Why I am disappointed in Russell Wilson?

StoneCold

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rideaducati":3ldnshma said:
StoneCold":3ldnshma said:
rideaducati":3ldnshma said:
And you assume Schneider has low-balled Russell. From reports, the Seahawks have offered to make him the third highest paid QB in the league and since Russell has not signed a contract, I believe it is safe to "assume" that Russell is asking for the moon. I consider asking for the moon to be Russell wanting to be paid the highest contract for QBs because he isn't the best QB in the league.

For what it's worth, I think Russell signs an extension before training camp ends for around $22 million/year.

I make no such assumption. Until we have actual numbers, not so and so says that so and so say that so and so says, I choose not to demonize either side. My thought is they are all reasonable, good people working out a contract. No one is letting anyone down.

SC

So, because YOU choose to abstain from forming your opinion, we should all do the same...got it. That would make just about every subject discussed here very boring though.

I guess your Seahawk season projection is out of the question because you're going to wait for all the numbers to come in, right?

Give it a break, some of us form opinions that have the ability to change once there is more information available. Russell's contract talks have offered us little, but there is SOME information and it makes for better discussion than waiting for the contract to get done. It's a long offseason and actually having something to talk about makes the days go by faster.

Being wrong won't hurt you, it's the internet.

By all means, carry on with the make believe discussion.

SC
 

Hawkpower

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StoneCold":2oq88c64 said:
rideaducati":2oq88c64 said:
StoneCold":2oq88c64 said:
Hawkpower":2oq88c64 said:
Am I making assumptions? I suppose one could say so.

However, considering the actions thus far, sure seems as if my assumptions are correct.

If I am wrong, why hasn't he signed yet? Doesn't seem like all that far of a stretch to assume he is asking for the moon.

You assume the Hawks have made a reasonable offer. You assume he's asking for the moon.

It is possible he is not asking for the moon, simply more than what the Hawks have offered.

Russell is being made out to be the boogie man, turn coat that is trying to destroy the Hawks for his own personal gain. To do that you need to make a bunch of assumptions.

SC

And you assume Schneider has low-balled Russell. From reports, the Seahawks have offered to make him the third highest paid QB in the league and since Russell has not signed a contract, I believe it is safe to "assume" that Russell is asking for the moon. I consider asking for the moon to be Russell wanting to be paid the highest contract for QBs because he isn't the best QB in the league.

For what it's worth, I think Russell signs an extension before training camp ends for around $22 million/year.

I make no such assumption. Until we have actual numbers, not so and so says that so and so say that so and so says, I choose not to demonize either side. My thought is they are all reasonable, good people working out a contract. No one is letting anyone down.

SC


I can understand not wanting to demonize either side. We all love the front office, and RW is our QB.

But what do you think the hold up is, you know, if you were to make an educated guess with the information at hand?

I only ask because you seem to bristle at the thought that RW may be the one holding it up. You think its Pete and JS?
 

StoneCold

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Hawkpower":3lejoyoi said:
I can understand not wanting to demonize either side. We all love the front office, and RW is our QB.

But what do you think the hold up is, you know, if you were to make an educated guess with the information at hand?

I only ask because you seem to bristle at the thought that RW may be the one holding it up. You think its Pete and JS?

I don't know what the hold up is and I'm happy to wait and not speculate. Especially when that speculation goes to impugn someone's character. That's what I bristle at.

SC
 

Hawkpower

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StoneCold":227ljlli said:
Hawkpower":227ljlli said:
I can understand not wanting to demonize either side. We all love the front office, and RW is our QB.

But what do you think the hold up is, you know, if you were to make an educated guess with the information at hand?

I only ask because you seem to bristle at the thought that RW may be the one holding it up. You think its Pete and JS?

I don't know what the hold up is and I'm happy to wait and not speculate. Especially when that speculation goes to impugn someone's character. That's what I bristle at.

SC


Well that certainly is admirable.

