Russell Wilson expects Seahawks to franchise tag him in 2020

[erik2690]

The data is out there, and it isn't good. Teams that break the bank giving their "elite" QB's huge extensions have't fared well after trying to piece together a SB caliber roster with their QB soaking up almost 20% of the cap.

Can you specify what this means? The data set is very limited on this and Matt Ryan was as close as can be to winning with a 16%+ cap hit. Do we think Atlanta blew that b/c they could have signed 1 more bench guy for 500k if Ryan had gone under 15%? I don't. Out of the divisional round playoff teams (top 8 teams) last year 4 spent over 12.9% on QB. ATL, MIN, NO and PIT. Did those 4 teams have teams good enough to contend? Because that should be the question not 'Did they win the SB?'. Limiting it to just the SB winner shrinks the data set too much to make any even halfway good causation analysis. Wilson for instance in the back end of his current contract only gets up to 13.5%. No crazy aberration as it relates to the % of high quality playoff teams. The year before 6 of the top 8 teams had over 12.6% QB cap hits and ATL who were up 28-3 had the highest hit at 16.6%.


I'm not saying paying a QB big dollars doesn't hurt, but when you refer directly to "data" I just wish it was made more specific what you mean because it makes it sound real official but then didn't actually state what you meant or what the data was.

Unfortunately there is 1 Patriots and it's a tough act to replicate what other teams have had recent long stretches of sustained success with low paid QB's other than the Seahawks in 2012-2014? A couple teams came up last year with cheap QB's after a decade of miserable play. Maybe Philadelphia is the answer to my question but they had some pretty lean years. The teams that appear in the playoffs regularly outside of Pats seem to have pretty established well paid QB's.

 

[IndyHawk]

I think you pay a QB that kind of salary if they can legitimately carry a team like Rodgers (when he is not injured), but as good as RW is...I don't think he's good enough to carry the team. I'm not saying RW isn't great, I just don't think he's the 1 of 3 QBs that can carry a team and therefore should not get paid like one. But he'll probably want that money and sadly I'd rather watch the Hawks move on and have an overall greater team than be top heavy with 1 extremely good mobile QB.

If the Eagles have shown anything with their BACKUP QB winning it all, maybe the QB position shouldn't be valued as high as it is provided the coaching and FO can get the team around him appropriate with that saved QB $.

Yes I agree with a lot of this. But....... Foles is an EXTREMELY HIGH END BACKUP. You have to remember he was at a Pro Bowl level and is 6'5" 240 lbs. with a big league arm. He was the next big thing before he dropped off and struggled. But at one time he was playing at a super high level. So maybe sitting down got him out of his bad habits, got the second guessing out of his mind and he just played ball when he got back in there. I'm just saying Foles when playing at his top level best play is far better than most backups in this league. He certainly was playing his best in the playoffs. I thought his NFC Championship game and Super Bowl he was outstanding and playing at an elite level.

With all that said I don't think Wilson is the type of guy who can put a team on his back and take them to the Super Bowl. He made Super Bowls but he had a SUPER ELITE DEFENSE backing him up and holding the other team down. Plus he had a Beast Mode RB who can carry 5 guys on his back on his way to the first down and moving the chains. Plus in those years I think his O Line was certainly much better than what he has now and his WR's were better than what he has now. The bottom line is he had lots and lots of help. He didn't do it by himself.

Brady on the other hand has literally had years where his defense is ranked like in the 20's. Plus no elite WR's other than Randy Moss. But with the exception of Moss he had a bunch of marginal guys who he made look good with his pin point accuracy. Yes he has Gronk at TE. But he didn't always have that either earlier in his career. The point is with a few exceptions his 5 - 3 (8 times in the Super Bowl) lacked very elite defenses for the most part. It also lacked very elite WR's with the exception of Moss for a while. He also NEVER had a Beast Mode RB. He kind of would drag his teams into the Super Bowl because he is that good although people don't like to admit it. But I don't see how anybody could deny it anymore at this point. I used to even deny it early in his career. It just doesn't make sense to deny it anymore. It's a lot of Brady. A huge amount of Brady is why they had that run obviously.

Brady over the last 2 contracts or so chooses to be underpaid so his team enjoys a stronger team
overall. The Patriots also got caught cheating in earlier SB years so there is that as well.
Without the lower contract Brady gets,I doubt the Pats make the SB like they have and Brady still plays today
as he probaly would have gotten injured by cheap players protecting him.

