Shane Waldron Our New Offensive Coordinator

[Own The West]

It’s so weird to keep hearing the run, run, run, punt saw. We’ve not been a run first team since Lynch left, nor have we made a playoff run. Last year we threw it twice as often as we ran and got our one-dimentional asses bounced as soon as the games counted. Did Marino ever win anything? Did Breeze w/o a solid running game? No.

So when Pete says he wants to get back to the formula that got us to the superbowl TWICE, why is there all this hand wringing?

Hmm we ran it 411 times, threq it 563, ur math does not add up. We were 18th in run attempts and 17th is pass. Hmm . Now that we clarified the math does not work. Let's move that formula that got us to the sb, u mean the one they did not work thw first 2 year but then worked 2 years and the not again since. I mean we had the most rush att I. The league in 2018, we were # 5 in 2019.and guess what no SB. So his "formula" is far from something to brag about, given it is under 50% in its results. Great coaches adapt to what he has, still waiting for PC to be great

Russ had 83 rushing attempts, second on the team behind Carson. We're not calling runs for our QB, those are failed pass attempts. As for the math:

563 + 83 = 646 rushes
411 - 83 = 328 passes

646 / 328 = 1.97 or just under 2:1 pass:run.

As far as "formula", before PC we made it to the Superbowl 1 out of 34 tries. With Pete, we've made it 2 out of 11 tries.

Or 2.9% success versus 18.2% success if you like math.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Failed pass attempts? It's more really crappy swish cheese pass blocking and people not getting open enough.
Look at his completion percentage, when you think about how many drops there were, along with throwing the ball away? It's pretty impressive. Can he play better, absolutely. The entire team and coaching staff needed to be better. 12-4 and a division title is a solid season. Not good enough when you get bounced the first round. But this is still a really good team that needs to learn to adjust and adapt more imo.
I would love to see them use the TE's a lot more, and more check downs. It doesn't always have to be pound the rock and huck it 50 yards.

 

[John63]

It’s so weird to keep hearing the run, run, run, punt saw. We’ve not been a run first team since Lynch left, nor have we made a playoff run. Last year we threw it twice as often as we ran and got our one-dimentional asses bounced as soon as the games counted. Did Marino ever win anything? Did Breeze w/o a solid running game? No.

So when Pete says he wants to get back to the formula that got us to the superbowl TWICE, why is there all this hand wringing?

Hmm we ran it 411 times, threq it 563, ur math does not add up. We were 18th in run attempts and 17th is pass. Hmm . Now that we clarified the math does not work. Let's move that formula that got us to the sb, u mean the one they did not work thw first 2 year but then worked 2 years and the not again since. I mean we had the most rush att I. The league in 2018, we were # 5 in 2019.and guess what no SB. So his "formula" is far from something to brag about, given it is under 50% in its results. Great coaches adapt to what he has, still waiting for PC to be great

Russ had 83 rushing attempts, second on the team behind Carson. We're not calling runs for our QB, those are failed pass attempts. As for the math:

563 + 83 = 646 rushes
411 - 83 = 328 passes

646 / 328 = 1.97 or just under 2:1 pass:run.

As far as "formula", before PC we made it to the Superbowl 1 out of 34 tries. With Pete, we've made it 2 out of 11 tries.

Or 2.9% success versus 18.2% success if you like math.

Last I checked a QBs rush attempts count. I know when they list the rush attempts they include the whole team. Does that mean Baltimore really sucks at running the ball since a huge % of their yards is the Qb? NO. Doesn't the QB rush attempts also impact the defense and help? Yes SO if they call and RO and Wilson keeps it that does not count as a rush attempt but a pass? That sneak he did this year does not count as a rush? OF course they do. so sorry they count to. I am glad you can use selective math to help your case but in the end it is listed as a rush attempt not pass. If you want to play that game then 60 of the pass attempts were under 5 yards which is like a run so that means 563 - 60=503 and 411+60 = 471 so its almost 50/50 you see I can do selective math to.Also, if we say what you say is true that means PC great scheme is in reality not as in 2013 Wilson was our 2nd leading rusher and if you remove his number guess what you don't get 2-1 run to pass not even close. Same in 2014. So you can't selectively take out QB rushes and then use them when you want. Either way you look at it the 2-1 thing you seem to use as your matrix for PC system is wrong. Also, you are forgetting the one other part of PC great equation, a historic defense something we don't have.

 

[John63]

Failed pass attempts? It's more really crappy swish cheese pass blocking and people not getting open enough.
Look at his completion percentage, when you think about how many drops there were, along with throwing the ball away? It's pretty impressive. Can he play better, absolutely. The entire team and coaching staff needed to be better. 12-4 and a division title is a solid season. Not good enough when you get bounced the first round. But this is still a really good team that needs to learn to adjust and adapt more imo.
I would love to see them use the TE's a lot more, and more check downs. It doesn't always have to be pound the rock and huck it 50 yards.

Yeah we were top 5 in drops at 27.

 

[irfuben32]

It’s so weird to keep hearing the run, run, run, punt saw. We’ve not been a run first team since Lynch left, nor have we made a playoff run. Last year we threw it twice as often as we ran and got our one-dimentional asses bounced as soon as the games counted. Did Marino ever win anything? Did Breeze w/o a solid running game? No.

So when Pete says he wants to get back to the formula that got us to the superbowl TWICE, why is there all this hand wringing?

because we no longer have Marshawn Lynch or the Legion of Boom. We are paying Russell a ton of money which hurts the rest of our roster. We need to maximize that investment.

 

[WmHBonney]

It’s so weird to keep hearing the run, run, run, punt saw. We’ve not been a run first team since Lynch left, nor have we made a playoff run. Last year we threw it twice as often as we ran and got our one-dimentional asses bounced as soon as the games counted. Did Marino ever win anything? Did Breeze w/o a solid running game? No.

So when Pete says he wants to get back to the formula that got us to the superbowl TWICE, why is there all this hand wringing?

The problem with this approach is the current lack of a stellar defense. Peteball doesn't work in the playoffs without an absolutely dominant defense.

 

[chris98251]

It’s so weird to keep hearing the run, run, run, punt saw. We’ve not been a run first team since Lynch left, nor have we made a playoff run. Last year we threw it twice as often as we ran and got our one-dimentional asses bounced as soon as the games counted. Did Marino ever win anything? Did Breeze w/o a solid running game? No.

So when Pete says he wants to get back to the formula that got us to the superbowl TWICE, why is there all this hand wringing?

The problem with this approach is the current lack of a stellar defense. Peteball doesn't work in the playoffs without an absolutely dominant defense.

Which is how the Ravens won it with Dilfer, out of the world defense and a great run game, Dilfer just had one job, don't lose it for them.

 

[John63]

It’s so weird to keep hearing the run, run, run, punt saw. We’ve not been a run first team since Lynch left, nor have we made a playoff run. Last year we threw it twice as often as we ran and got our one-dimentional asses bounced as soon as the games counted. Did Marino ever win anything? Did Breeze w/o a solid running game? No.

So when Pete says he wants to get back to the formula that got us to the superbowl TWICE, why is there all this hand wringing?

The problem with this approach is the current lack of a stellar defense. Peteball doesn't work in the playoffs without an absolutely dominant defense.

Which is how the Ravens won it with Dilfer, out of the world defense and a great run game, Dilfer just had one job, don't lose it for them.

Agreed on Ravens problem is even back when we won the SB we needed Wilson to do more than just not loose it. He had to do his DangerRuss thing in the 4th qtrs a lot.

 

[Maelstrom787]

It’s so weird to keep hearing the run, run, run, punt saw. We’ve not been a run first team since Lynch left, nor have we made a playoff run. Last year we threw it twice as often as we ran and got our one-dimentional asses bounced as soon as the games counted. Did Marino ever win anything? Did Breeze w/o a solid running game? No.

So when Pete says he wants to get back to the formula that got us to the superbowl TWICE, why is there all this hand wringing?

The problem with this approach is the current lack of a stellar defense. Peteball doesn't work in the playoffs without an absolutely dominant defense.

Which is how the Ravens won it with Dilfer, out of the world defense and a great run game, Dilfer just had one job, don't lose it for them.