I for one enjoy seeing that some hawk fans are capable of being critical of RW. It adds some balance and interesting discussion here, and lets be fair, RW has gotten more than his fair share of over the top love and anointed sainthood from hawk fans, based primarily on media reports.

Now that the media hints that he may be making questionable choices, we are to wait and not judge. Interesting double standard.

Besides, hes a big boy. I am quite sure he can handle the audacity of some guy claiming he is disappointed in his handling of the contract thus far :) Impugned and all lol.
 

PlinytheCenter

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His schtick is getting a little old. God "spoke" to him after the SB INT? I love the kid; he's been, well, a godsend to Seahawk football. But let's keep it real here. Did God tell him he wanted him to be the highest paid QB in history too?
 

Seahwkgal

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PlinytheCenter":21fwvbtp said:
His schtick is getting a little old. God "spoke" to him after the SB INT? I love the kid; he's been, well, a godsend to Seahawk football. But let's keep it real here. Did God tell him he wanted him to be the highest paid QB in history too?
His agent told him that.
 

Hawkfan77

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KiwiHawk":13sc7j23 said:
Hawkfan77":13sc7j23 said:
SeaToTheHawks":13sc7j23 said:
Literally one of the worst posts I've ever read.
I second that
That's cool that you guys are still in the place where Wilson is an awesome genuine guy who does no wrong. At times I wish I was still there. I'm just not anymore.
Nice extreme :roll:
 

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StoneCold":h4qo6xxy said:
Hawkpower":h4qo6xxy said:
I can understand not wanting to demonize either side. We all love the front office, and RW is our QB.

But what do you think the hold up is, you know, if you were to make an educated guess with the information at hand?

I only ask because you seem to bristle at the thought that RW may be the one holding it up. You think its Pete and JS?

I don't know what the hold up is and I'm happy to wait and not speculate. Especially when that speculation goes to impugn someone's character. That's what I bristle at.

SC

There are impugners on this board? Yeegads! Off with their heads!! :les:
 

AVL

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Unrealistic expectations almost always lead to disappointment.

This feeling is on you, no one else.
 

StoneCold

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LymonHawk":3bp18rnu said:
StoneCold":3bp18rnu said:
Hawkpower":3bp18rnu said:
I can understand not wanting to demonize either side. We all love the front office, and RW is our QB.

But what do you think the hold up is, you know, if you were to make an educated guess with the information at hand?

I only ask because you seem to bristle at the thought that RW may be the one holding it up. You think its Pete and JS?

I don't know what the hold up is and I'm happy to wait and not speculate. Especially when that speculation goes to impugn someone's character. That's what I bristle at.

SC

There are impugners on this board? Yeegads! Off with their heads!! :les:

Yes! Impugners in our midst! Get a torch and some rakes and an axe or two. :)

SC
 

Hawkpower

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AVL":zgdsed9m said:
Unrealistic expectations almost always lead to disappointment.

This feeling is on you, no one else.



Why do you suppose some fans had unrealistic expectations?
 

dutchman063

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Hawkfan77":k7jzay7u said:
SeaToTheHawks":k7jzay7u said:
KiwiHawk":k7jzay7u said:
kannankeril":k7jzay7u said:
The recent contract talks have caused most of us a good deal of angst and I found myself unconsciously blaming RW. As I listened to the arguments from the "pay-the-guy-whatever-it takes" camp, I found myself questioning my POV. I began to realize that I should not really care about the process/outcome of the contract negotiations so much as feel disappointment at the erosion of the image I had built of a larger than life persona.

The only person to blame here is me since the mental image was my construction, what I hoped it would be. RW did not explicitly claim that self-image. The key here is explicitly.

There was and still is an implication that RW is a team-first guy. From his cultivated demeanor on camera, the organized team practices in Hawaii, to his visits to children's hospitals and more importantly - his signature sign-off post interview line "Go Hawks". They all bespoke what "most of us assumed" to be a team guy. That assumption is contrary to the reported contract demands from his agent. The switch-over to a "me-first", I get sole credit for wins argument eroded the team-first image. Recent statements by both player and agent seem to confirm that this line of argument originates from them.