 

[lobohawk]

I think you pay a QB that kind of salary if they can legitimately carry a team like Rodgers (when he is not injured), but as good as RW is...I don't think he's good enough to carry the team. I'm not saying RW isn't great, I just don't think he's the 1 of 3 QBs that can carry a team and therefore should not get paid like one. But he'll probably want that money and sadly I'd rather watch the Hawks move on and have an overall greater team than be top heavy with 1 extremely good mobile QB.

If the Eagles have shown anything with their BACKUP QB winning it all, maybe the QB position shouldn't be valued as high as it is provided the coaching and FO can get the team around him appropriate with that saved QB $.

Yes I agree with a lot of this. But....... Foles is an EXTREMELY HIGH END BACKUP. You have to remember he was at a Pro Bowl level and is 6'5" 240 lbs. with a big league arm. He was the next big thing before he dropped off and struggled. But at one time he was playing at a super high level. So maybe sitting down got him out of his bad habits, got the second guessing out of his mind and he just played ball when he got back in there. I'm just saying Foles when playing at his top level best play is far better than most backups in this league. He certainly was playing his best in the playoffs. I thought his NFC Championship game and Super Bowl he was outstanding and playing at an elite level.

With all that said I don't think Wilson is the type of guy who can put a team on his back and take them to the Super Bowl. He made Super Bowls but he had a SUPER ELITE DEFENSE backing him up and holding the other team down. Plus he had a Beast Mode RB who can carry 5 guys on his back on his way to the first down and moving the chains. Plus in those years I think his O Line was certainly much better than what he has now and his WR's were better than what he has now. The bottom line is he had lots and lots of help. He didn't do it by himself.

Brady on the other hand has literally had years where his defense is ranked like in the 20's. Plus no elite WR's other than Randy Moss. But with the exception of Moss he had a bunch of marginal guys who he made look good with his pin point accuracy. Yes he has Gronk at TE. But he didn't always have that either earlier in his career. The point is with a few exceptions his 5 - 3 (8 times in the Super Bowl) lacked very elite defenses for the most part. It also lacked very elite WR's with the exception of Moss for a while. He also NEVER had a Beast Mode RB. He kind of would drag his teams into the Super Bowl because he is that good although people don't like to admit it. But I don't see how anybody could deny it anymore at this point. I used to even deny it early in his career. It just doesn't make sense to deny it anymore. It's a lot of Brady. A huge amount of Brady is why they had that run obviously.

Brady over the last 2 contracts or so chooses to be underpaid so his team enjoys a stronger team
overall. The Patriots also got caught cheating in earlier SB years so there is that as well.
Without the lower contract Brady gets,I doubt the Pats make the SB like they have and Brady still plays today
as he probaly would have gotten injured by cheap players protecting him.

The Pats also play in a crap division which pretty much guarantees they make the playoffs with home field advantage. More opportunities mean more championships, if teams are similar in talent.

 

[original poster]

Article - "Why the Seahawks may not extend Russell Wilson but keep him in Seattle regardless" -

https://www.hawk-talk.com/single-post/2 ... in-Seattle

 

[adeltaY]

You could Franchise Tag him. You can't really let him go until you get something better lined up. I like Russell Wilson a lot. But is he worth these crazy $30 million a year contracts they are now throwing around for a long term deal? IDK? And this is coming from somebody who actually likes him. I follow the Wisconsin Badgers and am a fan of them. He played QB there. I've known of Russell Wilson for a long time and liked his game. He is talented and has won. Albeit with a great, great defense backing him up. I don't know if he is the type of guy to put the team on his back and carry them to the Super Bowl like Tom Brady. He did get there with a super elite defense and a Beast mode RB. But I don't think that is the same thing as carrying the team by yourself to the Super Bowl. Don't get me wrong. I like Russell Wilson and think he is very talented in some ways. It's just is he worth these huge long term deals they are throwing around now a days?

Def a fair assessment, but to the Brady point he did have the #1 points allowed defense for his last SB. Now they werent as good as that ranking suggests, but they weren't that bad.

 

[KiwiHawk]

And we won how many playoff games and Super Bowls with Jackson?