That ain't gonna work in todays NFL. A decent passing attack is a prerequisite for success.

 

[HawkRiderFan]

It’s so weird to keep hearing the run, run, run, punt saw. We’ve not been a run first team since Lynch left, nor have we made a playoff run. Last year we threw it twice as often as we ran and got our one-dimentional asses bounced as soon as the games counted. Did Marino ever win anything? Did Breeze w/o a solid running game? No.

So when Pete says he wants to get back to the formula that got us to the superbowl TWICE, why is there all this hand wringing?

The problem with this approach is the current lack of a stellar defense. Peteball doesn't work in the playoffs without an absolutely dominant defense.

Which is how the Ravens won it with Dilfer, out of the world defense and a great run game, Dilfer just had one job, don't lose it for them.

That ain't gonna work in todays NFL. A decent passing attack is a prerequisite for success.

This hasn't come up yet but this is why I don't buy "going back to the formula that won" in 2013/14. That's a fair amount of time ago. What worked then isn't necessarily going to work now.

 

[Spin Doctor]

The problem with this approach is the current lack of a stellar defense. Peteball doesn't work in the playoffs without an absolutely dominant defense.

Which is how the Ravens won it with Dilfer, out of the world defense and a great run game, Dilfer just had one job, don't lose it for them.

That ain't gonna work in todays NFL. A decent passing attack is a prerequisite for success.

This hasn't come up yet but this is why I don't buy "going back to the formula that won" in 2013/14. That's a fair amount of time ago. What worked then isn't necessarily going to work now.

We also had a historically good defense during that era. That isn't happening again with the QB taking up such a huge percentage of the cap. We had all of our guys on rookie deals which allowed us to make some aggressive free agent signings. Bennett, Tony McDaniel, Zach Miller and Cliff Avril all came from the free agency. All of those players were extremely huge for us.

Seattle was extremely aggressive the the free agency in those years. That team was also surprisingly good at wide receiver/TE. Tate and Baldwin were a really good combo looking back on things. Both went on to become 1000 yard receivers, and Miller was considered one of the better pass catching TE's in the NFL before we signed him.

Our offense also had Marshawn Lynch, who was one of the best backs of that generation. He had a really good track record of staying healthy during that time. Despite this our offense still had some struggles. Thinking back on it we under-performed our talent level on that side of the ball.

 

[John63]

Which is how the Ravens won it with Dilfer, out of the world defense and a great run game, Dilfer just had one job, don't lose it for them.

That ain't gonna work in todays NFL. A decent passing attack is a prerequisite for success.

This hasn't come up yet but this is why I don't buy "going back to the formula that won" in 2013/14. That's a fair amount of time ago. What worked then isn't necessarily going to work now.

We also had a historically good defense during that era. That isn't happening again with the QB taking up such a huge percentage of the cap. We had all of our guys on rookie deals which allowed us to make some aggressive free agent signings. Bennett, Tony McDaniel, Zach Miller and Cliff Avril all came from the free agency. All of those players were extremely huge for us.

Seattle was extremely aggressive the the free agency in those years. That team was also surprisingly good at wide receiver/TE. Tate and Baldwin were a really good combo looking back on things. Both went on to become 1000 yard receivers, and Miller was considered one of the better pass catching TE's in the NFL before we signed him.

Our offense also had Marshawn Lynch, who was one of the best backs of that generation. He had a really good track record of staying healthy during that time. Despite this our offense still had some struggles. Thinking back on it we under-performed our talent level on that side of the ball.

And I will go back and state it was a by product of the system and philosophy,

 

[Maelstrom787]

Which is how the Ravens won it with Dilfer, out of the world defense and a great run game, Dilfer just had one job, don't lose it for them.

That ain't gonna work in todays NFL. A decent passing attack is a prerequisite for success.

This hasn't come up yet but this is why I don't buy "going back to the formula that won" in 2013/14. That's a fair amount of time ago. What worked then isn't necessarily going to work now.

We also had a historically good defense during that era. That isn't happening again with the QB taking up such a huge percentage of the cap. We had all of our guys on rookie deals which allowed us to make some aggressive free agent signings. Bennett, Tony McDaniel, Zach Miller and Cliff Avril all came from the free agency. All of those players were extremely huge for us.

