A tale of two quarterbacks

[semiahmoo]

Only stats that matter are playoffs/Super Bowls - and right now our Seahawks aren't looking to be picking up any of those any time soon...

You were arguing that RW is a bad QB. It's a losing argument. Keep up here turbo.

Nope - that he's a limited QB. See multiple posts declaring him a "good" QB but not a "great" one.

Stop the fake news. This isn't CNN bro! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Yeah... great QBs win championships/division titles... play in pro bowls and set team records. :sarcasm_on: I wish we could find someone like that. :sarcasm_off:

No - great teams do that.

Just ask all the great players who have left because too many wallowed in the ignorance of your opinion.

And if you want to know what really happened, and what is likely to happen, just ask.

I'm always willing to teach those willing to learn...

 

[semiahmoo]

It's a trap to give the QB too much credit for winning, or conversely, so much blame for losing. Anyone with two eyes and a brain realizes that RW has some limitations, but also some pretty unique qualities that a lot of teams would kill for.

This thread brings up so many big-picture questions:
How many "great" QBs are in the NFL right now? How many of the teams with a great QB have won a recent Superbowl?
And Semiamoo, are you having fun?

GREAT points - agree 100%

The Seahawks were once a great team with a "good" QB, and world-class running game/defense/etc who all bought into the team dynamic.

In more recent seasons, we are a team with a "good" QB but not a world-class running game/defense/etc., and a worsening internal dynamic.

That spells major reset time, 2-3 seasons of rebuilding, and then, hopefully, 3-5 seasons of dominance once again.

GO HAWKS!

 

[Sox-n-Hawks]

You were arguing that RW is a bad QB. It's a losing argument. Keep up here turbo.

Nope - that he's a limited QB. See multiple posts declaring him a "good" QB but not a "great" one.

Stop the fake news. This isn't CNN bro! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Yeah... great QBs win championships/division titles... play in pro bowls and set team records. :sarcasm_on: I wish we could find someone like that. :sarcasm_off:

No - great teams do that.

Just ask all the great players who have left because too many wallowed in the ignorance of your opinion.

And if you want to know what really happened, and what is likely to happen, just ask.

I'm always willing to teach those willing to learn...

:snack: :snack: :snack: :snack: :snack: :snack: :snack: :snack: :snack: :snack: :snack: :snack: :snack: :snack:
Look guys, we better listen up because.... We've got a real Clairvoyant here
:2thumbs: :2thumbs: :2thumbs: :2thumbs: :2thumbs: :2thumbs: :2thumbs: :2thumbs: :2thumbs: :2thumbs: :2thumbs:

 

[Uncle Si]

Or... you know... continue building the running game and defense

Trying to push this narrative that it all needs to blow up is a masked attempt at irritation. You contradict yourself from post to post (certainly not 99% accurate) in that attempt.

People have caught on.

 

[semiahmoo]

It's a trap to give the QB too much credit for winning, or conversely, so much blame for losing. Anyone with two eyes and a brain realizes that RW has some limitations, but also some pretty unique qualities that a lot of teams would kill for.

This thread brings up so many big-picture questions:
How many "great" QBs are in the NFL right now? How many of the teams with a great QB have won a recent Superbowl?
And Semiamoo, are you having fun?

Oh, and to your last question.

Sure. It's not the Seahawk's Reddit board but it's amusing if not terribly informative...

 

[12thbrah]

I'm just mad at Russell's performance because he's on my fantasy team but really I don't care too much as long as the team keeps winning.

 

[scutterhawk]

It's a trap to give the QB too much credit for winning, or conversely, so much blame for losing. Anyone with two eyes and a brain realizes that RW has some limitations, but also some pretty unique qualities that a lot of teams would kill for.

This thread brings up so many big-picture questions:
How many "great" QBs are in the NFL right now? How many of the teams with a great QB have won a recent Superbowl?
And Semiamoo, are you having fun?

Oh, and to your last question.

Sure. It's not the Seahawk's Reddit board but it's amusing if not terribly informative...

It's only "Informative" if you're learning something from the collective process from others in here, otherwise, it's just being contrary.
NO ONE (except me) is ever 100 % correct, we all make mistakes (except me), I make lots of "Alterations", and the older you get the more "Alterations" you should be making, as oft-times it's one of the only ways to get your thinker back on the right track. :argue:

 

[LoneHawkFan]

Passing TD leader and Pro-Bowl 2017. Keep talking about how terrible he is without a running game.

:177692: :177692: :177692:

Only stats that matter are playoffs/Super Bowls - and right now our Seahawks aren't looking to be picking up any of those any time soon...

You were arguing that RW is a bad QB. It's a losing argument. Keep up here turbo.

Nope - that he's a limited QB. See multiple posts declaring him a "good" QB but not a "great" one.

Stop the fake news. This isn't CNN bro! :lol: :lol: :lol:

No man, you said he was a game manager. That he’s not a star- he’s just a game manager. A game manager. Riddle me this, when was the last time (prior to RW in 2017) that someone you consider to be a game manager led his team in rushing and led the league in TDs with one of the worst offensive lines in the history of football? This is laughable; true comedy.

But, I guess, in a semantic way, you’re spot on. He manages to win the vast majority of the games he plays in, managed to lead the team in rushing last year and he managed to lead the league in TDs. He’s managed to be one of the most successful QBs in the league in the last decade, and managed to have one of the best playoff records of any QB in that stretch. Not the very best, but not just “good”, and def not just a “game manager”. Laughable.

The only problem with this team is Pete’s offensive philosophy. It’s not personnel, it’s not Russell’s deficiencies....it’s the juxtaposition of a “we’re going to dominate you” attitude on the defensive side of the ball and a “we need to do just enough to barely squeak out a win as long as the defense does it’s job” mentality on the offensive side. Those attitudes are not aligned. Not even when we were a great team.

This is a philosophical issue at the root. The defensive players have revolted because of this- all of the pressure is on them. The philosophy dictates that.

Pete is a great, no, fantastic coach. Of defensive skill sets and philosophy. Specific techniques, even.

His defense, coupled with an offense that had a parallel attitude, would work into perpetuity in this league.

 

[endzorn]

Wilson could be a superstar with any OC who knew how to play to his strengths. Schottenheimer has turned Wilson into a stationary target in the pocket. This so called “next-level coaching” that schottenheimer was going to give RW has sapped him of the things that made him special.

I don’t care what Wilson says, he can’t see in the pocket. He’s at his most dangerous when he’s on the move and he’s now relegated to a pocket that can hardly hold up.

Move him. I understand keeping him in the pocket on a percentage of plays, but we should be moving him often to make sure he can see the field and make sure he has options other than taking sacks. Roll him left or right, he’s been very good either way.

I was of the mind that we should fire Cable and give Bevell one year to see what he could do with a new OL coach. I was also of the mind that Schottenheimer is an awful OC. Nothing I have seen has even moved the meter toward Schottenheimer being remotely good.

Sadly, I think the end of Carroll will be tied to his baffling coaching choices on offense. I love Pete, but he needs to take inventory on his coaching hires.

 

[semiahmoo]

Wilson could be a superstar with any OC who knew how to play to his strengths. Schottenheimer has turned Wilson into a stationary target in the pocket. This so called “next-level coaching” that schottenheimer was going to give RW has sapped him of the things that made him special.

I don’t care what Wilson says, he can’t see in the pocket. He’s at his most dangerous when he’s on the move and he’s now relegated to a pocket that can hardly hold up.

Move him. I understand keeping him in the pocket on a percentage of plays, but we should be moving him often to make sure he can see the field and make sure he has options other than taking sacks. Roll him left or right, he’s been very good either way.