Non-sequitur. The fact that we had someone to backup Wilson is not negated by the fact we didn't have to use him.

But for the record, we won 5 playoff games and a Super Bowl with Jackson backing up Wilson.

 

[chris98251]

And we won how many playoff games and Super Bowls with Jackson?

Non-sequitur. The fact that we had someone to backup Wilson is not negated by the fact we didn't have to use him.

But for the record, we won 5 playoff games and a Super Bowl with Jackson backing up Wilson.

Doesn't count, we are talking Foles and Keenum, they actually won games.

 

[adeltaY]

And we won how many playoff games and Super Bowls with Jackson?

Non-sequitur. The fact that we had someone to backup Wilson is not negated by the fact we didn't have to use him.

But for the record, we won 5 playoff games and a Super Bowl with Jackson backing up Wilson.

But he was talking about Foles, who actually started all their playoff games and obviously won them all and he's asking whether we would have had that success with TJack, which I highly doubt.

 

[SeaWolv]

My friend works with a guy who's cousin has a kid who was in the hospital in Seattle and actually met Russell when he visited one day said that Russell said he doesn't expect to be franchised and that he's going to take Tom Brady-type pay so the Hawks can sign other guys.

I know this is a joke but I'm of the opinion, from what little I know about RW, that he would most likely be the kind of team player that wouldn't require being the highest paid QB in hopes of having some talent around him that helps him win.

 

[original poster]

My friend works with a guy who's cousin has a kid who was in the hospital in Seattle and actually met Russell when he visited one day said that Russell said he doesn't expect to be franchised and that he's going to take Tom Brady-type pay so the Hawks can sign other guys.

I know this is a joke but I'm of the opinion, from what little I know about RW, that he would most likely be the kind of team player that wouldn't require being the highest paid QB in hopes of having some talent around him that helps him win.

With his aspirations to own a pro team later in life I'd say he will want every single penny he can get.

 

[chris98251]

My friend works with a guy who's cousin has a kid who was in the hospital in Seattle and actually met Russell when he visited one day said that Russell said he doesn't expect to be franchised and that he's going to take Tom Brady-type pay so the Hawks can sign other guys.

I know this is a joke but I'm of the opinion, from what little I know about RW, that he would most likely be the kind of team player that wouldn't require being the highest paid QB in hopes of having some talent around him that helps him win.

With his aspirations to own a pro team later in life I'd say he will want every single penny he can get.

Yeah that was before he married Ciara, I think he could almost afford it now at least as a partner.

 

[erik2690]

My friend works with a guy who's cousin has a kid who was in the hospital in Seattle and actually met Russell when he visited one day said that Russell said he doesn't expect to be franchised and that he's going to take Tom Brady-type pay so the Hawks can sign other guys.

I know this is a joke but I'm of the opinion, from what little I know about RW, that he would most likely be the kind of team player that wouldn't require being the highest paid QB in hopes of having some talent around him that helps him win.

With his aspirations to own a pro team later in life I'd say he will want every single penny he can get.

Yeah that was before he married Ciara, I think he could almost afford it now at least as a partner.

Um you might be confused. This is nowhere near a Brady Giselle situation. I'm not dissing Ciara she isn't desperate for money or anything but Russ just from his first big contract eclipses her likely net worth by a lot. Brady's wife is in the 500 mil / 20 mil a year type of range from what I've heard. Ciara is not a huge factor in any contract talks or money aspirations most likely.

 

[SanDiego49er]

I think you pay a QB that kind of salary if they can legitimately carry a team like Rodgers (when he is not injured), but as good as RW is...I don't think he's good enough to carry the team. I'm not saying RW isn't great, I just don't think he's the 1 of 3 QBs that can carry a team and therefore should not get paid like one. But he'll probably want that money and sadly I'd rather watch the Hawks move on and have an overall greater team than be top heavy with 1 extremely good mobile QB.

If the Eagles have shown anything with their BACKUP QB winning it all, maybe the QB position shouldn't be valued as high as it is provided the coaching and FO can get the team around him appropriate with that saved QB $.

