Hawks should impose a deadline w/ Kam

[RussB]

Agreed. Kam is a great player and is the man, but hes acting like a spoiled brat with this holdout, he has no business getting a new contract this early. Fine him and make him pay for his actions

 

[Sgt. Largent]

The three years left thing is a bit of misnomer as he is in the last year of his guaranteed contract. If the team can bail on the non guaranteed part it is smart for the player to make moves now.

True, but is it fair for Kam to come back after getting all his bonus and guaranteed money in the first two years..........and now want MORE guaranteed AND a higher base?

The reason the Hawks front loaded Kam's deal is so that it would be more cap friendly in the last 3 years because they knew huge extensions for Russell, Bobby and others were happening this year.

idk, seems disingenuous on Kam's part to be just fine with getting all his huge bonus and guaranteed money front loaded, and now have his hand out again two years later.

 

[Hawkfish]

Hey Kam, "Come home!"

 

[onanygivensunday]

A couple days... or even maybe a week of missing training camp is forgivable. BUT MISSING THE ENTIRE CAMP?! You have to enforce fines. There needs to be consequences.

Also, I'd like to agree with someone's post above... Give Kam the money under the condition that he call Mebane and tell him he's been cut from the team due to his own contract re-negotiations. Seems fair.

That makes no sense either.

Bane would simply be an UFA and sign elsewhere, maybe for more money... maybe for a little less but we would lose him.

The club cannot cave on this one... they just can't.

 

[Polaris]

I hate to say it but I have to agree. Kam and/or his agent seem to be suffering from certain illusions (such as the Seahawks are Cap-Rich which simply isn't true).

I would make the deadline the first week of the season. Get in by then, or:

1. The Seahawks will formally demand all accrued fines.
2. The Seahawks will explore a trade....if a trade can't be finalized by week 9 and Kam is still a no-show, then he'll be cut.

Demand the fines sure, but trading him or cutting him makes literally no sense whatsoever. As long as he's not showing up, he's not getting paid.. so really the only thing the Seahawks lose is not having Kam Chancellor on the field. But why enable his exit just because he's pouting about a deal he just signed 2 years ago? If he wants to hold out, so be it, the Seahawks control his career until he decides he wants to return

Well the reason I suggest trading him or even outright cutting him is because sometimes public executions are needed, and unfortunately this seems to be such a case. If one of us tried doing what Kam is in our jobs we'd be fired (at the very least). If Kam thinks he's worth 10mil/yr to the rest of the NFL, he's in for a VERY rude awakening. Outside Seattle, Kam is a tweener and a tweener coming of an injury at that. On the open market, I think he's be lucky to get HALF of his current contract let alone what he wants.

So fine. Call his bluff. Tell him in the rudest way possible that no he's not irreplaceable, and that the 'hawks WILL replace him ideally by trade (getting something is better than nothing), but by cutting if need be. I'd also play Patriot style hardball as well by trading or cutting him by week nine so he CAN'T accrue an earned season if he continues to hold out.

I would make the deadline the first regular season game. Tell him point blank, if he's not there by then, he's no longer a Seahawk....one way or another. Yes, that more like what Patriots would do, but sometimes in order to be nice, you have to show your teeth once in a while. This IMHO is such a case.

 

[Basis4day]

I hate to say it but I have to agree. Kam and/or his agent seem to be suffering from certain illusions (such as the Seahawks are Cap-Rich which simply isn't true).

I would make the deadline the first week of the season. Get in by then, or:

1. The Seahawks will formally demand all accrued fines.
2. The Seahawks will explore a trade....if a trade can't be finalized by week 9 and Kam is still a no-show, then he'll be cut.

Demand the fines sure, but trading him or cutting him makes literally no sense whatsoever. As long as he's not showing up, he's not getting paid.. so really the only thing the Seahawks lose is not having Kam Chancellor on the field. But why enable his exit just because he's pouting about a deal he just signed 2 years ago? If he wants to hold out, so be it, the Seahawks control his career until he decides he wants to return

Well the reason I suggest trading him or even outright cutting him is because sometimes public executions are needed, and unfortunately this seems to be such a case. If one of us tried doing what Kam is in our jobs we'd be fired (at the very least). If Kam thinks he's worth 10mil/yr to the rest of the NFL, he's in for a VERY rude awakening. Outside Seattle, Kam is a tweener and a tweener coming of an injury at that. On the open market, I think he's be lucky to get HALF of his current contract let alone what he wants.

