknown.
Sgt. Largent":37hhqude said:Marvin49":37hhqude said:Steve Young is kinda a good example. He was a running QB who had to break his tendencies and learn to play QB from the pocket. I think its the only way to enjoy long term success.
I think Kaepernick can get there with a more conventional QB coach, but I have to fairly admit that is really an unknown.
I was on your side Marvin, til you brought up Young.
Young graduated BYU completing 70% of his balls with an ungodly 168 passer rating, and continued that into the pros. In fact I think he's either the all time passer rating leader, or 2nd.
Kaep ain't even in the same accuracy universe as that, let alone neighborhood to compare the two.
Marvin49":yn0ck1nl said:From a physical standpoint, Steve and Kap are completely different guys. The only think they really have in common is mobility.
Sgt. Largent":92cbmw9r said:Marvin49":92cbmw9r said:From a physical standpoint, Steve and Kap are completely different guys. The only think they really have in common is mobility.
I get ya, but Young had the college accuracy and system foundation to make the transition to the west coast offense. He also had what 3-4 years on the bench learning under the greatest QB of all time.
Just think you're wishful thinking here. Take the Carroll approach to Kaep. Don't focus on trying to fix the negative, figure out what he does well and create an offense around it.
You forgot (shame on you) Joe Montana, who won two MVPs under Holmgren's direct tutilage. Coach Holmes is the greatest qb coach that ever lived. As a head coach, he doesn't scare me, but as an OC with Kaep he sure as hell would.5_Golden_Rings":5jtn09ap said:http://www.bayareasportsguy.com/san-francisco-49ers-head-coach-mike-holmgren-interested/
Former San Francisco 49ers offensive coordinator Mike Holmgren is highly interested in becoming the 49ers’ next head coach, according to a source who spoke with Holmgren.
http://www.ninersnation.com/2014/12/15/ ... lly-season
What would you Seahawk fans think of that? Holmgren back in the Bay area?
If this happens, expect Kaepernick to become a real NFL QB, 66 years old or no. Holmgren has already turned Steve Young, Brett Favre (19 TDs to 24 INTs before Holmgren got through to him; 33 TDs to 14 INTs the next season) and Matt Hasselbeck into legitimate NFL QBs. He even made Trent Dilfer look good for half a season. Of course, knowing Jed York and Trent Baalke, they'll want a yes man after the Harbaugh fiasco. I can't imagine them bringing him in. Particularly considering that Baalke is a Parcell's disciple.
But on the other hand, such a move would greatly mollify the masses, which would make it rather prudent, if Holmgren were to accept only coaching.
How would you guys feel if Mike Holmgren became the next 49er coach? Nostalgic? Angry? Humored?
kearly":22tlr72t said:Even if Baalke and Holmgren got together famously and Holmgren got his QB, I think the team they'd build would be the West Coast version of the Atlanta Falcons with a better running game. And this team would probably take 4 years to materialize.
The irony of Holmgren's Cleveland tenure is that the Browns drafted well particularly on defense, but were undone by his hand picked QBs. Holmgren, one of the most respected QB gurus of all time, failing because he went all in for Colt McCoy and Brandon Weeden.