Tony Stewart hits and kills another driver

[SonicHawk]

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/tracks-change-rules-wards-death-195707264--spt.html

Thanks for the link with no context or opinion or anything. Are you making an argument or just sharing some somewhat-related information?

Ward getting out of his car and whether that was dumb, illegal or anything else has absolutely no bearing on the case against Stewart.

 

[TXHawk]

But you are correct that he should be charged with involuntary manslaughter.

Based on what evidence? A prosecutor can't just bring charges against someone without evidence. There was none on that video. There has to be proof that Stewart acted recklessly or with criminal negligence to bring a charge of involuntary manslaughter. Since it's impossible to know from that video how soon Stewart saw Ward or what actions he took prior to striking him there is no real case against him unless there is evidence from some other source. The only indisputable evidence of reckless or negligent behavior on that video was by Ward.

 

[SonicHawk]

But you are correct that he should be charged with involuntary manslaughter.

Based on what evidence? A prosecutor can't just bring charges against someone without evidence. There was none on that video. There has to be proof that Stewart acted recklessly or with criminal negligence to bring a charge of involuntary manslaughter. Since it's impossible to know from that video how soon Stewart saw Ward or what actions he took prior to striking him there is no real case against him unless there is evidence from some other source. The only indisputable evidence of reckless or negligent behavior on that video was by Ward.

You do realize that this single video isn't the only evidence available to authorities?

You're right, you can't convict anyone with just that video. Anyone suggesting that is wrong. But that video isn't going to be the only evidence (if there is more suggesting Stewart was in the wrong).

 

[UK_Seahawk]

The only thing I'm certain of is that if the kid stays in his vehicle, he see's the next day.

 

[HansGruber]

If someone at a McDonalds can sue and win over spilling hot coffee on themselves anything is possible.

However, and this has been pointed out many times. Ward was on the track. He was on the track in violation of sanctioning rules. He did so on his own accord. Even without all the other mitigating circumstances, this simply is not a criminal case, and I would go so far as to say they don't have a chance in civil court either.

You should read the actual details of that case. It's not that simple.

McDonald's was brewing and storing their coffee at 140+ degrees Fahrenheit, so that it could sit on a counter while food is prepared and not be too cold to serve. That temperature is so high that it causes instant scalding upon contact with skin, badly enough to cause instant second degree burns.

Regulatory codes in most districts throughout America require that fluids be heated or stored no higher than 120-125 deg F, which is still very hot but doesn't cause instantaneous scalding. Check the water heater at your house. If you live in WA, code requires that your plumber install and set the heater no higher than 120. This is to prevent scalding accidents.

When I was in residency, we saw a couple small children admitted to the burn unit with serious life threatening 3rd degree burns because their father had installed his own water heater and manually set the temperature too high. How do I know this? Because I overheard the firefighter talking about this very topic and he explained that all water heaters are required by federal regulation to be shipped with the thermostat no higher than 120.

 

[SonicHawk]

I'm pretty sure the Judge only awarded like $600k too. Which is a lot for what amounts to selling too hot of water, but companies don't learn unless you hit them in the checkbook.

 

[SonicHawk]

The only thing I'm certain of is that if the kid stays in his vehicle, he see's the next day.

Probably, that doesn't have anything to do with the discussion though.

 

[Largent80]

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/tracks-change-rules-wards-death-195707264--spt.html

Thanks for the link with no context or opinion or anything. Are you making an argument or just sharing some somewhat-related information?

Ward getting out of his car and whether that was dumb, illegal or anything else has absolutely no bearing on the case against Stewart.

I simply read the story, copied the link and posted it. As was mentioned by the drivers, it would be hard to enforce it in Nascar simply because of the sizes of the tracks. NHRA has the best safety crews in the racing world, however, it is a lot easier to get to a car/driver in distress on a 1/4 mile raceway.

There is no case against Stewart the last time I checked, so I think this topic has run it's course.

 

[Scottemojo]

It's racing. Machismo and adrenaline are tough to just turn off in a split second. Ward was an idiot who helped create the circumstances of his own demise. Few deserve to die, yet all do, and punishing idiocy on the track, field, diamond, or rink seems to be one of the more slippery slopes there is in jurisprudence.

If no charges are ever filed, but a wrongful death suit costs Tony millions, will justice be served?

That is absolutely ridiculous. You excuse Stewart's actions for machismo and adrenaline but fault Ward for doing the same thing?

This discussion is pathetic, too many people excusing Stewart because he was on a playing field. The playing field isn't anarchy. It's not a law-free sanctuary. Negligent actions that directly lead to the death of another competitor should be investigated, charged and if proven, justify a prison sentence.

Of course not. I also don't think it's right to make one guy accountable for what two people made happen, especially when evil intent can't be proven. A pitcher buzzing a guy after a homerun can go equally wrong. Somebody charging the mound after being buzzed is very much a broken statute. Do you want assault charges filed each time it happens? Should Suh have faced assault charges for stomping on Deitrich Smith?

 

[SonicHawk]

We're talking about an extreme case in which someone is dead.

And yes, players have been charged with assault for charging the mound. All sports have had extreme cases in which the police have become involved. This would set no precedent.

I don't care to answer your question about Suh because it's irrelevant in this case. This is not a slippery slope discussion.

 

[Scottemojo]

We're talking about an extreme case in which someone is dead.

And yes, players have been charged with assault for charging the mound. All sports have had extreme cases in which the police have become involved. This would set no precedent.