So fine. Call his bluff. Tell him in the rudest way possible that no he's not irreplaceable, and that the 'hawks WILL replace him ideally by trade (getting something is better than nothing), but by cutting if need be. I'd also play Patriot style hardball as well by trading or cutting him by week nine so he CAN'T accrue an earned season if he continues to hold out.

I would make the deadline the first regular season game. Tell him point blank, if he's not there by then, he's no longer a Seahawk....one way or another. Yes, that more like what Patriots would do, but sometimes in order to be nice, you have to show your teeth once in a while. This IMHO is such a case.

Amazing how much certain fans want to take someone's money and use analogies of people getting their heads cut off.

This is business. Not personal. I want Kam back as much as any fan but let's slow down the violent rhetoric.

 

[ImTheScientist]

Let Kam sit out the entire year. I don't see any other resolution on the Seahawks side that wouldn't have every player holding out for more money with three years left on their contract. This hold out makes no sense at all... even less than Russell's stance that he was going to play out his final year.

Kam sits out this season and then he still has to play for three more years on the same contract if he wants to play in the NFL at all. Good luck making up the lost millions later. I still think he may be hiding an injury.

What he will do is come back week 10. Then he counts as having played. If he pulls that crap I just don't let him play the last 6. Then next year have him hold out 10 games and do the same thing. At the end of the day he loves to play football. He won't love missing it. The game moves on without you bruh.

Good luck Kam.

 

[Polaris]

I hate to say it but I have to agree. Kam and/or his agent seem to be suffering from certain illusions (such as the Seahawks are Cap-Rich which simply isn't true).

I would make the deadline the first week of the season. Get in by then, or:

1. The Seahawks will formally demand all accrued fines.
2. The Seahawks will explore a trade....if a trade can't be finalized by week 9 and Kam is still a no-show, then he'll be cut.

Demand the fines sure, but trading him or cutting him makes literally no sense whatsoever. As long as he's not showing up, he's not getting paid.. so really the only thing the Seahawks lose is not having Kam Chancellor on the field. But why enable his exit just because he's pouting about a deal he just signed 2 years ago? If he wants to hold out, so be it, the Seahawks control his career until he decides he wants to return

Well the reason I suggest trading him or even outright cutting him is because sometimes public executions are needed, and unfortunately this seems to be such a case. If one of us tried doing what Kam is in our jobs we'd be fired (at the very least). If Kam thinks he's worth 10mil/yr to the rest of the NFL, he's in for a VERY rude awakening. Outside Seattle, Kam is a tweener and a tweener coming of an injury at that. On the open market, I think he's be lucky to get HALF of his current contract let alone what he wants.

So fine. Call his bluff. Tell him in the rudest way possible that no he's not irreplaceable, and that the 'hawks WILL replace him ideally by trade (getting something is better than nothing), but by cutting if need be. I'd also play Patriot style hardball as well by trading or cutting him by week nine so he CAN'T accrue an earned season if he continues to hold out.

I would make the deadline the first regular season game. Tell him point blank, if he's not there by then, he's no longer a Seahawk....one way or another. Yes, that more like what Patriots would do, but sometimes in order to be nice, you have to show your teeth once in a while. This IMHO is such a case.

Amazing how much certain fans want to take someone's money and use analogies of people getting their heads cut off.

This is business. Not personal. I want Kam back as much as any fan but let's slow down the violent rhetoric.

Getting fired is "just business" unless you are the one being fired. I have to tell you, based on what I'm hearing today, it's gotten personal, and I strongly suspect from Kam's side it was personal from the very start. So no, I will not back off my rhetoric.

As for the inequities in NFL contracts, well, that's part of the contract (specifically the CBA). NFL players sign their contracts knowing they can be cancelled by the team at any time. That includes Kam.

 

[bbsplitter]

Question: For the fine money, is that subtracted from the cap hit? For example if we only have 4 million left in cap space, and he is fined 1 million, does that mean we get 5 million in cap space now? Or is it simply money that goes back to the organization/owner, with no consequences on the cap? Personally I don't think Paul Allen is going to be worried about getting peanuts like that back, unless it helps alleviate some cap pressure

 

[Polaris]

Let Kam sit out the entire year. I don't see any other resolution on the Seahawks side that wouldn't have every player holding out for more money with three years left on their contract. This hold out makes no sense at all... even less than Russell's stance that he was going to play out his final year.

