Cardinals trying to sign Peterson

[SomersetHawk]

Well Washington is why I think we will have a better LB corps. A lot of people forget one of the main reasons we shut you down in Seattle the year prior was because of Washington's lateral speed and his ability to contain Wilson. Weatherspoon I believe is an upgrade over Larry Foote but I could be wrong....

Our losses were Cromartie, and Dan Williams on defense. Dan Williams is the big loss.

The Seahawks only really made one upgrade and thats at TE. Where you arguably got the best TE in the league.

However the Seahawks lost a lot. Byron Maxwell, James Carpenter, Max Unger, Malcom Smith....

Chances are we will have gained Peterson... I think overall looking at the big picture we have closed the gap, and I think its a reasonable assumption thus far in FA.

Don't disagree with any of that, though Smith played a minimal part last year so his loss doesn't hurt us. But yeh, we've lost three starters so far and are set to lose some solid depth. Getting AP will make this thing very interesting. I've found the Cards at 11/2 for the West, 16/1 to take the NFC and 33/1 for the Super Bowl, I'm going to take all of them on and hope that the Hawks cancel them out.

 

[rideaducati]

Well Washington is why I think we will have a better LB corps. A lot of people forget one of the main reasons we shut you down in Seattle the year prior was because of Washington's lateral speed and his ability to contain Wilson. Weatherspoon I believe is an upgrade over Larry Foote but I could be wrong....

Our losses were Cromartie, and Dan Williams on defense. Dan Williams is the big loss.

The Seahawks only really made one upgrade and thats at TE. Where you arguably got the best TE in the league.

However the Seahawks lost a lot. Byron Maxwell, James Carpenter, Max Unger, Malcom Smith....

Chances are we will have gained Peterson... I think overall looking at the big picture we have closed the gap, and I think its a reasonable assumption thus far in FA.

Assume away. I'm sure you assumed that the Cards had the division in the bag last year after 11 games too. I think your assumptions will end up just like that one did. I don't care how big the picture is that you're looking at, there is still a rather large gap between the Seahawks and the rest of the division including the Cards. The gap may lessen IF AP is acquired, but that would only be at the RB position while the gap in other positions widens.

Washington might get suspended for a domestic violence charge on top of the year he just received, so you don't even know if he'll be reinstated. Plus, the guy hasn't played football in a year and a half so you don't even know how he'll respond to playing again.

Byron Maxwell will be missed, but the Seahawks have a lot of guys to choose from that have been in the system for a while already.

Malcolm Smith was a third string LB that has only 16 starts in four seasons because of injuries to other linebackers.

Max Unger missed most of the season last year and the Seahawks won every game he missed averaging 5 fewer yards per game. I don't think his replacement is a big drop off.

Carpenter has been fat and out of shape since he was drafted and that led to injuries throughout his entire stay with the Seahawks. He started 39 games in four seasons.

The Seahawks lost a number of players, but NONE of their core players. The players lost represent the positions where their loss will be felt the least. The Seahawks have players already on their roster that also have playing time within the system that will minimize the drop off. It will just be a matter of getting the new backups ready for when they are needed.

Injuries happen, as you know. Is YOUR team equipped to handle them WHEN they happen again this season? My team is. This is where you will notice that the gap you THINK has closed really hasn't.

 

[ringless]

Well it's just an opinion. I feel as though next year we will field a better team than last. That's all. As usual, only time will tell.

I didn't think we had it in the bag 11 weeks into the season considering the QB situation. If we had Palmer, we would have won the division point blank. No doubt we win two more games in the last 5-6 weeks.

 

[SomersetHawk]

Assume away. I'm sure you assumed that the Cards had the division in the bag last year after 11 games too. I think your assumptions will end up just like that one did. I don't care how big the picture is that you're looking at, there is still a rather large gap between the Seahawks and the rest of the division including the Cards. The gap may lessen IF AP is acquired, but that would only be at the RB position while the gap in other positions widens.