I don't care to answer your question about Suh because it's irrelevant in this case. This is not a slippery slope discussion.

Like I thought. You are outraged at the result.

Brian Blades dinked around with a gun and killed his cousin. Should he have gone to prison?

 

[bigtrain21]

Everyone who has responded with 'you are rushing to judgement' has rushed to releasing Stewart from any fault.

I don't think you get it. Rushing to judgement applies to both sides. I am not rushing to judgement that he is guilty just like I am not rushing to judgement that he is not guilty. We don't know at this point. Hopefully we find out what his intentions were.

 

[bigtrain21]

Let me say this slowly...

you... have... no... idea... what... you... are... talking... about.

No one has rushed to judgement, there is a short video seen from a distance, normal humans tend to look at evidence and then build upon that the best they can. Only an idiot would have trouble seeing that there's a chance (no matter how great) that Stewart put himself in a poor position intentionally.

I think you have reading comprehension issues. There is definitely a chance he put himself in a poor position intentionally. I have not made a single post where I said Stewart is innocent or guilty because at this point we do not know.

 

[SonicHawk]

We're talking about an extreme case in which someone is dead.

And yes, players have been charged with assault for charging the mound. All sports have had extreme cases in which the police have become involved. This would set no precedent.

I don't care to answer your question about Suh because it's irrelevant in this case. This is not a slippery slope discussion.

Like I thought. You are outraged at the result.

Brian Blades dinked around with a gun and killed his cousin. Should he have gone to prison?

You continue to paint me as emotional, which I'm not. A man died and it is only fair to investigate. I have yet to suggest Stewart should be convicted of anything.

 

[fenderbender123]

Here's a thought...

If Tony Stewart is a hot head based on prior incidents in his racing career, then that means Kevin is even more of a hothead based on his actions in comparison with Tony's previous actions (Tony never did anything as impulsive as what Kevin did)...so if hotheadedness caused death, and in this case the hotheadedness caused the death of a person who is even more hotheaded, then might this have prevented a future death or two from Kevin's hotheadedness?


I know...I know....that's not how this shit works. It's just a thought...so relax.

 

[-The Glove-]

The biggest thing that leads me to believe Stewart had no intent to scare the guy or kick up dirt at him was what #45 said. TS looks to be right behind him following the same line. If #45 saw him at the last second, how much time does TS have to react. Also from the video, I see his tail whipping to the left...obviously too late

 

[Jville]

They buried Kevin Ward Jr today.



"Praise for 'small-town boy' hit by Stewart's car" >>> [urltargetblank]http://newsok.com/funeral-set-for-driver-hit-by-tony-stewarts-car/article/feed/722689[/urltargetblank]

Services held for Kevin Ward Jr.[urltargetblank]http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/services-held-kevin-ward-jr/story?id=24982719[/urltargetblank]

Kevin Ward’s father rips Tony Stewart for dirt-track accident that killed his son

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nationa ... z3AQfYpV38

‘Why he had to go up as high as he did and hog my son, there’s no reason for it,’ said Kevin Ward Sr. ‘Apparently, Tony Stewart was the only one driving out there who didn't see him.’

 

[TXHawk]

We're talking about an extreme case in which someone is dead.

And yes, players have been charged with assault for charging the mound. All sports have had extreme cases in which the police have become involved. This would set no precedent.

I don't care to answer your question about Suh because it's irrelevant in this case. This is not a slippery slope discussion.

Like I thought. You are outraged at the result.

Brian Blades dinked around with a gun and killed his cousin. Should he have gone to prison?

You continue to paint me as emotional, which I'm not. A man died and it is only fair to investigate. I have yet to suggest Stewart should be convicted of anything.

No, but you've said he should be charged but not convicted and that's just as bad. A person should only be charged with a crime if a preponderance of evidence indicates guilt. You've provided no evidence of why Stewart should be charged other than guesswork at his state of mind yet you want it done anyway. You say that authorities are are looking at other evidence, and I'm sure they are, but you've seen none yet other than the video and you are still calling for him to be charged with a crime. That's pretty much the definition of a rush to judgement.

 

[TXHawk]

The biggest thing that leads me to believe Stewart had no intent to scare the guy or kick up dirt at him was what #45 said. TS looks to be right behind him following the same line. If #45 saw him at the last second, how much time does TS have to react. Also from the video, I see his tail whipping to the left...obviously too late

True, but Stewart's car was actually several feet higher on the track than the 45 car providing even less room to avoid Ward.

Ward also obviously mistook the 45 car for Tony Stewart's car even though they are different colors (blue and white vs black and white). He started walking towards it and pointing before apparently realizing his mistake as it went by. This to me is further evidence of poor visibility with the dim lighting in that corner of the track with the dirt kicked up in the air and coating visors. In fact he wasn't even pointing at Stewart's car when he was hit. By the time that the 45 car had passed and Stewart's car appeared it looked like Ward realized he was in Stewart's path and was bracing himself to jump backwards. The reason that Ward had come so far down the track was because he was going after the wrong car which was running lower on the track than Stewart's.

 

[Anonymous]

This is a real chicken-or-the-egg situation, and one that involves so many physical and mental aspects. The key missing ingredient is not knowing what Stewart actually saw happening; an ingredient we will never have.

This is another one of those times when you wish we had the technology to tap in and replay what Stewart's eyes saw on a about a 40-inch HD monitor. Tech like that would change a lot about pretty much, well, everything.

"Fringe" on Fox, wasn't it?