Why I am disappointed in Russell Wilson?

[rideaducati]

Haven't we at least given Kerry Collins a courtesy call?

Why not Matt Cassell? At least he's not my older brother's age like Collins and retired. His daughter is my age iirc.

Either one of them would be better than the current Seahawk backup QB.

 

[ctrcat]

I look at it like this. Russell Wilson has aspirations after football. He wants to own a professional sports franchise. Either MLB or NFL. He wants be a businessman. He wants to support a plethora of charitable causes. He has even hinted at aspiring to politics.

All of those things have one thing in common . . . money. Lots of it.

This next contract goes a long way in setting Wilson up to be able to begin acheiving those goals. Fact is, $100 milion doesn't go far when you have dreams as big as Russell. Its a drop in the bucket for a sports franchise. He doesn't even begin to touch a political career. But its a start.

So he's just doing what needs to be done to achieve his goals.

Michael Jordan owns an NBA team and only made $93 million TOTAL salary from the Bulls. Well over ten times his net worth came/comes from sources OTHER than playing salary.

 

[drdiags]

There is a danger of being too deeply invested in players. Wilson is a good story that fit the story of the team as it was taking shape. He is a difference maker as a QB, though not for the purist. As a fan, you knew this was going to be a hot ticket discussion as a few years ago folks were saying they thought Wilson would take a team-friendly deal @14M/yr. You saw the words "not selfish like the others" and just knew there was going to be some folks slapped back into reality.

Wilson isn't the perfect person some wanted him to be, but he has done enough to be looked at with respect for his ability to lead a team.

I am not disappointed with Wilson, though I would like to see a deal struck just so whatever has to drop to long term begins to be revealed. Sure would like to see Wagner's deal done. One thing about fans is when they see a player they feel makes them a winner, they go 100% in. I am a tad cynical but I don't feel I have the right to chastise others on how they feel about the leader of the team they love.

Whatever Wilson's motives are for what he does, not my right to judge. I am an atheist but my entire family is deeply religious and I love them all. We can be different yet appreciated. I just try like heck to keep them on the ground and off a pedestal. Not always successful so I can relate with the OP's mixed feelings on how he sees Wilson.

The guy is still a fighter and not too bad a leader on offense, as long as he isn't tossing 4-int games. Would definitely like to see continued improvement in the pocket and a sharper, quick passing game.

 

[Hawkpower]

can't he both extract every dollar he can AND represent his team with the utmost of his heart, dedication and ability?[/quote]

This to infinity. I don't understand why people can't get both concepts. When he's working for the Hawks, he all about the team. When he's working for Russell, he's all about Russell. And rightfully so. The idea or fear that his contract will gut the franchise for his benefit is more of a fairy tale then Russell good two shoes image. Russell actually goes to see sick children. His contract hasn't cost us one single game.

SC[/quote]


The problem is that they aren't mutually exclusive. And the fear is certainly not a fairy tale at all.

By Russell " working for Russell" as you say, there will be a point where his gain is the teams loss. The fans loss. etc. The Seahawks absolutely can not continue to compete for Super Bowls if his contract reaches certain levels.

Not his problem of course. Especially if recognition and wealth is more important than playing on a winning team.

He could of course have his cake and eat it too. There are win win scenarios abound where he becomes filthy rich AND the team gets to keep its stuff together.

Sounds like he has no interest in that. Which is his right, but it just demonstrates that IMAGE russ was just that. Hes a human like everyone else. The stupid pedestal should be gone, like the OP said.

Hes just a normal dude, and increasingly, clearly a weird one too.[/quote]

You are assuming a great deal about his intentions, first and foremost. Secondly, in your scenario any player asking for a contract is not mutually exclusive to his desire to play for the team that he's on.

It's business. Until the contract is signed and we see what the details are people are jumping to some fairly radical and awkward assumptions.[/quote]




Am I making assumptions? I suppose one could say so.

However, considering the actions thus far, sure seems as if my assumptions are correct.

If I am wrong, why hasn't he signed yet? Doesn't seem like all that far of a stretch to assume he is asking for the moon.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Yet the same people that are shredding him for being "selfish" will be stoked when he signs and acting like "that's my boy."

 

[hawknation2015]

This is a good article on the situation by Doug Farrar:
http://www.si.com/nfl/2015/07/08/mythbu ... s-seahawks

Wilson's efficiency in the pocket did drop off a bit in 2014: He completed 249 passes on 379 attempts for 2,984 yards, 21 touchdowns and 11 picks in the pocket, compared with 77 completions in 145 attempts for 1,215 yards, five touchdowns and one interception outside the pocket. In his three years as a pro, Wilson has finished fourth, then seventh, then 12th in quarterback rating from the pocket. Last season, his 96.0 quarterback rating in the pocket tied him with Drew Brees and landed him ahead of Matt Ryan, Andrew Luck and Joe Flacco.

Is Russell Wilson a franchise quarterback? I would posit that the answer lies somewhere between “Yes” and “Well, duh... of course he is.”

