Fire Pete

[hawksincebirth]

Chris Peterson and there is a list off inventive coaches. But hey lets just keep rolling this crappy team out cause who else can do it.

Jesus stop with Peterson. He is not going to leave the college game.

Yeah, Paul Allen probably couldn't afford him.

If this rang true, Nick Saban would already be back in the NFL and Urban Meyer would have had his shot already too. Some guys just like the college game and don’t want to deal with Pro Athletes. Money can’t persuade that. Peterson is one of those guys.

Source ?

 

[Spin Doctor]

6 years ago we had the talent to do it. Now we don't, but that doesn't deter Pete from sticking with the same old plan although its not working. That's the problem. If something isn't working, you try something else. Pete refuses to do that.

He brought the talent to the system though.

Fine if you dont think he can do it again. But he didnt inherit the team fans remember so fondly

Most coaches are pretty inflexible. Just depends on patience and trust at this point

Yes, he brought in the talent. Who has he brought in who has been an elite player since the 2012 draft?

1. Frank Clark (elite flashes but inconsistent)
2. BMac (elite so far this year)
3. Coleman (top slot corner)

Who do we have left who is an elite player?

1. Russell Wilson
2. Bobby Wagner
3. KJ Wright (missed a quarter of the season already)
4. Doug Baldwin (also hurt)

Does PCJS track record from 2015 to now inspire confidence? With the four draft picks (1, 3, 4, 5) that we have in 2019? We aren't getting anything for Earl now. So we trade down and maybe get another third. Depends on how high we pick this year, to be honest. But that means we likely miss out on the top tier DL talent at the top of the first.

Talent is going to be hard to find. It's time to evolve the offensive philosophy and the scheme.

So just as we start being able to run the ball and control the clock, abandon it to a pass happy team that can't pass block with defenders having their ears back and teeing off every snap and expect good results?

Sounds like a winner to me.

"Evolving the offensive scheme" doesn't necessarily mean becoming a pass heavy team. Our team is running some really simple route concepts. We're talking techmo bowl simple in some cases. We go many games without utilizing the whole route tree. Our offensive playcalling is also horribly inept at situational football. Calling four go routes on third and short is like throwing your whole paycheck on black on the roulette wheel. Most of the time you're going to lose, and maybe once in a blue moon you'll have a huge payday. The odds will always be against you.

 

[Steve2222]

Jesus stop with Peterson. He is not going to leave the college game.

Yeah, Paul Allen probably couldn't afford him.

If this rang true, Nick Saban would already be back in the NFL and Urban Meyer would have had his shot already too. Some guys just like the college game and don’t want to deal with Pro Athletes. Money can’t persuade that. Peterson is one of those guys.

Source ?

You don’t think Urban and Saban have had their phone ring from NFL teams? Lmao

 

[hawksincebirth]

Yeah, Paul Allen probably couldn't afford him.

If this rang true, Nick Saban would already be back in the NFL and Urban Meyer would have had his shot already too. Some guys just like the college game and don’t want to deal with Pro Athletes. Money can’t persuade that. Peterson is one of those guys.

Source ?

You don’t think Urban and Saban have had their phone ring from NFL teams? Lmao

I’m talking Peterson , you said several times he WOULD NEVER MAKE THE JUMP

 

[Northwest Seahawk]

Dumb

It’s a transition year after losing a lot of talent due to injury and contract.

People keep saying "transitional year", but what I saw out there was bad coaching, and a team that looked unprepared, and incompetent. Pete Carroll tried his hardest to lose the game with the way he called it. This has become a trend over the last few seasons.

What you have is an almost entirely new coaching staff and team trying to figure out how to gel. Patience.

And yet the same offensive issues plaguing us since the end of 2015 persist. How long are you willing to give Pete to get this offense rolling?

If Wilson could convert a 3rd down that would help more than firing Pete.

 

[Sox-n-Hawks]

People keep saying "transitional year", but what I saw out there was bad coaching, and a team that looked unprepared, and incompetent. Pete Carroll tried his hardest to lose the game with the way he called it. This has become a trend over the last few seasons.

What you have is an almost entirely new coaching staff and team trying to figure out how to gel. Patience.

And yet the same offensive issues plaguing us since the end of 2015 persist. How long are you willing to give Pete to get this offense rolling?

If Wilson could convert a 3rd down that would help more than firing Pete.