Washington might get suspended for a domestic violence charge on top of the year he just received, so you don't even know if he'll be reinstated. Plus, the guy hasn't played football in a year and a half so you don't even know how he'll respond to playing again.

Byron Maxwell will be missed, but the Seahawks have a lot of guys to choose from that have been in the system for a while already. - The guys in the system are injured, we're paying Cary Williams a decent chunk of money to do Maxi's job, and whilst he's the inferior corner, Earl should minimize the drop off.

Malcolm Smith was a third string LB that has only 16 starts in four seasons because of injuries to other linebackers.

Max Unger missed most of the season last year and the Seahawks won every game he missed averaging 5 fewer yards per game. I don't think his replacement is a big drop off. - Where are you getting your info from? I believe we averaged around 30 yards a game less, and 50 less yards in the running game. If we roll with a guy currently on the roster then for sure there'll be a decent drop off. We wouldn't be going after Winsiewski if we didn't know that.

Carpenter has been fat and out of shape since he was drafted and that led to injuries throughout his entire stay with the Seahawks. He started 39 games in four seasons. - His replacement, Bailey, has been fat and out of shape since he's been here and started far less games.

The Seahawks lost a number of players, but NONE of their core players. The players lost represent the positions where their loss will be felt the least. The Seahawks have players already on their roster that also have playing time within the system that will minimize the drop off. It will just be a matter of getting the new backups ready for when they are needed.

Injuries happen, as you know. Is YOUR team equipped to handle them WHEN they happen again this season? My team is. This is where you will notice that the gap you THINK has closed really hasn't.

- Our depth will naturally take a hit as we continue to hand out big contracts to our core, I don't think we're particularly well equipped to handle injuries and I'd be interested to know why you do?

Cards lost some big players last year for stretches, if we do that I don't think there's any way we win as many games. Palmer missed 10 regular season games last year and they still got into the play-offs, can't be confident we'd do the same should Russ go down for a similar amount of time. Dockett missed out the whole season, I dread to think of a D-line minus Michael Bennett. Our depth on a very average O-line last year was poor and we just lost two starters, plus the last time our LT stayed healthy for all 16 regular season games was, wait, never.

I'm not even trying to sound doom and gloom with my replies, I think we'll rightly be favourites when the season starts but you're trying to shoot down ringless with blanks here.

 

[rideaducati]

Assume away. I'm sure you assumed that the Cards had the division in the bag last year after 11 games too. I think your assumptions will end up just like that one did. I don't care how big the picture is that you're looking at, there is still a rather large gap between the Seahawks and the rest of the division including the Cards. The gap may lessen IF AP is acquired, but that would only be at the RB position while the gap in other positions widens.

Washington might get suspended for a domestic violence charge on top of the year he just received, so you don't even know if he'll be reinstated. Plus, the guy hasn't played football in a year and a half so you don't even know how he'll respond to playing again.

Byron Maxwell will be missed, but the Seahawks have a lot of guys to choose from that have been in the system for a while already. - The guys in the system are injured, we're paying Cary Williams a decent chunk of money to do Maxi's job, and whilst he's the inferior corner, Earl should minimize the drop off.

Malcolm Smith was a third string LB that has only 16 starts in four seasons because of injuries to other linebackers.

Max Unger missed most of the season last year and the Seahawks won every game he missed averaging 5 fewer yards per game. I don't think his replacement is a big drop off. - Where are you getting your info from? I believe we averaged around 30 yards a game less, and 50 less yards in the running game. If we roll with a guy currently on the roster then for sure there'll be a decent drop off. We wouldn't be going after Winsiewski if we didn't know that.

Carpenter has been fat and out of shape since he was drafted and that led to injuries throughout his entire stay with the Seahawks. He started 39 games in four seasons. - His replacement, Bailey, has been fat and out of shape since he's been here and started far less games.

The Seahawks lost a number of players, but NONE of their core players. The players lost represent the positions where their loss will be felt the least. The Seahawks have players already on their roster that also have playing time within the system that will minimize the drop off. It will just be a matter of getting the new backups ready for when they are needed.