Seattle was extremely aggressive the the free agency in those years. That team was also surprisingly good at wide receiver/TE. Tate and Baldwin were a really good combo looking back on things. Both went on to become 1000 yard receivers, and Miller was considered one of the better pass catching TE's in the NFL before we signed him.

Our offense also had Marshawn Lynch, who was one of the best backs of that generation. He had a really good track record of staying healthy during that time. Despite this our offense still had some struggles. Thinking back on it we under-performed our talent level on that side of the ball.

It took a series of insanely improbably amazing moves, too.

In just 3 drafts, Seattle picked two of the best safeties to ever play, a hall of fame cornerback, a hall of fame middle linebacker, a top-10 LT, a productive hybrid in Irvin, a consistently great OLB in Wright, a Pro Bowler in Golden Tate, and hit an absurd amount of late picks that contributed like Lane, Thurmond, McCoy, Maxwell, and Sweezy... not to mention a sure-fire hall of fame QB in the 3rd round. They also traded for one of the most talented running backs we've ever seen in Lynch, hit on free agency moves like Rice and Avril, and found unknown talent and maximized it in Baldwin, Browner, and Giacomini.

It was quite possibly the most incredible string of offseasons to ever happen in the modern NFL. It just can't be reproduced.

 

[chris98251]

It’s so weird to keep hearing the run, run, run, punt saw. We’ve not been a run first team since Lynch left, nor have we made a playoff run. Last year we threw it twice as often as we ran and got our one-dimentional asses bounced as soon as the games counted. Did Marino ever win anything? Did Breeze w/o a solid running game? No.

So when Pete says he wants to get back to the formula that got us to the superbowl TWICE, why is there all this hand wringing?

The problem with this approach is the current lack of a stellar defense. Peteball doesn't work in the playoffs without an absolutely dominant defense.

Which is how the Ravens won it with Dilfer, out of the world defense and a great run game, Dilfer just had one job, don't lose it for them.

That ain't gonna work in todays NFL. A decent passing attack is a prerequisite for success.

Been hearing this since Elway and Marino came into the league, Still waiting for a passing attack offense to dominate year after year in the Super Bowl, outliers from time to time yes, but at least a mid to upper tier Running game is a must to get you there through the playoffs, good teams with defenses can take away one dimensional teams to easy.

 

[John63]

The problem with this approach is the current lack of a stellar defense. Peteball doesn't work in the playoffs without an absolutely dominant defense.

Which is how the Ravens won it with Dilfer, out of the world defense and a great run game, Dilfer just had one job, don't lose it for them.

That ain't gonna work in todays NFL. A decent passing attack is a prerequisite for success.

Been hearing this since Elway and Marino came into the league, Still waiting for a passing attack offense to dominate year after year in the Super Bowl, outliers from time to time yes, but at least a mid to upper tier Running game is a must to get you there through the playoffs, good teams with defenses can take away one dimensional teams to easy.

I agree you need to be able to run. But there is a difference between being able to run and being a run first team. Example Baltimore and Tenn were the top 2 teams by yards. Neither got to the big dance. In fact Tampa and Kc were 28th and 16th respectively. However there were 1 and 2 in passing yards.

 

[Maelstrom787]

The problem with this approach is the current lack of a stellar defense. Peteball doesn't work in the playoffs without an absolutely dominant defense.

Which is how the Ravens won it with Dilfer, out of the world defense and a great run game, Dilfer just had one job, don't lose it for them.

That ain't gonna work in todays NFL. A decent passing attack is a prerequisite for success.

Been hearing this since Elway and Marino came into the league, Still waiting for a passing attack offense to dominate year after year in the Super Bowl, outliers from time to time yes, but at least a mid to upper tier Running game is a must to get you there through the playoffs, good teams with defenses can take away one dimensional teams to easy.

Sure, an effective rushing game is certainly helpful. One-dimensional offenses don't go far. But a one-dimensional rushing offense is worse than the one-dimensional passing offense.

The decent passing attack remains a prerequisite, though. No team will be able to move the ball effectively enough to get to the big dance without an effective air game in this league as it stands.