Of course, we're looking at a different question: Is Russell Wilson the kind of franchise quarterback who is worth an Aaron Rodgers-like contract with Clayton Kershaw-like guarantees in the last few years of the deal?

And to that, I say no. No player in a salary cap league is worth that much money with no wiggle room on the team's side. Tom Brady is one of many top quarterbacks who has deferred huge chunks of his cap room to future seasons so that his teams could be better, and Brady has reaped the rewards.

 

[erik2690]

Why compare to Brady though? The dude not nearly on his first extension and married into just a boatload of money. I don't find that to be a good market contract comparison. Like yeah RW could do that, but the more comparable market comparison is start at Newton and go up by how much better you think he is (hard to quantify that). It's always more likely that a guy takes less on extensions farther along than on his first, so I just see that as a weird comparison. Cam took big, there is zero indication Luck won't get huge money. I don't necessarily disagree particularly because "worth" and "deserve" and all those are somewhat murky to quantify even with every stat available. That being said the Brady comparison just doesn't fit. That seems more an outlier notion when looking at first big QB contracts. I mean it's clearly good for the team, bu that can't be the individuals only priority and maybe not even main priority. So again, I think there is certainly arguments to be made on that side of the equation, but Brady is an odd place to frame that from.

 

[hawknation2015]

Why compare to Brady though? The dude not nearly on his first extension and married into just a boatload of money. I don't find that to be a good market contract comparison. Like yeah RW could do that, but the more comparable market comparison is start at Newton and go up by how much better you think he is (hard to quantify that). It's always more likely that a guy takes less on extensions farther along than on his first, so I just see that as a weird comparison. Cam took big, there is zero indication Luck won't get huge money. I don't necessarily disagree particularly because "worth" and "deserve" and all those are somewhat murky to quantify even with every stat available. That being said the Brady comparison just doesn't fit. That seems more an outlier notion when looking at first big QB contracts. I mean it's clearly good for the team, bu that can't be the individuals only priority and maybe not even main priority. So again, I think there is certainly arguments to be made on that side of the equation, but Brady is an odd place to frame that from.

Cam also accepted a relatively small signing bonus ($22.5 million), just 58% guaranteed, and he agreed to reduce his base salary and cap hit this season to make the extension work for his team. Rodgers, Ryan, Flacco, Kaepernick, Dalton, etc. all did this with their first extensions.

 

[Hawkpower]

Yet the same people that are shredding him for being "selfish" will be stoked when he signs and acting like "that's my boy."

Probably not actually.

JS and company arent going to give in to his (speculative) out of reality demands, so therefore if a contract is signed, it will be mutually beneficial and not selfish on RW's part at all.

If RW and his agent do not back down from their media speculative demands, then yeah, I guess he will be selfish, and wearing a different uniform. Then those fans can have their say in that regard I suppose.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Yet the same people that are shredding him for being "selfish" will be stoked when he signs and acting like "that's my boy."

Selfish isn't the right word for me, maybe delusional?

idk, it's hard for me to put my finger on Russell right now. Some of his behavior over the past year or so is just downright weird to me. Not bad, not good, just odd. Like he's trying too hard.

I'm just afraid that Russell is so far up in his own head about his self proclaimed awesomeness that he's NOT going to budge on his contract demands. I'm all for Russell getting all he can get, but if he really is going to draw an unreasonable line in the sand with a bank breaking fully guaranteed contract? Then sorry man, I will be shredding him in a couple years.

 

[StoneCold]

Am I making assumptions? I suppose one could say so.

However, considering the actions thus far, sure seems as if my assumptions are correct.

If I am wrong, why hasn't he signed yet? Doesn't seem like all that far of a stretch to assume he is asking for the moon.

You assume the Hawks have made a reasonable offer. You assume he's asking for the moon.

It is possible he is not asking for the moon, simply more than what the Hawks have offered.

Russell is being made out to be the boogie man, turn coat that is trying to destroy the Hawks for his own personal gain. To do that you need to make a bunch of assumptions.

SC

 

[hawknation2015]

Am I making assumptions? I suppose one could say so.

However, considering the actions thus far, sure seems as if my assumptions are correct.

If I am wrong, why hasn't he signed yet? Doesn't seem like all that far of a stretch to assume he is asking for the moon.

You assume the Hawks have made a reasonable offer. You assume he's asking for the moon.

It is possible he is not asking for the moon, simply more than what the Hawks have offered.

Russell is being made out to be the boogie man, turn coat that is trying to destroy the Hawks for his own personal gain. To do that you need to make a bunch of assumptions.

SC

Just my opinion, but I think it's reasonable to have more faith in this organization's proven track record of fairly rewarding its best players than with a 26-year-old, who has never signed a contract of this magnitude before and chose to ditch his established NFL agent for a baseball agent, with a stated preference for getting his players to free agency and very little experience brokering NFL deals.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

No doubt. Exactly why I'm not even a little bit worried about this. Just stoked about the upcoming season. RW isn't going to be playing anywhere else, for a very long time.

 

[chris98251]

Seahawks paid Sherman, Thomas, Kam, they will pay Wilson. As I have stated a Baseball agent trying to get his moment in the sun and maybe trend a new way of writing contracts to get more NFL players under him.

This whole thing has went 90 degrees south of how Wilson has presented himself to date.

We can argeu speculative scenerios on both sides, but when it comes down to brass tacks I think Wilson will be happy and the team will be happy, the agent, well there is always Baseball.

 

[Missing_Clink]

He is the Hand of God. Chosen. Anointed. Holy. Let his will be done.

 

[Hawkpower]

Am I making assumptions? I suppose one could say so.

However, considering the actions thus far, sure seems as if my assumptions are correct.

If I am wrong, why hasn't he signed yet? Doesn't seem like all that far of a stretch to assume he is asking for the moon.

You assume the Hawks have made a reasonable offer. You assume he's asking for the moon.

It is possible he is not asking for the moon, simply more than what the Hawks have offered.

Russell is being made out to be the boogie man, turn coat that is trying to destroy the Hawks for his own personal gain. To do that you need to make a bunch of assumptions.

SC

As others have said better than I, why wouldn't we assume that the hawks have made a reasonable offer?

The FO has a history of doing just that. They certainly have motivation to do so, do they not?

The reports (which are likely at least close to accurate) have the FO giving a reasonable offer.

And we have RW's camp saying things that certainly point to his wanting something very GRAND. If they are so close together, as you theorize, why not sign the contract offer at hand? It benefits both sides greatly. There is only one reason why RW wouldn't be signing it now, and its not because the two sides are off by a few bucks....

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to put things together here.

If the only argument you have left is ALL THE REPORTS ARE WRONG! QUIT MAKING ASSUMPTIONS!! you know you are on a slippery slope.

 

[rideaducati]

Am I making assumptions? I suppose one could say so.

However, considering the actions thus far, sure seems as if my assumptions are correct.

If I am wrong, why hasn't he signed yet? Doesn't seem like all that far of a stretch to assume he is asking for the moon.

You assume the Hawks have made a reasonable offer. You assume he's asking for the moon.

It is possible he is not asking for the moon, simply more than what the Hawks have offered.

Russell is being made out to be the boogie man, turn coat that is trying to destroy the Hawks for his own personal gain. To do that you need to make a bunch of assumptions.

SC

And you assume Schneider has low-balled Russell. From reports, the Seahawks have offered to make him the third highest paid QB in the league and since Russell has not signed a contract, I believe it is safe to "assume" that Russell is asking for the moon. I consider asking for the moon to be Russell wanting to be paid the highest contract for QBs because he isn't the best QB in the league.

For what it's worth, I think Russell signs an extension before training camp ends for around $22 million/year.

 

[StoneCold]

Am I making assumptions? I suppose one could say so.

However, considering the actions thus far, sure seems as if my assumptions are correct.

If I am wrong, why hasn't he signed yet? Doesn't seem like all that far of a stretch to assume he is asking for the moon.

You assume the Hawks have made a reasonable offer. You assume he's asking for the moon.

It is possible he is not asking for the moon, simply more than what the Hawks have offered.

Russell is being made out to be the boogie man, turn coat that is trying to destroy the Hawks for his own personal gain. To do that you need to make a bunch of assumptions.

SC

And you assume Schneider has low-balled Russell. From reports, the Seahawks have offered to make him the third highest paid QB in the league and since Russell has not signed a contract, I believe it is safe to "assume" that Russell is asking for the moon. I consider asking for the moon to be Russell wanting to be paid the highest contract for QBs because he isn't the best QB in the league.

For what it's worth, I think Russell signs an extension before training camp ends for around $22 million/year.

I make no such assumption. Until we have actual numbers, not so and so says that so and so say that so and so says, I choose not to demonize either side. My thought is they are all reasonable, good people working out a contract. No one is letting anyone down.

SC

 

[Sgt. Largent]

I make no such assumption. Until we have actual numbers, not so and so says that so and so say that so and so says, I choose not to demonize either side. My thought is they are all reasonable, good people working out a contract. No one is letting anyone down.

Well that's no fun.

 

[rideaducati]

And you assume Schneider has low-balled Russell. From reports, the Seahawks have offered to make him the third highest paid QB in the league and since Russell has not signed a contract, I believe it is safe to "assume" that Russell is asking for the moon. I consider asking for the moon to be Russell wanting to be paid the highest contract for QBs because he isn't the best QB in the league.

For what it's worth, I think Russell signs an extension before training camp ends for around $22 million/year.

I make no such assumption. Until we have actual numbers, not so and so says that so and so say that so and so says, I choose not to demonize either side. My thought is they are all reasonable, good people working out a contract. No one is letting anyone down.

SC

So, because YOU choose to abstain from forming your opinion, we should all do the same...got it. That would make just about every subject discussed here very boring though.

I guess your Seahawk season projection is out of the question because you're going to wait for all the numbers to come in, right?

Give it a break, some of us form opinions that have the ability to change once there is more information available. Russell's contract talks have offered us little, but there is SOME information and it makes for better discussion than waiting for the contract to get done. It's a long offseason and actually having something to talk about makes the days go by faster.

Being wrong won't hurt you, it's the internet.