Honest assessment of this game's offense, there was a SOLID game plan midweek. It was disrupted by the last minute Inactive status of Chris Carson, which moved the 3rd down back into the workhorse position. Not a big deal right? We've got will Dissly to be that big 3rd down tight end and we'll rely on him while pounding the rock with Davis and Penny. Then Dissly goes down (after only 1 3rd down attempt all game up until that point) and Seattle still manages to score. Now what's the answer? Adapt, improvise, overcome and win. Which is exactly what happened.

It's been said many times that Petes teams play to the level of their opponent. Which I find to be fairly accurate. As such, I expect a well planned and executed HOME game after struggling on some away games and winning the only division game thus far. Here's hoping Tedric Thompson can bring his "A" game, HIS play will likely be the biggest question mark this weekend if we can't keep the pressure on Goff.

 

[ImTheScientist]

We have both bad coaching and poor talent. It will be on display next week when we get beat by 30.

The longer we hold onto the past the longer we will suffer. Hope the front office figures this out quick and cuts bait with Pete. Others have shown turn around can be quick in the NFL and others have shown coaching REALLY matters. We can't continue with the offense the way its going yet Pete won't allow for anything remotely creative. Im generally an optimist when it comes to the Hawks but this is obvious.

 

[ImTheScientist]

Dumb

It’s a transition year after losing a lot of talent due to injury and contract.

Its not dumb. Look at what McVay did for the Rams vs Fisher. In the NFL you can win with talent...but scheme is just as important. We currently have neither. Yes we are 2-2 but this team isn't making the playoffs. I saw the same thing in this forum during Holmgren's final years. People are holding onto the past....I get it....FANatics. If you objectively look at things its obvious Pete is holding us back offensively due to philosophy. Since that won't change he needs to go.

 

[TreeRon]

If this rang true, Nick Saban would already be back in the NFL and Urban Meyer would have had his shot already too. Some guys just like the college game and don’t want to deal with Pro Athletes. Money can’t persuade that. Peterson is one of those guys.

Source ?

You don’t think Urban and Saban have had their phone ring from NFL teams? Lmao

I’m talking Peterson , you said several times he WOULD NEVER MAKE THE JUMP

People in Boise believed Petersen would never leave BSU either. (He'd turned down P5 offers before UW)
Me, I think Petersen would make a fine NFL HC and unless another McVay comes along he'd be my choice.

 

[LoneHawkFan]

In a perfect scenario, Pete would relinquish all of his control over the offense...that I understand and wholeheartedly support.

But firing Pete? We are going through a nearly total rebuild of the defense, and yet its still a pretty darned good defense. That isn't by accident...it's Coach Pete Carroll.

If we fire Pete, how do you all propose we manage this defense going forward? Under a "Pete Carroll has been fired" scenario, maybe we gain a little on offense, but the entire defensive philosophy and Pete's coaching abilities need to be replaced as well.

Firing Pete would truly end this run for a while. We've been in literally every single game except ONE with this man at the helm.

Release the hold on the offense, absolutely. Please don't fire Pete.

 

[TwistedHusky]

Here is why you fire Pete: THERE IS NO FUTURE WITH PETE CARROLL FOR THIS FRANCHISE

Pete is here, at most, another 3 years. Even if you assume he can somehow fix this offense (he cannot), or somehow make a dominating defense (our DL is 32nd ranked right now) - there is not enough time for him to build anything that matters. So what then?

Hand off to one of his coaching staff? The best HC seed from his coaching tree that is not already a HC is now the sometimes DC in Dallas.

There literally is no upside in keeping him. None. Your best scenario has him putting in a 10 win season after an easy schedule and then getting decimated in the playoffs after winning a wildcard game. And that scenario will not happen this year. Maybe in one or two years, and then he is gone anyway. Is that one bit of upside worth leaving the team with holes all over the place, no HC, and potentially in cap hell?

The reality of getting rid of Pete is that you have to.

We have a giant decision to make on Wilson, and with Pete - Wilson is not a QB you can ride to the playoffs. He is not a QB you can focus your offense on and expect it to produce enough to make up for the holes you create in paying out that giant contract. BUT....with another coach, he might be.

It is better to find out now, before that decision, than make the investment and find out that Wilson isn't better with the other HC. And having a QB like Wilson gets you a better chance at getting a good HC option because of the chance to work with a great QB.