Yes I agree with a lot of this. But....... Foles is an EXTREMELY HIGH END BACKUP. You have to remember he was at a Pro Bowl level and is 6'5" 240 lbs. with a big league arm. He was the next big thing before he dropped off and struggled. But at one time he was playing at a super high level. So maybe sitting down got him out of his bad habits, got the second guessing out of his mind and he just played ball when he got back in there. I'm just saying Foles when playing at his top level best play is far better than most backups in this league. He certainly was playing his best in the playoffs. I thought his NFC Championship game and Super Bowl he was outstanding and playing at an elite level.

With all that said I don't think Wilson is the type of guy who can put a team on his back and take them to the Super Bowl. He made Super Bowls but he had a SUPER ELITE DEFENSE backing him up and holding the other team down. Plus he had a Beast Mode RB who can carry 5 guys on his back on his way to the first down and moving the chains. Plus in those years I think his O Line was certainly much better than what he has now and his WR's were better than what he has now. The bottom line is he had lots and lots of help. He didn't do it by himself.

Brady on the other hand has literally had years where his defense is ranked like in the 20's. Plus no elite WR's other than Randy Moss. But with the exception of Moss he had a bunch of marginal guys who he made look good with his pin point accuracy. Yes he has Gronk at TE. But he didn't always have that either earlier in his career. The point is with a few exceptions his 5 - 3 (8 times in the Super Bowl) lacked very elite defenses for the most part. It also lacked very elite WR's with the exception of Moss for a while. He also NEVER had a Beast Mode RB. He kind of would drag his teams into the Super Bowl because he is that good although people don't like to admit it. But I don't see how anybody could deny it anymore at this point. I used to even deny it early in his career. It just doesn't make sense to deny it anymore. It's a lot of Brady. A huge amount of Brady is why they had that run obviously.

Brady over the last 2 contracts or so chooses to be underpaid so his team enjoys a stronger team
overall. The Patriots also got caught cheating in earlier SB years so there is that as well.
Without the lower contract Brady gets,I doubt the Pats make the SB like they have and Brady still plays today
as he probaly would have gotten injured by cheap players protecting him.

He has taken less so they can fill out their team with other talented players and depth. He has made a lot of money in his career and has endorsement money too. Plus his wife is a rich model. Together they make tons of money. So a little less is not a big deal to him. Perhaps it would be to some players. Not everybody wants to take a lot less. Especially their first time up for a real big contract which can make them set for life. Sure that has helped them a lot. Other teams and players might not have that luxury based on less endorsements and a less rich marriage partner too.

 

[original poster]

Googled it, Ciara is worth a pathetic $20M.

 

[SanDiego49er]

Googled it, Ciara is worth a pathetic $20M.

I guess that is far from nothing. But I think Tom Brady's wife is worth far more. According to Celebrity Net Worth.

Tom Brady = $180 Million.

Gisele Bundchen = $360 Million.

Total couple Net Worth = $540 Million.

They are worth more than half a Billion dollars. Obviously he doesn't need the money. So it's difficult to compare others to his situation. There really aren't many other people in his situation.

 

[chris98251]

Googled it, Ciara is worth a pathetic $20M.

Give me some of that pathetic, I am sure I could do it well.

 

[original poster]

Googled it, Ciara is worth a pathetic $20M.

Give me some of that pathetic, I am sure I could do it well.

Of course, but it's a drop in the ocean when talking about buying a team.

 

[chris98251]

Googled it, Ciara is worth a pathetic $20M.

Give me some of that pathetic, I am sure I could do it well.

Of course, but it's a drop in the ocean when talking about buying a team.

Given the price was 2.2 billion for the Panthers yes.

I think 750 was about what Paul laid down for the Seahawks.

 

[original poster]

Googled it, Ciara is worth a pathetic $20M.

Give me some of that pathetic, I am sure I could do it well.

Of course, but it's a drop in the ocean when talking about buying a team.

Given the price was 2.2 billion for the Panthers yes.

I think 750 was about what Paul laid down for the Seahawks.

I had to Google but apparently it was $194M.

 

[KitsapGuy]

He paid $194 million for the franchise and contributed an additional $130 million toward construction of a new stadium in Seattle. The team is now worth $1.25 billion, according to data compiled by Bloomberg.Jan 30, 2014

Seahawks beat Microsoft as investment for billionaire Paul Allen | The ...
https://www.seattletimes.com/.../seahaw ... onaire-p...

The 1.25 billion was in January 2014. I couldn't find any updated current numbers. But at least it gives you an idea.