RW has to know the impact of his contract on the ability of this team to sustain success in future. He also has to know that this is a team (owner, GM & coach) that will spend all it can to ensure continued success - this is not the Cincinnati Bengals or the Pittsburgh Pirates. Assuming these statements, I cannot but feel disappointment that he does not feel the need to share that burden/further that goal.

RW has the right to extract every dollar that he can sell this or any other team on. That said, would I feel cynical the next time he says "Go Hawks", you betcha!

Good post, and I was in the same place a while back. Big fan of RW, steadfast in my support even though a part of me recognised he had some struggles. Then a report (correct or otherwise) came out saying he wanted to be the highest paid QB in the NFL, which made me think of Baltimore and Flacco and how they had to pay him top QB money even though he's nowhere near the top QB in the NFL in my opinion.

So I thought of that in terms of Wilson, and I don't believe that Wilson is the top QB in the NFL, either. In fact, over the past year he has raised several questions that I'm really needing to see answers to this year:

1: Is he a pit bull or a golden retriever? Loyal to his team, or is his loyalty transferable to whoever has the food (money)?

2: How unsettled is his private life? After the divorce, he's been hanging out with his entourage and celebs and is now dating a minor celebrity, placing himself squarely in that ring. How many distractions come with that?

3: Slow starts. Is this a correctable issue? Because if anything it seems to be getting worse.

4: Game-winning drives. Relates to slow starts in that he digs himself a huge hole to come back from, then gets praise for coming back from it. How about we just thrash the hell out of some teams and win comfortably?

5: Has he plateaued? His thing seems to be to hold the ball until all the routes break down then play sandlot ball until he finds an open guy. Can he improve on his read times and hit receivers on their routes? Or is this just his thing, and as good as its going to get?

6: Is Wilson genuine? The receivers like Baldwin and Kearse seem like a tight group, but are rarely associated with Wilson outside of game time. Is there chemistry there or do the "real" guys like Baldwin not relate to the cliches. Do they see a real person or a pretender? Do they buy in to his shtick?

7: The dude is hearing voices. Says it's god telling him the interception was His will, says it's god telling him to be celibate with his model GF. Look, people can have their religion and it doesn't bother me, but literally hearing voices? That's going off the deep end a bit.


My "faith" in Wilson is severely shaken compared to what it once was. I still recognise him as a talent, but am no longer defensive of his flaws. Where once I would have blamed some starts on Bevell or scripted plays or whatnot, I now see it as a flaw in Wilson's game. Where once I would have excused the SB interception, I now believe he wanted to win the game as an ego thing and forced a pass that wasn't on. And what I used to see as using cliches as a defense mechanism that allowed him to be more confident to the media, I now see as a cheap plastic veneer and wonder how deep the person is inside.


Literally one of the worst posts I've ever read.
I second that

Why? alot of what he posted was the hard truth.. and 'truth hurts' applys in this caase
 

Hawkfan77

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Hawkpower":24q7qik2 said:
AVL":24q7qik2 said:
Unrealistic expectations almost always lead to disappointment.

This feeling is on you, no one else.



Why do you suppose some fans had unrealistic expectations?
Because some here thought he should do what no player on the roster has yet to do and take a large discount...to the tune of 15 mil per year
 

Hawkfan77

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dutchman063":cgycowom said:
Hawkfan77":cgycowom said:
SeaToTheHawks":cgycowom said:
Literally one of the worst posts I've ever read.
I second that

Why? alot of what he posted was the hard truth.. and 'truth hurts' applys in this caase
The hard truth is Wilson is no longer a "team guy" because he didn't take a discount? Really? So if that's the case, then the "hard truth" is that there are no team guys on the entire roster
 

SeaToTheHawks

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dutchman063":2fq8weqt said:
SeaToTheHawks":2fq8weqt said:
KiwiHawk":2fq8weqt said:
kannankeril":2fq8weqt said:
The recent contract talks have caused most of us a good deal of angst and I found myself unconsciously blaming RW. As I listened to the arguments from the "pay-the-guy-whatever-it takes" camp, I found myself questioning my POV. I began to realize that I should not really care about the process/outcome of the contract negotiations so much as feel disappointment at the erosion of the image I had built of a larger than life persona.