It doesn't matter if Pete can be 'better' or 'we need him for the defense'. Pete is gone, now or later. If we fail to fire him, we will find this out in 3 years. We will find out too late to find out if Wilson can be better under someone else. And we will have to make a 30M commitment to a player we don't know can succeed here as the lead horse.

Pete has been the reason for this team's success but as of now, he brings nothing to the table. He has to go because the only thing he is doing is wasting time you need to evaluate whether this team can be a winner with offense instead of defense.

 

[Seymour]

Jesus stop with Peterson. He is not going to leave the college game.

Yeah, Paul Allen probably couldn't afford him.

If this rang true, Nick Saban would already be back in the NFL and Urban Meyer would have had his shot already too. Some guys just like the college game and don’t want to deal with Pro Athletes. Money can’t persuade that. Peterson is one of those guys.

Source ?

Source = OKG

Look into what Peterson wants in OKG's and it stands to reason the chances of bringing that to the NFL are slim to none.

“We’re not into those guys we just like on Saturdays,” Petersen said. “We need to like them Sunday-Friday as well, that they’re doing all the things right in the classroom and off the field, that they’re growing and becoming a better person, preparing themselves for the rest of their lives.”

 

[Mad Dog]

Here is why you fire Pete: THERE IS NO FUTURE WITH PETE CARROLL FOR THIS FRANCHISE

Pete is here, at most, another 3 years. Even if you assume he can somehow fix this offense (he cannot), or somehow make a dominating defense (our DL is 32nd ranked right now) - there is not enough time for him to build anything that matters. So what then?

Hand off to one of his coaching staff? The best HC seed from his coaching tree that is not already a HC is now the sometimes DC in Dallas.

There literally is no upside in keeping him. None. Your best scenario has him putting in a 10 win season after an easy schedule and then getting decimated in the playoffs after winning a wildcard game. And that scenario will not happen this year. Maybe in one or two years, and then he is gone anyway. Is that one bit of upside worth leaving the team with holes all over the place, no HC, and potentially in cap hell?

The reality of getting rid of Pete is that you have to.

We have a giant decision to make on Wilson, and with Pete - Wilson is not a QB you can ride to the playoffs. He is not a QB you can focus your offense on and expect it to produce enough to make up for the holes you create in paying out that giant contract. BUT....with another coach, he might be.

It is better to find out now, before that decision, than make the investment and find out that Wilson isn't better with the other HC. And having a QB like Wilson gets you a better chance at getting a good HC option because of the chance to work with a great QB.

It doesn't matter if Pete can be 'better' or 'we need him for the defense'. Pete is gone, now or later. If we fail to fire him, we will find this out in 3 years. We will find out too late to find out if Wilson can be better under someone else. And we will have to make a 30M commitment to a player we don't know can succeed here as the lead horse.

Pete has been the reason for this team's success but as of now, he brings nothing to the table. He has to go because the only thing he is doing is wasting time you need to evaluate whether this team can be a winner with offense instead of defense.

Man you'd think we were strapped with Tom Flores and Dan McGuire. Not the second most successful Coach/QB combo in the last decade. Talk about a tough crowd.

He brings nothing to the table? Last I checked we are 2-2 and haven't lost a game by more than a single score and have a young defense playing mighty good ball right now and finally a running game that looks like it might carry the team. And a QB that still can run a 2 minute drill and give you a chance.

If you'd have told me that every year my team would make the playoffs and win a wild card game, I'd totally take that since odds are so stacked against that happening it's an amazing accomplishment. Otherwise you take the Browns/Jets approach of changing the FO and drafting QB's every year hoping one day you might get lucky again.


Just look at the best franchises:
Best franchise in the league: Belichek and Brady. FO and QB stability
Next best franchise: Carroll and Wilson. FO and QB stability
Next best franchise: Rodgers and McCarthy. FO and QB stability
Next best franchise: Rothlisberger and Tomlin. FO and QB stability
Next best franchise: Denver Broncos. Lost stability and have sucked since SB win

The order may be a little out of kilter but you have the 5 best franchises the last 10 years and 4/5 have been incredibly stable from a coach and QB standpoint.

There are two ways to get to a SB. Get a competent QB on a rookie salary and build a great team around him. Or have a franchise QB and good coach and get hot in the playoffs. The former requires a great deal of draft luck. That's why few teams are willing to try that route.