Kam sits out this season and then he still has to play for three more years on the same contract if he wants to play in the NFL at all. Good luck making up the lost millions later. I still think he may be hiding an injury.

What he will do is come back week 10. Then he counts as having played. If he pulls that crap I just don't let him play the last 6. Then next year have him hold out 10 games and do the same thing. At the end of the day he loves to play football. He won't love missing it. The game moves on without you bruh.

Good luck Kam.

The problem is, he doesn't have to play to get credit (which is why I agree that Kam will come back on week 10). He just has to be on the active roster or IR roster to be paid. That is why I suggest cutting him in week 9 if no trade can be had and he's still holding out. Then there's no accrued year.

 

[Polaris]

Question: For the fine money, is that subtracted from the cap hit? For example if we only have 4 million left in cap space, and he is fined 1 million, does that mean we get 5 million in cap space now? Or is it simply money that goes back to the organization/owner, with no consequences on the cap? Personally I don't think Paul Allen is going to be worried about getting peanuts like that back, unless it helps alleviate some cap pressure

I don't believe the fines affect the Cap one way or the other. The organization simply gets that money back (which is why in most hold-outs, the organization almost never enforces the fines....there's no real incentive to do so).

 

[ImTheScientist]

Let Kam sit out the entire year. I don't see any other resolution on the Seahawks side that wouldn't have every player holding out for more money with three years left on their contract. This hold out makes no sense at all... even less than Russell's stance that he was going to play out his final year.

Kam sits out this season and then he still has to play for three more years on the same contract if he wants to play in the NFL at all. Good luck making up the lost millions later. I still think he may be hiding an injury.

What he will do is come back week 10. Then he counts as having played. If he pulls that crap I just don't let him play the last 6. Then next year have him hold out 10 games and do the same thing. At the end of the day he loves to play football. He won't love missing it. The game moves on without you bruh.

Good luck Kam.

The problem is, he doesn't have to play to get credit (which is why I agree that Kam will come back on week 10). He just has to be on the active roster or IR roster to be paid. That is why I suggest cutting him in week 9 if no trade can be had and he's still holding out. Then there's no accrued year.

Im fine with him accruing the year. Just don't play him. He is still a hawk for 2 more years after that. Keep doing the same thing and when you don't play ball for 2-3 years and you are that much older...good luck.

 

[StoneCold]

The three years left thing is a bit of misnomer as he is in the last year of his guaranteed contract. If the team can bail on the non guaranteed part it is smart for the player to make moves now.

True, but is it fair for Kam to come back after getting all his bonus and guaranteed money in the first two years..........and now want MORE guaranteed AND a higher base?

The reason the Hawks front loaded Kam's deal is so that it would be more cap friendly in the last 3 years because they knew huge extensions for Russell, Bobby and others were happening this year.

idk, seems disingenuous on Kam's part to be just fine with getting all his huge bonus and guaranteed money front loaded, and now have his hand out again two years later.

I get that it seems strange to us, but to him, he could be cut next Feb and he gets nothing out of the rest of his contract. So is it really a contract? They cut McDaniel when he was "Under Contract" for 3 mil. Seems like a pretty flimsy contract.

G on Kiro just told a story where Kam had to have emergency surgery a week after SB 48 for internal bleeding.

It's a brutal game, and they know that, and they know how contracts work. He's playing hardball. Not sure I can really fault him for that.

 

[onanygivensunday]

Kam's salary for this year is guaranteed... unless he continues his holdout past week 1, in which case he won't get his game check(s).... plural, depending on how regular season weeks (games) he holds out.

The most Kam can be fined, however, is $1M, which is his prorated signing bonus for this year.

 

[Polaris]

The three years left thing is a bit of misnomer as he is in the last year of his guaranteed contract. If the team can bail on the non guaranteed part it is smart for the player to make moves now.

True, but is it fair for Kam to come back after getting all his bonus and guaranteed money in the first two years..........and now want MORE guaranteed AND a higher base?