The only person to blame here is me since the mental image was my construction, what I hoped it would be. RW did not explicitly claim that self-image. The key here is explicitly.

There was and still is an implication that RW is a team-first guy. From his cultivated demeanor on camera, the organized team practices in Hawaii, to his visits to children's hospitals and more importantly - his signature sign-off post interview line "Go Hawks". They all bespoke what "most of us assumed" to be a team guy. That assumption is contrary to the reported contract demands from his agent. The switch-over to a "me-first", I get sole credit for wins argument eroded the team-first imageWhen in the heck has he EVER taken sole credit for wins?? He ALWAYS gives credit to his receivers and Marshawn.. Recent statements by both player and agent seem to confirm that this line of argument originates from them.

RW has to know the impact of his contract on the ability of this team to sustain success in future. He also has to know that this is a team (owner, GM & coach) that will spend all it can to ensure continued success - this is not the Cincinnati Bengals or the Pittsburgh Pirates. Assuming these statements, I cannot but feel disappointment that he does not feel the need to share that burden/further that goal.

RW has the right to extract every dollar that he can sell this or any other team on. That said, would I feel cynical the next time he says "Go Hawks", you betcha!

Good post, and I was in the same place a while back. Big fan of RW, steadfast in my support even though a part of me recognised he had some struggles. Then a report (correct or otherwiseSo you don't even know if the reports are true, yet you are willing to question his character?) came out saying he wanted to be the highest paid QB in the NFL, which made me think of Baltimore and Flacco and how they had to pay him top QB money even though he's nowhere near the top QB in the NFL in my opinion.

So I thought of that in terms of Wilson, and I don't believe that Wilson is the top QB in the NFL, either. In fact, over the past year he has raised several questions that I'm really needing to see answers to this year:

1: Is he a pit bull or a golden retriever? Loyal to his team, or is his loyalty transferable to whoever has the food (money)?

He has been nothing BUT loyal to this team. He has done nothing that would indicate he isn't going to be loyal. He is playing out a contract that is well below what he deserves.

2: How unsettled is his private life? After the divorce, he's been hanging out with his entourage and celebs and is now dating a minor celebrity, placing himself squarely in that ring. How many distractions come with that?

How the heck is it your business who he dates, and that she's a minor celebrity? Who cares who the heck he hangs out with, that's his business. You are purely speculating on what "distractions" may occur. If he can play in a Super Bowl with a divorce looming, I think he'll be fine.

3: Slow starts. Is this a correctable issue? Because if anything it seems to be getting worse.

He's never asked to get out to a fast start. As a team we always come out and establish the run game. Slow starts aren't necessarily his fault.

4: Game-winning drives. Relates to slow starts in that he digs himself a huge hole to come back from, then gets praise for coming back from it. How about we just thrash the hell out of some teams and win comfortably?

Again, slow starts aren't necessarily his fault. But guess what, he has been the definition of clutch when it has mattered. HE doesn't typically dig himself into a hole. You are putting way too much credence into one game (the NFC Championship). Yes that was mainly his fault, but those games are FAR and FEW between.

5: Has he plateaued? His thing seems to be to hold the ball until all the routes break down then play sandlot ball until he finds an open guy. Can he improve on his read times and hit receivers on their routes? Or is this just his thing, and as good as its going to get?