The two teams that got there this year both have prolific passing attacks. They rode them to the bowl. Same as the Chiefs last year. The Niners got there with a fantastic rushing attack, but they also did just enough in the passing game to cruise in. Obviously, we saw that the failure to execute through the air ended up being their death knell, too.

This is why I love Waldron and Dickerson coming in. Two guys with a proven record when it comes to working on steady zone-run style ground attacks that tend to succeed even with mediocre personnel. Said zone run branches out into play action, roll outs, and supplements a west coast passing scheme that'll finally take some pressure of Russ. An offense that works only when Russ is completing about 10% more passes than his expected completion isn't sustainable, and that's not the type of stuff Waldron has been shown to develop.

I'm sticking with my tweet from before he was hired.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/turbinsbicep/status/1353928580452020224[/tweet]

 

[Own The West]

This is why I love Waldron and Dickerson coming in. Two guys with a proven record when it comes to working on steady zone-run style ground attacks that tend to succeed even with mediocre personnel. Said zone run branches out into play action, roll outs, and supplements a west coast passing scheme that'll finally take some pressure of Russ. An offense that works only when Russ is completing about 10% more passes than his expected completion isn't sustainable, and that's not the type of stuff Waldron has been shown to develop.

I'm sticking with my tweet from before he was hired.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/turbinsbicep/status/1353928580452020224[/tweet]

Agreed. I think we'll be getting back to "point guard" Russ, supported by punishing run game.

 

[John63]

This is why I love Waldron and Dickerson coming in. Two guys with a proven record when it comes to working on steady zone-run style ground attacks that tend to succeed even with mediocre personnel. Said zone run branches out into play action, roll outs, and supplements a west coast passing scheme that'll finally take some pressure of Russ. An offense that works only when Russ is completing about 10% more passes than his expected completion isn't sustainable, and that's not the type of stuff Waldron has been shown to develop.

I'm sticking with my tweet from before he was hired.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/turbinsbicep/status/1353928580452020224[/tweet]

Agreed. I think we'll be getting back to "point guard" Russ, supported by punishing run game.

then we will not make the playoffs. We need more than point guard Russ. We need a scoring point guard.

 

[Maelstrom787]

This is why I love Waldron and Dickerson coming in. Two guys with a proven record when it comes to working on steady zone-run style ground attacks that tend to succeed even with mediocre personnel. Said zone run branches out into play action, roll outs, and supplements a west coast passing scheme that'll finally take some pressure of Russ. An offense that works only when Russ is completing about 10% more passes than his expected completion isn't sustainable, and that's not the type of stuff Waldron has been shown to develop.

I'm sticking with my tweet from before he was hired.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/turbinsbicep/status/1353928580452020224[/tweet]

Agreed. I think we'll be getting back to "point guard" Russ, supported by punishing run game.

then we will not make the playoffs. We need more than point guard Russ. We need a scoring point guard.

You JUST watched Seattle get bounced by a team that had a mediocre quarterback doing an impression of a point guard, coached by the same guys Pete just hired to run the offense. In what way does any of that forecast playoff failure?

 

[John63]

This is why I love Waldron and Dickerson coming in. Two guys with a proven record when it comes to working on steady zone-run style ground attacks that tend to succeed even with mediocre personnel. Said zone run branches out into play action, roll outs, and supplements a west coast passing scheme that'll finally take some pressure of Russ. An offense that works only when Russ is completing about 10% more passes than his expected completion isn't sustainable, and that's not the type of stuff Waldron has been shown to develop.

I'm sticking with my tweet from before he was hired.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/turbinsbicep/status/1353928580452020224[/tweet]

Agreed. I think we'll be getting back to "point guard" Russ, supported by punishing run game.

then we will not make the playoffs. We need more than point guard Russ. We need a scoring point guard.

You JUST watched Seattle get bounced by a team that had a mediocre quarterback doing an impression of a point guard, coached by the same guys Pete just hired to run the offense. In what way does any of that forecast playoff failure?

I just watched us get bounced by a team with a top defense. Something we don't have. If we did than point t guard Russ might be enough. Problem is even back when we won the SB he had to do a lot more than a point guard QB can do. S9 no we need more than PG Russ.