The reason the Hawks front loaded Kam's deal is so that it would be more cap friendly in the last 3 years because they knew huge extensions for Russell, Bobby and others were happening this year.

idk, seems disingenuous on Kam's part to be just fine with getting all his huge bonus and guaranteed money front loaded, and now have his hand out again two years later.

I get that it seems strange to us, but to him, he could be cut next Feb and he gets nothing out of the rest of his contract. So is it really a contract? They cut McDaniel when he was "Under Contract" for 3 mil. Seems like a pretty flimsy contract.

G on Kiro just told a story where Kam had to have emergency surgery a week after SB 48 for internal bleeding.

It's a brutal game, and they know that, and they know how contracts work. He's playing hardball. Not sure I can really fault him for that.

I heard that story too, and I get where Kam is coming from. Let's all admit that the NFLPA got *worked* by the owners when they agreed to the latest CBA. All that said, since when has this organization pulled something like that? Near as I can tell, even when the 'hawks were willing (or had to) move on from a veteran, they've given that vet every chance to find work elsewhere. Kam has to know this as well.

I would say that what Kam is doing now is increasing his chance to be uncerimoniously cut in the manner that you posit.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

The three years left thing is a bit of misnomer as he is in the last year of his guaranteed contract. If the team can bail on the non guaranteed part it is smart for the player to make moves now.

True, but is it fair for Kam to come back after getting all his bonus and guaranteed money in the first two years..........and now want MORE guaranteed AND a higher base?

The reason the Hawks front loaded Kam's deal is so that it would be more cap friendly in the last 3 years because they knew huge extensions for Russell, Bobby and others were happening this year.

idk, seems disingenuous on Kam's part to be just fine with getting all his huge bonus and guaranteed money front loaded, and now have his hand out again two years later.

I get that it seems strange to us, but to him, he could be cut next Feb and he gets nothing out of the rest of his contract. So is it really a contract? They cut McDaniel when he was "Under Contract" for 3 mil. Seems like a pretty flimsy contract.

G on Kiro just told a story where Kam had to have emergency surgery a week after SB 48 for internal bleeding.

It's a brutal game, and they know that, and they know how contracts work. He's playing hardball. Not sure I can really fault him for that.

Getting 6.1 and 8.25M base isn't nothing. But I understand it's not guaranteed.

Like I said, it's not the money to the Hawks, it's not the base, it's not the guaranteed, it's not the bonus...........it's the precedent. Ripping up Kam's deal with three year's left opens up Pandora's Box.

 

[onanygivensunday]

The three years left thing is a bit of misnomer as he is in the last year of his guaranteed contract. If the team can bail on the non guaranteed part it is smart for the player to make moves now.

True, but is it fair for Kam to come back after getting all his bonus and guaranteed money in the first two years..........and now want MORE guaranteed AND a higher base?

The reason the Hawks front loaded Kam's deal is so that it would be more cap friendly in the last 3 years because they knew huge extensions for Russell, Bobby and others were happening this year.

idk, seems disingenuous on Kam's part to be just fine with getting all his huge bonus and guaranteed money front loaded, and now have his hand out again two years later.

I get that it seems strange to us, but to him, he could be cut next Feb and he gets nothing out of the rest of his contract. So is it really a contract? They cut McDaniel when he was "Under Contract" for 3 mil. Seems like a pretty flimsy contract.

G on Kiro just told a story where Kam had to have emergency surgery a week after SB 48 for internal bleeding.

It's a brutal game, and they know that, and they know how contracts work. He's playing hardball. Not sure I can really fault him for that.

I can... but holding out is his prerogative.

Sounds to me like he doesn't want to play football anymore... not at $284,375/game.

 

[StoneCold]

What is Kam's cap hit in years 3 and 4 of his contract? If the Hawks cut him next Feb, how much do they have to eat?

 

[mrt144]

Tell him he shows up by X date or they will collect on the bill. Every once in awhile a public execution is needed.

Save it for people who don't have as much value to the team in every aspect.

 

[onanygivensunday]

What is Kam's cap hit in years 3 and 4 of his contract? If the Hawks cut him next Feb, how much do they have to eat?

His prorated bonus is $1M/year... so $2M in dead money... but $4.1M in cap savings in 2016 and another $7.125M in 2017.

Source... http://overthecap.com/player/kam-chancellor/847