Injuries happen, as you know. Is YOUR team equipped to handle them WHEN they happen again this season? My team is. This is where you will notice that the gap you THINK has closed really hasn't.

- Our depth will naturally take a hit as we continue to hand out big contracts to our core, I don't think we're particularly well equipped to handle injuries and I'd be interested to know why you do?

Cards lost some big players last year for stretches, if we do that I don't think there's any way we win as many games. Palmer missed 10 regular season games last year and they still got into the play-offs, can't be confident we'd do the same should Russ go down for a similar amount of time. Dockett missed out the whole season, I dread to think of a D-line minus Michael Bennett. Our depth on a very average O-line last year was poor and we just lost two starters, plus the last time our LT stayed healthy for all 16 regular season games was, wait, never.

I'm not even trying to sound doom and gloom with my replies, I think we'll rightly be favourites when the season starts but you're trying to shoot down ringless with blanks here.

The Seahawks are equipped to handle injuries along the offensive line because they have had guys injured at a high rate for the past several years and the backups came in and played well. Those backups will now become the starters and like I said, it will be up to the coaching staff to have the new backups ready, but there are so many with experience that it shouldn't be too difficult. Plus, as poorly as the O-line has played in recent years, do you really expect there to be this HUGE drop off? I don't. Neither Carp or Unger have stood out the past couple seasons in a positive way.

The Seahawks had 17 players on IR at the end of last season and they played in the Super Bowl. The year before, the Seahawks lost several starters along the O-line for considerable time, their best WR, a LB, their right corner, their slot corner and won the Super Bowl. I have no doubt the coaching staff will have a solution to every injury that occurs just as they have the past few years...except at QB. I have zero faith in the current backup QB...although he is a free agent and hopefully signs elsewhere.

Every team has injuries. The Seahawks coaching staff has proven that they can get the replacements to play well enough to overcome them. I don't know how they do it, but until they don't do it anymore, they get my backing as being really good at it.

Don't forget that it was just last year that Maxwell became the starter. He was a backup to Browner prior to that. Carp was backing up McQuistan and McQ sucked. A 7th round D-lineman started over Carp at RG as a rookie late in the season... It's not like we haven't been down this road before.

 

[original poster]

If theres's one team that I think can push the Hawks in the NFC West it's certainly the Cards. I do believe we will come out top next year but I don't expect it to be easy with the Cards being right behind us.

 

[Scottemojo]

One thing Ringless keeps throwing out there like it means nothing, AP has to take less money if he goes to AZ. That is a potential very big deal that will stop this big deal from happening.

It's only my opinion, but AP is not a less money kind of guy. He knows more than most the injuries backs face and their short shelf life. He has a few baby mommas to make paternity payments to. And being highest paid is important to him, we are talking about the guy who compared players to slaves during the last CBA.

In order for AZ to make this happen, a new deal would have to be signed, and even if his 2015 number went way down to accommodate a trade, there would be guarantees that more than make up for it. He will not want less than Lynch. He will want a contract that makes it hard to cut him for 3 more years at least.

 

[Uncle Si]

One thing Ringless keeps throwing out there like it means nothing, AP has to take less money if he goes to AZ. That is a potential very big deal that will stop this big deal from happening.

It's only my opinion, but AP is not a less money kind of guy. He knows more than most the injuries backs face and their short shelf life. He has a few baby mommas to make paternity payments to. And being highest paid is important to him, we are talking about the guy who compared players to slaves during the last CBA.

In order for AZ to make this happen, a new deal would have to be signed, and even if his 2015 number went way down to accommodate a trade, there would be guarantees that more than make up for it. He will not want less than Lynch. He will want a contract that makes it hard to cut him for 3 more years at least.

It was the whole basis of my initial post in this thread. Alot of this thread is speculation from one side, without much energy given to the other. Ringless is pretty excited about what he's heard on that end. And I imagine for good reason. I guess I just get a different perspective living in Minnesota and listening to the drama every day here. Either way, the Mike Wallace trade over the weekend has people's heart rates up.