He was a 3rd year QB last year, of course he still has lots of room for growth. 5th, 6th, and 7th year guys still do. But guess what, he's had the most successful first 3 years of a QB of all time.....I think he'll be fine and hasn't "plateaued"

6: Is Wilson genuine? The receivers like Baldwin and Kearse seem like a tight group, but are rarely associated with Wilson outside of game time. Is there chemistry there or do the "real" guys like Baldwin not relate to the cliches. Do they see a real person or a pretender? Do they buy in to his shtick?

Are you best friends with all your co-workers? Do you go out for beers with every single one of your co-workers all the time? This is no different as long as they respect each other and bond on the field, which they have done beautifully and there's been no evidence of discord.

7: The dude is hearing voices. Says it's god telling him the interception was His will, says it's god telling him to be celibate with his model GF. Look, people can have their religion and it doesn't bother me, but literally hearing voices? That's going off the deep end a bit.

I can't remember who it was that called this a euphemism, but that's exactly what it is. He is deeply religious and it is a huge part of his life. That feeling of God speaking to him is his business and how he interprets it.


My "faith" in Wilson is severely shaken compared to what it once was. I still recognise him as a talent, but am no longer defensive of his flaws. Where once I would have blamed some starts on Bevell or scripted plays or whatnot, I now see it as a flaw in Wilson's game. Where once I would have excused the SB interception, I now believe he wanted to win the game as an ego thing and forced a pass that wasn't on. And what I used to see as using cliches as a defense mechanism that allowed him to be more confident to the media, I now see as a cheap plastic veneer and wonder how deep the person is inside.


You see a cheap plastic veneer? I don't even know how to respond to this drivel. It's so damn dumb. What has he done for you to bash his character so much? Because he won't take a ridiculously underpaying contract? He is still the same great guy. Great teammate. Hardest worker. Visits children's hospitals. Has no incidences off the field. Yet, he's fake because he's dating a famous singer and had a conversation in private at a church that happened to be recorded? Get a grip.



Literally one of the worst posts I've ever read.


Why? alot of what he posted was the hard truth.. and 'truth hurts' applys in this caase

That's why it's one of the worst posts ever.
 

scutterhawk

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Hawkpower":34x3v7k6 said:
StoneCold":34x3v7k6 said:
Hawkpower":34x3v7k6 said:
I can understand not wanting to demonize either side. We all love the front office, and RW is our QB.

But what do you think the hold up is, you know, if you were to make an educated guess with the information at hand?

I only ask because you seem to bristle at the thought that RW may be the one holding it up. You think its Pete and JS?

I don't know what the hold up is and I'm happy to wait and not speculate. Especially when that speculation goes to impugn someone's character. That's what I bristle at.

SC


Well that certainly is admirable.

I for one enjoy seeing that some hawk fans are capable of being critical of RW. It adds some balance and interesting discussion here, and lets be fair, RW has gotten more than his fair share of over the top love and anointed sainthood from hawk fans, based primarily on media reports.

Now that the media hints that he may be making questionable choices, we are to wait and not judge. Interesting double standard.

Besides, hes a big boy. I am quite sure he can handle the audacity of some guy claiming he is disappointed in his handling of the contract thus far :) Impugned and all lol.
Hmm, so when in doubt.....attack his character with unproven slander? SMH
 

chris98251

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I really think that both sides are closer then the media realizes, the Seahawks have been fair with everyone they have resigned, if there are any hang up's I don't think it's the money, I think it is probably the money distribution and yes the amount guaranteed. The other factor is the Scott Boras aspect, the agent wants his name in lights to promote himself for other clients, he does that by making a numbers splash for Russell.

I would take an insurance policy out on Wilson if I were the Seahawks in lieu of the guaranteed amount if that is possible, protects their investment and hopefully can be worked around the cap since it's not actual money paid now but downstream if something happens. Work with Wilson on this and get the deal done.
 

Djphinfan

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Donn2390":26kww27t said:
AVL":26kww27t said:
The guy is happily fulfilling his crappy contract and somehow that isn't enough!
It wasn't a crappy contract three years ago when he was a nobody and would have gladly played for minimum wage ($9.75 an hour, not NFL minimum!) just to get the opportunity to be allowed to step foot on the grass.... Had he been a bust, he would be overpaid at a mil and half a year. Both he and the team took a gamble at that time, it's good that both won the gamble.
I read somewhere sometime back that one of his life's goals is to own an NFL team someday. It looks like he is trying to get his down payment saved up in a hurry.
I can completely understand the OP's opinion, his image has been tarnished in my eyes, also. Hopefully when the negotiations are all over with, he will make us all forget and put the shine back on the image.
I will say he is getting to be a little too Tebow for my liking. I would prefer he stuck to talking X&O's, and leave his personal life and beliefs for the pulpit... I'm not interested in his g/f, his sex life, or his religious views. That goes not just for him, it's goes for my friends, family and acquaintances, anyone whom I come into contact with..
I understand that is impossible when someone is constantly sticking a mic in your face, just expressing an opinion...
I see from many of the posts above that people aren't allowed to their own opinion, so I apologize in advance to those of you who only want to read opinions that parallel your own...
Just trying to understand the logic from the athletes perspective, obviously you have a player that has clearly been playing at a much higher level than the number represents relative to qbs who perform at that championship level, so because he reached that level much quicker than everyone else, should he just have to sit on a number because he was a rookie three years ago playing on a rookie deal..The fact that he's on that rookie deal should not justify the number itself, the performance every year should, its not fair ya know, I mean whats the incentive for four years if you happen to be great out of the gate..be underpaid while be a great payer, because everyone in the NFL underestimated your game? That shouldn't be the case, for players who completely outperform their rookie contracts and become great players quickly they should be rewarded, having to stick with some arbitrary contract for 4 years when the average lifespan of an NFL player is about 4 or 5 years is ethically wrong imo..
 

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scutterhawk":kl6moycs said:
Hawkpower":kl6moycs said:
StoneCold":kl6moycs said:
Hawkpower":kl6moycs said:
I can understand not wanting to demonize either side. We all love the front office, and RW is our QB.

But what do you think the hold up is, you know, if you were to make an educated guess with the information at hand?

I only ask because you seem to bristle at the thought that RW may be the one holding it up. You think its Pete and JS?

I don't know what the hold up is and I'm happy to wait and not speculate. Especially when that speculation goes to impugn someone's character. That's what I bristle at.

SC


Well that certainly is admirable.

I for one enjoy seeing that some hawk fans are capable of being critical of RW. It adds some balance and interesting discussion here, and lets be fair, RW has gotten more than his fair share of over the top love and anointed sainthood from hawk fans, based primarily on media reports.

Now that the media hints that he may be making questionable choices, we are to wait and not judge. Interesting double standard.

Besides, hes a big boy. I am quite sure he can handle the audacity of some guy claiming he is disappointed in his handling of the contract thus far :) Impugned and all lol.
Hmm, so when in doubt.....attack his character with unproven slander? SMH


Why are you shaking your head, and who attacked his character with unproven slander? That seems a little extreme. I saw a guy say he was disappointed and a few other guys implying that he could come down a bit off his demands to find a win win solution. Nothing wrong with that.

I find it odd that there are hawk fans that are so wrapped up in RW that any perceived slight gets them all in a ruffle.
 

Hawkpower

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Hawkfan77":2t9e2vac said:
Hawkpower":2t9e2vac said:
AVL":2t9e2vac said:
Unrealistic expectations almost always lead to disappointment.

This feeling is on you, no one else.



Why do you suppose some fans had unrealistic expectations?
Because some here thought he should do what no player on the roster has yet to do and take a large discount...to the tune of 15 mil per year


Better said: Inexperienced fans thought he WOULD take a mutually beneficial deal due to the carefully crafted, team first image he created for himself over the years.

The difference between perceived Russ and the reality is hitting many of those fans hard.
 

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