 

[Steve2222]

If this rang true, Nick Saban would already be back in the NFL and Urban Meyer would have had his shot already too. Some guys just like the college game and don’t want to deal with Pro Athletes. Money can’t persuade that. Peterson is one of those guys.

Source ?

You don’t think Urban and Saban have had their phone ring from NFL teams? Lmao

I’m talking Peterson , you said several times he WOULD NEVER MAKE THE JUMP

Peterson is a college guy. He also likes to keep a low profile and out of the spotlight. Which is why he’s turned down offers from powerhouse schools. Washington was the perfect fit for him as it was a jump to a power 5, yet still pretty isolated from everyone else.

There’s no getting out of the spotlight for him being in the NFL. He will be scrutinized every loss no matter what team he coaches. To some people that’s worth more than money.

 

[TwistedHusky]

MadDog - I get your point. I watched football in the Flores era too (as a kid but I still suffered through it)

Except Pete will be gone in 3 years regardless.

The team will not be great in 3 years.

So why keep him?

He has shown he cannot be offense first when your best player is Wilson.

If we keep him we have to make a 30M commitment to Wilson while hoping he can work with the next HC. That makes no sense.

Figure out if Wilson can be good with another coach, because you are getting another coach regardless.

BTW Carroll has not been a 'good' coach for 5 years. He has underperformed with the talent he has had for half a decade. So the recipe for a 'good' coach and franchise QB isn't applicable. He was good, with 4 HOF players on an all-time defense. But not since.

 

[TreeRon]

Source ?

You don’t think Urban and Saban have had their phone ring from NFL teams? Lmao

I’m talking Peterson , you said several times he WOULD NEVER MAKE THE JUMP

Peterson is a college guy. He also likes to keep a low profile and out of the spotlight. Which is why he’s turned down offers from powerhouse schools. Washington was the perfect fit for him as it was a jump to a power 5, yet still pretty isolated from everyone else.

There’s no getting out of the spotlight for him being in the NFL. He will be scrutinized every loss no matter what team he coaches. To some people that’s worth more than money.

There's no more isolated NFL franchise than Seattle. Take away the last few years w/the LOB and Pete and most people thought/think Seattle is in Alaska or Siberia or Canada or something. The entire Northwest is more flyover than the flyover States. (Most of us like it that way.)

Pete Carroll has to leave one way or another so maybe we'll find out within the next 5 years or so.

 

[mrt144]

People keep saying "transitional year", but what I saw out there was bad coaching, and a team that looked unprepared, and incompetent. Pete Carroll tried his hardest to lose the game with the way he called it. This has become a trend over the last few seasons.

What you have is an almost entirely new coaching staff and team trying to figure out how to gel. Patience.

And yet the same offensive issues plaguing us since the end of 2015 persist. How long are you willing to give Pete to get this offense rolling?

If Wilson could convert a 3rd down that would help more than firing Pete.

If you've consistently have 3rd down problems, maybe it's time to sit down and hash out the hard truth that what you think is effective, maybe isn't.

 

[SanDiegoSeahawk]

We're 2-2 with a team that is a shadow of its former talent/roster. Pete stays. Let's move on.

 

[Steve2222]

You don’t think Urban and Saban have had their phone ring from NFL teams? Lmao

I’m talking Peterson , you said several times he WOULD NEVER MAKE THE JUMP

Peterson is a college guy. He also likes to keep a low profile and out of the spotlight. Which is why he’s turned down offers from powerhouse schools. Washington was the perfect fit for him as it was a jump to a power 5, yet still pretty isolated from everyone else.

There’s no getting out of the spotlight for him being in the NFL. He will be scrutinized every loss no matter what team he coaches. To some people that’s worth more than money.

There's no more isolated NFL franchise than Seattle. Take away the last few years w/the LOB and Pete and most people thought/think Seattle is in Alaska or Siberia or Canada or something. The entire Northwest is more flyover than the flyover States. (Most of us like it that way.)

Pete Carroll has to leave one way or another so maybe we'll find out within the next 5 years or so.

I get that. But NFL jobs are more scrutinized than college jobs outside of a few college programs.

 

[TwistedHusky]

In the next 3 years, if we keep Pete -

what is the upside?

What is the downside?



Now do the reverse of this exercise using the scenario where we remove Pete and install a difference HC?