The deal may in well happen. It may require AP to restructure. But I can't see AP willing to give up money. Not after losing out in all of last year. He may be happy to restructure (a point no one on here has denied) but he's not giving up money to play somewhere else. The Vikings don't think they are any further away from a Super Bowl than the Cardinals. They are a franchise on the rise right now, and they feel it.

It sounds like he and the Vikings are playing a high stakes staring contest. One thing certain here is that the Vikings believe they can win next year, and want to prep the city for the opening of the new stadium the year after. Local connections to the FO here are pretty stout in thinking a. AP is staying and b. if he goes, it will be on the FO's terms.

A 2nd round pick may be enough. Hard to say, many here want two firsts. Many think they will need atleast one first round pick to get the Wisconsin kid. Does AZ give that up?

 

[Scottemojo]

For a 30 YO RB? No chance. Arians and Keim are not doing things stupidly, and they won a staring contest with Fitz this year, and let Dockett go in another staring contest. They are not going to suddenly give up two first for AP.

 

[Uncle Si]

For a 30 YO RB? No chance. Arians and Keim are not doing things stupidly, and they won a staring contest with Fitz this year, and let Dockett go in another staring contest. They are not going to suddenly give up two first for AP.

I don't see it either. But there is another organization with literally nothing to lose, not two aging athletes.

The thing in this situation is that the Vikings want AP. They may be posturing to shift his value up, but they have an exciting young team going into next year and the possibility of challenging for a playoff spot with a top 5 RB.

This is not about AP and the Cardinals. It's about the Vikings and AP.

Just trying to offer up the other side here.

 

[Hawkfan77]

One thing Ringless keeps throwing out there like it means nothing, AP has to take less money if he goes to AZ. That is a potential very big deal that will stop this big deal from happening.

It's only my opinion, but AP is not a less money kind of guy. He knows more than most the injuries backs face and their short shelf life. He has a few baby mommas to make paternity payments to. And being highest paid is important to him, we are talking about the guy who compared players to slaves during the last CBA.

In order for AZ to make this happen, a new deal would have to be signed, and even if his 2015 number went way down to accommodate a trade, there would be guarantees that more than make up for it. He will not want less than Lynch. He will want a contract that makes it hard to cut him for 3 more years at least.

Exactly, especially with his age and what happened to him last year, I think his priorities are getting the most amount of money out of the NFL as possible in the next couple of years because he's not going to be playing forever.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

The Cardinals have pretty much said they're open to trading for Peterson, but they have no intention of absorbing his entire salary.

Which is going to be the hangup for the Vikings, they're going to have to pay some of Peterson's salary, which I don't think they'll be willing to do.........especially with a team like the Cowboys or Cardinals that are picking late so their draft picks aren't as attractive for trade bait.

 

[Popeyejones]

Exactly, especially with his age and what happened to him last year, I think his priorities are getting the most amount of money out of the NFL as possible in the next couple of years because he's not going to be playing forever.

Ehh, who knows what his priorities are or what his interests are.

I mean I think we can be certain that Ringless' originally proposed less money for AP and a 4th round pick for the Vikings is something that could only be believed by a Cardinals fan, as it's gussied up way to say the Cardinals were on the verge of getting something for nothing; you have to be a fan to dupe yourself into thinking that's how things work.

A 2nd round pick definitely sounds CLOSER from the Vikings perspective (or maybe satisfies them), although it's still an open question of if Peterson would a) actually take less money (rather than moved around money) and b) how much "less money" we're actually talking about.

As it was before, I think it's probably not as generous of a gift as Ringless would rather believe.

Just by point of comparison, Peteson's cap hit is averaging 15 million per over the next three years. Lynch's cap hit is averaging 10.5 or so over the next three years. I think a non-Cardinals homer can reasonably expect Peterson -- if this all happens and if he's open to renegotiating in the first place -- to have a cap hit that falls somewhere in between those two figures.

That Peterson and the Vikings are motivated to give gifts to the Cardinals -- as was essentially the original proposal Ringless said was a done deal -- is just kinda silly,though.