I was of the mind that we should fire Cable and give Bevell one year to see what he could do with a new OL coach. I was also of the mind that Schottenheimer is an awful OC. Nothing I have seen has even moved the meter toward Schottenheimer being remotely good.

Sadly, I think the end of Carroll will be tied to his baffling coaching choices on offense. I love Pete, but he needs to take inventory on his coaching hires.

Completely agree Wilson is too short to be a consistent pocket passer.

Problem is he already seems slower and getting more so to continue being a the consistent scramble threat he once was.

Which comes to the discussion of longer term viability as a top-tier QB. I'm of the belief he is not - most especially not without some serious talent around him. The problem is that his big $$$$ contract negated that ability to provide him that serious talent and so his weaknesses have been further exposed.

The only stat that matters is winning and we haven't been a playoff-winning/legit Super Bowl threat for some time now and it's not looking like that is going to miraculously change this season.

Thus, reset time which means telling Pete goodbye, and if need be, Russel as well.

And I say that as a big Russel Wilson fan on a personal level.

 

[KiwiHawk]

Today I saw a team that could rush the ball effectively and even though they somehow managed not to secure a single first-down on 10 3rd-down attempts, they still managed 11 first downs rushing and another 6 passing. I saw a team move the ball for over 330 net yards.

They were facing another team - one that provided excellent pass protection for the QB. He had a heck of a good first outing, hitting some passes to very fine windows. Unfortunately he only put up 180-odd yards for all of his fantastic protection. He had fewer completions from more attempts than the other guy, who suffered most of the game with pretty average pass protection. Also unfortunately, his team couldn't run the ball effectively, which meant they couldn't control the clock very well, and ultimately lost the game to the team that could rush effectively.

It's really flashy to see a QB hitting long passes in tight windows. It almost makes you forget the number of times he missed which, combined with a lack of an effective running game, meant stalled drives.

As far as a team on the ascension goes, the Cardinals will be losing some of their most effective defensive players to age, along with Larry Fitzgerald. They aren't committed to running the ball. They had a good game from a QB no one has any real tape of yet, but that will change soon enough. Their receivers dropped several very catch-able passes. There is speed there, but not a great deal of depth.

They are in serious trouble, regardless of how anything looked today.

 

[semiahmoo]

I'm just mad at Russell's performance because he's on my fantasy team but really I don't care too much as long as the team keeps winning.

Fantasy team?

Man, we are living in reality here don't you know that?

 

[stack55]

I was so proud of RW today. Out in front making
Blocks for the RB. How many Qb’s in the league
Have the balls to do that?

 

[adeltaY]

Mitchell Trubisky is a game manager and he threw 6 TD passes.

In the modern NFL, you don't have to be Peyton Manning to put up MVP numbers. Scheme, scheme, scheme.

Carroll refuses to evolve and here we are. Think about it. Trubisky threw one fewer TD passes in one game than RW has the entire season. Be honest and ask yourself who is better. Fix the goddamn passing game.

 

[sutz]

Well, let's see how things play out for Mr Rosen after the league gets a few games of film on him.

Not gonna crown a rookie who had some flashes in a loss.

:229031_shrug:

 

[Smellyman]

He led the league in TDs and Yards LAST YEAR.

Remember Semiahmoo started the 'Earl is slow because his thighs are too big.'

His hatred and bias for RW also runs deep.

 

[UK_Seahawk]

Have a look at the holding the cards did. Christ alive I could have thrown for a couple of TDs with all that time. Seriously look at the td throw and watch Clark. Disgraceful.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Well, the announcers had crowned him the next Joe Montana in the 1st quarter :lol:
He did make some damn nice throws though.

 

[semiahmoo]

Well, the announcers had crowned him the next Joe Montana in the 1st quarter :lol:
He did make some damn nice throws though.

Yes he did. The young man is a legit talent.

Hoping he stays healthy. He'll be fun to watch.

 

[SoulfishHawk]

I don't like the kid, but he clearly can sling it