Shaun Alexander: Everybody's All-American

[scutterhawk]

Sad that this became an Aexander vs Lynch thread. Lets just say Lynchis more consistant because of his tough running style, but when on Alexander could take over a game like Lynch only wished he could.

I think the individual runs like Beast Quake (and there have been several like that) do more to "take over a game" then SA have big games running through holes the size of the Holland Tunnel ever did.

Where in my post did I say he was the most gifted athlete the Seahawks ever had at RB? I didn't. And I wouldn't say that he was. I mentioned his vision.

I never said I wouldn't take Lynch over Alexander. I probably would 9 times out of 10. I never even mentioned Lynch. I'm capable of talking about one player without comparing him to everyone else.

I quoted your post simply for the comment about too bad that it will turn into SA bashing thread. I personally think SA was the most gifted athlete (combination of physical and mental ability) which is why who he was as a football player (in my opinion) was a little disappointing.

Really must have crushed you when he got over 1,600 Yards in 2004, and 1,880 yards in 2005, and all the while him wearing a -->SEAHAWKS<-- uniform.....pretty much a negative opinion for a Seahawks fan, eh?

 

[JustTheTip]

Sad that this became an Aexander vs Lynch thread. Lets just say Lynchis more consistant because of his tough running style, but when on Alexander could take over a game like Lynch only wished he could.

I think the individual runs like Beast Quake (and there have been several like that) do more to "take over a game" then SA have big games running through holes the size of the Holland Tunnel ever did.

Where in my post did I say he was the most gifted athlete the Seahawks ever had at RB? I didn't. And I wouldn't say that he was. I mentioned his vision.

I never said I wouldn't take Lynch over Alexander. I probably would 9 times out of 10. I never even mentioned Lynch. I'm capable of talking about one player without comparing him to everyone else.

I quoted your post simply for the comment about too bad that it will turn into SA bashing thread. I personally think SA was the most gifted athlete (combination of physical and mental ability) which is why who he was as a football player (in my opinion) was a little disappointing.

Really must have crushed you when he got over 1,600 Yards in 2004, and 1,880 yards in 2005, and all the while him wearing a -->SEAHAWKS<-- uniform.....pretty much a negative opinion for a Seahawks fan, eh?

While I appreciate what he did while a Seahawk, I was still often disappointed and found myself wishing we still had Ahman Green instead. Sorry if you think I undervalue SA, I think a lot of people over value him. Not only do I think he wasted a lot of his potential (in my mind for selfish reasons), but I value tough yards on plays we need more than big yards on plays we really don't.

SA was definitely great to watch at times.

 

[TorontoHawk]

I loved Shaun and his vision with the football in his hand was second to none. It's too bad this thread will turn into a "he was soft", "anyone could run behind that o-line", "he faked the concussion", bash fest of a Seahawk great.

Well you were right about that. SA was a great back. I don't get the point of comparing him to Lynch and have no idea why he gets slammed because he ran with a great o-line. So funny people on here show more love for a backup QB than an MVP.

 

[Zebulon Dak]

Here's Marshawn's numbers on 3rd & 4th and short (3 yards or less) since he came to Seattle just for reference. FWIW.

 

[Tical21]

I have never taken Shaun Alexander for granted. His production speaks for itself. Anybody that produces that much shouldn't have to fight as hard for respect as he has had to. I'll always fight for him when people say he "sucked!"

He was one of those guys that could "smell" the big play. If there wasn't anything there, he wasn't going to run out of control into a pile of defenders, which make no mistake, I absolutely love Marshawn for. However, if there was a crease, he almost never missed it. He got in there and got to the next level and often times could make the safety miss.

The only negative I will ever say about Shaun is that during his MVP year, he could have run for 2,500 yards. His combination of size and speed and vision was that unique. He was that talented, the scheme and blocking were that good. If he would have run all year like he ran near the goal line, he would be on top of a bunch of record books. Still, I'm not going to be too hard on a guy that won the MVP.

 

[MidwestHawker]

Forgot to mention "stabbed in the back"

This is definitely what I'll always associate with Shaun more than anything else.

The guy who's scored the 7th most rushing touchdowns in NFL history? We're still talking about that guy, right?

Yes.

He was obviously a good back. One need only see how much better he performed than Maurice Morris behind the same line to know that Shaun was a cut above, and not purely a product of the system.

That said, he was a hard player to ever fully embrace; both his personality and his play style were quite frustrating.

 

[MidwestHawker]

Still, I'm not going to be too hard on a guy that won the MVP.

To be fair, no running back should ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever win MVP, so I can't see much reason to consider this aspect.

 

[Zebulon Dak]

I don't care what position you play, if you score 28 TD's in a season you get to be MVP.

 

[MidwestHawker]

I don't care what position you play, if you score 28 TD's in a season you get to be MVP.

I don't think anyone's disputing what bad criteria has been set up by the voters. This post is obviously true.

 

[Zebulon Dak]

Allow me to rephrase: I believe that if you score 28 TD's in a season you deserve to be MVP.

 

[MidwestHawker]

Because you want "Most Valuable Player" to reward the gaudiest stats rather than rewarding actual value?

Seems to me like that's what the Offensive Player of the Year award is there for, but shrug.

 

[DavidSeven]

Shaun was an elite talent whose playing style was often frustrating to watch. I think that about sums it up. I don't diminish his skill level, but it did feel like he left yards on the field. His play in goal line situations suggested that he had the power and balance to get those extra yards if he wanted them. Ultimately, that may have contributed to some people's frustration over his play. The fact that his cautious style didn't seem to extend his prime by any meaningful measure or leave him available for certain meaningful games also probably didn't help.

That said, Shaun could bust a run for 20+ yards in the blink of an eye. Amazing vision and burst.

 

[Zebulon Dak]

Because you want "Most Valuable Player" to reward the gaudiest stats rather than rewarding actual value?

Seems to me like that's what the Offensive Player of the Year award is there for, but shrug.

I don't think I'd consider Shaun's 28 touchdowns gaudy. 5000 yards throwing on a 8-8 team? Sure. But not the rushing title and an NFL record amount of TD's on a Super Bowl run.

I understand that the V in MVP stands for valuable, but I don't think that should be taken so literally. I think Most Outstanding Player would be more accurate to the actual award, but that's just not what they call it.

 

[warden]

The MVP award is a stupid award, if you are not a QB or RB you have no chance of winning it. It is stat based not MVP based.

 

[Zebulon Dak]

Right. At least we know how to stay on topic. Good talk.

 

[Chapow]

4 of the top 6 playoff games by a running back for the Seahawks are held by Lynch.

When the going gets tough the tough get going. You just can rely on Lynch

Exactly...Also funny....Wilson only needs 1 more postseason win and he will have the same ammount Hasselbeck did in his ENTIRE CAREER

And Wilson has the luxury of QBing a team with one of the best defenses in NFL history.

I wonder how Hasselbeck would have done with the same luxury?

QB wins is pretty much the dumbest stat ever.

 

[Anthony!]

4 of the top 6 playoff games by a running back for the Seahawks are held by Lynch.

When the going gets tough the tough get going. You just can rely on Lynch

Exactly...Also funny....Wilson only needs 1 more postseason win and he will have the same ammount Hasselbeck did in his ENTIRE CAREER

And Wilson has the luxury of QBing a team with one of the best defenses in NFL history.

I wonder how Hasselbeck would have done with the same luxury?

QB wins is pretty much the dumbest stat ever.

Sounds to me like any every stat is the dumbest stat ever, especially when it does not say what you want it to.

The reality is there is no real way to compare Alexander to Lynch, or Rw to Hass. The are different players, different styles, different eras. While one would assume Lynch would do great behind the 05 o-lien we really do not know, often those o-lines did not open the hole were the play was called but they knew if they opened anything Alexander would find it, Lynch does not have that vision or burst. The same way Alexanders non physical style would not work well with todays o-line and style which is all about power. As to Rw and Hass, yes Rw is playing on a team with a better defense, but Hass was playing on a team with a much much better pass blocking o-line. Hass on this team would get killed. During Rws career here so far our o-lien was never ranked higher than 20th in pass blocking, Hass has never had any season as good as Rws, and in all but 2 season played behind o-lines ranked 15th or higher in pass blocking. In fact in Hass best season 05, he had the 13 ranked pass blocking o-line, while for RWs best season he had the 32nd. Imagine Rw with a top 15 pass blocking o-line instead of dead last.

 

[HawkWow]

I'll just say this, SA is one of the reasons I love Lynch so much!

Yep.

 

[HawkWow]

Shaun was an elite talent whose playing style was often frustrating to watch. I think that about sums it up. I don't diminish his skill level, but it did feel like he left yards on the field. His play in goal line situations suggested that he had the power and balance to get those extra yards if he wanted them. Ultimately, that may have contributed to some people's frustration over his play. The fact that his cautious style didn't seem to extend his prime by any meaningful measure or leave him available for certain meaningful games also probably didn't help.

That said, Shaun could bust a run for 20+ yards in the blink of an eye. Amazing vision and burst.

Yep.

 

[seahawk2k]

It wasn't entirely Shaun Alexander's fault that I didn't totally embrace him. He took the spot of one of my favourite players in Ricky Watters. Watters was a great pass blocker, a tough runner and an excellent receiver. It rubbed me the wrong way how the fans, in love with Alexander, cheered when Watters broke his ankle against Dallas.

I didn't like how he short armed passes, ducked blitzers, or went down so easy. I hated how he suddenly became a physical running back in the red zone and then would fall down without contact the very next series.

However, he was damn entertaining and damn exciting. I was there for his 266 yard game, and his 5 touchdown game. He was one of the best running backs I"ve ever seen at finding the cutback lane and exploding through it. The vision was incredible.

He got a lot of crap, and justifiably so, for playing soft. People love to talk about how he stopped playing hard after he got paid. That's utter bs. He broke his foot in 2006. He tried to play through it, missed some time, and then came back before it healed. His first game back, noticeably hobbling, he runs for 200 yards in the snow against Green Bay. My fondest memory of him was the 2006 playoff game. His foot was still damaged, that o line could run block much at all, the bears had a great front seven, and he was outstanding. He was nowhere close to full strength, on the road, in the cold, beaten up, and kicking ass. For that, I will always respect him.