 

[Weadoption]

If Adrian Peterson wants to go to a winner, why is Arizona on his list?

Come on. Even as Seahawk fans we should be able to recognize that they will be a serious contender in the NFC next year.

I don't see them being "serious" contenders. They have been complacent for the most part and they have a new defensive coordinator.

How many times last season did they play their tougher opponents when their opponents had their best players out of the game? Dallas without Romo. Frisco without Davis and Gore and a couple offensive linemen. Then, they were outplayed in several other games only to fluke their way to a win. They won the games, but I NEVER saw them as a serious threat last year and I feel the same for this year.

The Cards were in the bottom half of the league in offense and defense and were the ONLY playoff team without a top ten unit on either offense or defense. It wasn't all a fluke, but they weren't nearly as good as their record indicated and their complacency will not make them better.

Just look at the Chiefs from two seasons ago and you'll see the Cardinals of last year. Add a year to the Chiefs and I think that is what we'll see from the Cardinals this season.

The Cardinals also did that with 4 different QB's and finishing the season with their 4th strung QB which is very rare. While also missing 33 million dollars of cap space on IR. Our offensive line will clearly by the best we have ever had since being in AZ. It would also be the best RB we've ever had on the team... (Emmit Smith was already cooked) and Edge did well. Our LB's position was weak last year but we will have Washington back, and upgraded that position with him coming back in combination with Weatherspoon who was the 2nd highest rated LB FA. While also upgrading the Dline. We still have a first round draft pick to help close the gap.

It is an unknown what will happen on defense with the new coordinator, however I know we have a better team that will be on the field talent wise than last year.

I will admit there was some flukes, but I also saw some flukes during Seattle's games.... At what point is luck for any team on a consistent basis not just the results of hard work? Nobody knows what will happen next year but I think we are a serious threat ..... SF certainly isn't.

Certainly isn't?
It's March bro and your qb certainly doesn't stay on the field much.

 

[Hawks46]

One thing Ringless keeps throwing out there like it means nothing, AP has to take less money if he goes to AZ. That is a potential very big deal that will stop this big deal from happening.

It's only my opinion, but AP is not a less money kind of guy. He knows more than most the injuries backs face and their short shelf life. He has a few baby mommas to make paternity payments to. And being highest paid is important to him, we are talking about the guy who compared players to slaves during the last CBA.

In order for AZ to make this happen, a new deal would have to be signed, and even if his 2015 number went way down to accommodate a trade, there would be guarantees that more than make up for it. He will not want less than Lynch. He will want a contract that makes it hard to cut him for 3 more years at least.

I think this is spot on.

The Cardinals have already come out and said that Peterson's contract is a "non-starter" and they in no way can absorb that.

Peterson is going to have two choices: take significantly less money to play where he wants, or keep his money and play for the Vikes. And we're talking significantly less money. The Cards aren't stupid and Keim is a damn good GM. He knows what the talent is like in this draft and they can get a very good RB for less than 10% of what Peterson would cost them.

 

[Uncle Si]

One thing Ringless keeps throwing out there like it means nothing, AP has to take less money if he goes to AZ. That is a potential very big deal that will stop this big deal from happening.

It's only my opinion, but AP is not a less money kind of guy. He knows more than most the injuries backs face and their short shelf life. He has a few baby mommas to make paternity payments to. And being highest paid is important to him, we are talking about the guy who compared players to slaves during the last CBA.

In order for AZ to make this happen, a new deal would have to be signed, and even if his 2015 number went way down to accommodate a trade, there would be guarantees that more than make up for it. He will not want less than Lynch. He will want a contract that makes it hard to cut him for 3 more years at least.

I think this is spot on.

The Cardinals have already come out and said that Peterson's contract is a "non-starter" and they in no way can absorb that.

Peterson is going to have two choices: take significantly less money to play where he wants, or keep his money and play for the Vikes. And we're talking significantly less money. The Cards aren't stupid and Keim is a damn good GM. He knows what the talent is like in this draft and they can get a very good RB for less than 10% of what Peterson would cost them.

