Were 3-0 but Flowers and Griffin are just awful .

[Northwest Seahawk]

These guys really need to tighten up there coverage the amount of huge plays there giving up is horrid. Our pass rush isn't great but our Corners are just about the worst in the league right now. Flowers needs to be cut and replaced if he keeps playing like that the next two games.

Griffin needs replaced to but were stuck with him this year so hopefully the man turns it around this is not fun to watch it's almost comical how bad there playing.I don't enjoy coming in here and writing this stuff but this has been going on for long enough that something has to be said.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Only half right. Flowers is worse than Awful

Griffin looks like a #2 corner overall, at least so far. But, he did make a HUGE play that led to a TD, so...…...

 

[Shanegotyou11]

Meh.

 

[Elemas]

Griffin has a lot of trouble with slants. I haven't quite found the confidence in the D on __x__ & long downs just yet.

Ultimately, I think the DBs will turn up.

 

[Mick063]

Griffin and Amadi playing well.

 

[TwistedHusky]

Tre Flowers is a converted safety.

He has never been great. But never been this terrible. A handsy, overly physical converted corner that tended to draw penalties. But not outright a complete liability. This kind of struggle is new, even for him.

Griffin was decent, though a bit inconsistent. He was never as good as some seemed to believe, but again not horrific.

When everyone starts looking terrible at the same time, it usually has a root cause.



There is something horrific about how this secondary is playing now. It isn't all injuries to blame.

When the NFL started, it looked like defenses were behind. Roughly to the tune of about 10 pts and 75 yds passing extra per game. Change the #s and suddenly scores start to look a bit more familiar. But even with the points/yards inflation taken into account - this is a substandard defense.

And as some have wisely pointed out, our defense is getting worse each year.

 

[oldhawkfan]

Tre Flowers is a converted safety.

He has never been great. But never been this terrible. A handsy, overly physical converted corner that tended to draw penalties. But not outright a complete liability. This kind of struggle is new, even for him.

Griffin was decent, though a bit inconsistent. He was never as good as some seemed to believe, but again not horrific.

When everyone starts looking terrible at the same time, it usually has a root cause.



There is something horrific about how this secondary is playing now. It isn't all injuries to blame.

When the NFL started, it looked like defenses were behind. Roughly to the tune of about 10 pts and 75 yds passing extra per game. Change the #s and suddenly scores start to look a bit more familiar. But even with the points/yards inflation taken into account - this is a substandard defense.

And as some have wisely pointed out, our defense is getting worse each year.

Agree with this. What has me perplexed is that historically, defenses have always been ahead of offenses to start a season. Offense by nature, needs a little time to develop cohesiveness and timing. Defense needs to react. That is why the defenses are usually ahead early in the season.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Tre Flowers is a converted safety.

He has never been great. But never been this terrible. A handsy, overly physical converted corner that tended to draw penalties. But not outright a complete liability. This kind of struggle is new, even for him. .

Flowers was terrible almost the entire 2nd half of last year, and especially in the playoff game against GB where Adams and Rodgers abused him like a $5 hooker........and I imagine DIRECTLY led to Pete and John scouring NFL rosters trying to find his replacement, and eventually trading for Dunbar.

If we had any depth at all at CB Flowers would be cut. But we don't, so here we are. Year #1 is where you forgive bad play for things like "he's a converted safety" or "he's a rookie."

After that, no excuses.

 

[chris98251]

Best thing that could happen, Dallas fires Richard, Atlanta fires Quinn, we move Norton to LB coach, hire Quinn as DC and Hire Richard as DB coach.

Ok not going to happen.

But that's what we have lost when we were a very good defense.

 

[Teahawks]

I'm sure there's a reason, but I don't like a tall guy like Flowers playing 8 yards off. That's like an instant 10 yard slant completion every time. I feel that a guy that physical should jam at the line?

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Heck, with Blair hurt why not convert Flowers back to safety. He's taller and heavier than Blair.

Not sure if I can watch more games with him at CB.

 

[rcaido]

Looking at the schedule, i dont really see any real QB/receiver threats...I think we will be fine until we hit the playoffs and we will be expose again like last year against Greenbay.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

SO much cushion from Flowers. One of their 3rd down conversions, he was playing 7 or 8 yards off. What the hell?

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Looking at the schedule, i dont really see any real QB/receiver threats...I think we will be fine until we hit the playoffs and we will be expose again like last year against Greenbay.

If average throwing QB's like Prescott and Newton can throw for 400+ yards, you can bet Fitzpatrick, Goff, Garroppolo, Cousins and Murray can go off on our bad defense too.

They all have good to great WR corps. Or in the Niners case, will when we play them.

Again, it all goes back to Russell. This year more than ever we will live or die off of whether he can maintain this insanely high level of play. So far so good.

 

[rcaido]

Looking at the schedule, i dont really see any real QB/receiver threats...I think we will be fine until we hit the playoffs and we will be expose again like last year against Greenbay.

If average throwing QB's like Prescott and Newton can throw for 400+ yards, you can bet Fitzpatrick, Goff, Garroppolo, Cousins and Murray can go off on our bad defense too.

They all have good to great WR corps. Or in the Niners case, will when we play them.

Again, it all goes back to Russell. This year more than ever we will live or die off of whether he can maintain this insanely high level of play. So far so good.

Crappollo & Fitz i wouldn't worry about. I think only Goff if he has time & Cousins if isn't gunshy. That's only 2-3 games, the rest of the season should be fine until the playoffs.

As long as we have a healthy running back & Wilson doing his MVP level, we should win all the shootouts in the NFC.

Obviously i think we should try to sign a pass rusher or trade for one. Maybe play Hollister more then trade him.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

. I think only Goff if he has time

They've all had time. Lots and lots and lots of time.

Goff destroys us, because Pete refuses to change how he scheme's Goff, which results in us making Goff look like Joe Montana twice a year.

Either way, we're saying the same thing.............it's on Russell. I don't see this defense getting much better, and if the injuries continue, it'll get worse.

 

[Polk738]

Flowers seems to prove game after game why he is a backup, I can't even begin to fathom how you have an INT bounce right off your chest and you still manage to kick the ball up into the receivers arms for a 16 yard gain.

It's amazing what Griffin can do when he applies a little bit of aggression to his game, he actually undercut a route an got an INT instead of playing such soft coverage, great! it's just too bad he can't apply it for more than one play.

 

[Fade]

What I don't understand is why draft big, physical, long corners, only to have them play off coverage? If you draft press corners, you might want to press them. The results couldn't be any worse than they are now.

 

[Grahamhawker]

What I don't understand is why draft big, physical, long corners, only to have them play off coverage? If you draft press corners, you might want to press them. The results couldn't be any worse than they are now.

Sherman was good at it. Is Pete trying to replicate his impacts? I see few or none of the prerequisite skills in Flowers, fwiw.

 

[TwistedHusky]

Exactly right on the press corner suggestion.

Flowers should be used like a crappier Browner.

I would like to see him play as a press corner, if you cannot cover AT LEAST disrupt the timing on the routes. Get physical, even if you draw a flag or two. The net result is still better than our current defense.

Now, if Flowers is not being used that way - is that his fault? He might get burned? Well they get burned now anyway.

Our whole coaching philosophy of trying to force a system on the players instead of building a system that works with the players we have is and always has been the problem. It works in the regular season (somewhat).

But it falls flat in the playoffs. We aren't going to magically replace guys wholesale with guys off the street. So we either need to get new coaches on defense or learn to use the guys we have in the ways that produce the best results considering their strengths/weaknesses.

Carroll is the anti-Bill in that, but Norton using guys to play to their weaknesses instead of strengths is not helping.

We either figure out how to use what we have or we can watch us squander opportunities. Dunbar hasn't looked that great either. He looked fine before he got here. Wonder what changed?