Peterson's choices are only based on what the Vikings want to do with him as well, a point that seems to be glossed over here.

 

[Scottemojo]

The Cardinals have pretty much said they're open to trading for Peterson, but they have no intention of absorbing his entire salary.

Which is going to be the hangup for the Vikings, they're going to have to pay some of Peterson's salary, which I don't think they'll be willing to do.........especially with a team like the Cowboys or Cardinals that are picking late so their draft picks aren't as attractive for trade bait.

This is not MLB, you can't agree to pay some part of a salary to trade a guy. signing bonuses have already been paid, but a trade means the other team takes over the contract from that point forward. Roster bonuses, workout bonuses, whatever is left, they go to the new team.

 

[IndyHawk]

Exactly, especially with his age and what happened to him last year, I think his priorities are getting the most amount of money out of the NFL as possible in the next couple of years because he's not going to be playing forever.

Ehh, who knows what his priorities are or what his interests are.

I mean I think we can be certain that Ringless' originally proposed less money for AP and a 4th round pick for the Vikings is something that could only be believed by a Cardinals fan, as it's gussied up way to say the Cardinals were on the verge of getting something for nothing; you have to be a fan to dupe yourself into thinking that's how things work.

A 2nd round pick definitely sounds CLOSER from the Vikings perspective (or maybe satisfies them), although it's still an open question of if Peterson would a) actually take less money (rather than moved around money) and b) how much "less money" we're actually talking about.

As it was before, I think it's probably not as generous of a gift as Ringless would rather believe.

Just by point of comparison, Peteson's cap hit is averaging 15 million per over the next three years. Lynch's cap hit is averaging 10.5 or so over the next three years. I think a non-Cardinals homer can reasonably expect Peterson -- if this all happens and if he's open to renegotiating in the first place -- to have a cap hit that falls somewhere in between those two figures.

That Peterson and the Vikings are motivated to give gifts to the Cardinals -- as was essentially the original proposal Ringless said was a done deal -- is just kinda silly,though.

What a refreshing voice of reason over Ringless..No offense Ringless but you are too homer to convince me how it will be.I see it more Popeye and Si's way on this,I do understand how badly you want this to happen though.

 

[theENGLISHseahawk]

Adrian Peterson's last game vs Seattle:

21 carries, 65 yards, zero touchdowns.

 

[RedAlice]

Exactly, especially with his age and what happened to him last year, I think his priorities are getting the most amount of money out of the NFL as possible in the next couple of years because he's not going to be playing forever.

Ehh, who knows what his priorities are or what his interests are.

I mean I think we can be certain that Ringless' originally proposed less money for AP and a 4th round pick for the Vikings is something that could only be believed by a Cardinals fan, as it's gussied up way to say the Cardinals were on the verge of getting something for nothing; you have to be a fan to dupe yourself into thinking that's how things work.

A 2nd round pick definitely sounds CLOSER from the Vikings perspective (or maybe satisfies them), although it's still an open question of if Peterson would a) actually take less money (rather than moved around money) and b) how much "less money" we're actually talking about.

As it was before, I think it's probably not as generous of a gift as Ringless would rather believe.

Just by point of comparison, Peteson's cap hit is averaging 15 million per over the next three years. Lynch's cap hit is averaging 10.5 or so over the next three years. I think a non-Cardinals homer can reasonably expect Peterson -- if this all happens and if he's open to renegotiating in the first place -- to have a cap hit that falls somewhere in between those two figures.

That Peterson and the Vikings are motivated to give gifts to the Cardinals -- as was essentially the original proposal Ringless said was a done deal -- is just kinda silly,though.

What a refreshing voice of reason over Ringless..No offense Ringless but you are too homer to convince me how it will be.I see it more Popeye and Si's way on this,I do understand how badly you want this to happen though.

I enjoy Ringless being so homer over this. Kind of balances out the many, many Hawk homers who post just as crazy things on many Hawk topics. :thirishdrinkers: