New Offensive Coordinator Idea

[MontanaHawk05]

Bevel is an excellent play caller, he is not the one out there making throws, he calls the plays and RW is given the option to audible, because weve seen it so its not like Bevel sits there and goes "alright Russ, you're running just this play" RW brings a set of plays into the huddle and is able change it at the line.

Yeah, play action on 3rd and 10+ is an excellent play call.

 

[DavidSeven]

Ah right.

'Articles'.

Let's put our faith in those instead of Pete Carroll.

What a thoroughly hopeless argument.

It's not about "articles" it's about a general consensus around the league. By people who know what they are talking about i.e. not you. But we don't want to have our own opinions do we? I bet you made a great hall monitor.

You cited an article from June that lists Tom Clements, Pep Hamilton and Kyle Shanahan in the top 10....

Clements and Hamilton lost their jobs. Shanahan is under fire in Atlanta.

But I guess the Panthers should fire Mike Shula, as he did not crack this NFL.com article either. If only one of these "top 10" guys were running their offense -- they might be in the Super Bowl!

 

[mrt144]

DavidSven, hypothetically, what would it take for you to sour on Bevell?

 

[DavidSeven]

DavidSven, hypothetically, what would it take for you to sour on Bevell?

What would it take? An offense that consistently under-performs over a meaningful period of time, based on either statistical evidence or a clear regression of the QB.

We have a Top-7 offense every year, in spite of horrendous OL play and a ball-control mentality. This year, we were arguably the 2nd or 3rd best offense in the NFL with a 30th ranked OL.

All I ever ask: show me the numbers that suggest he's been unsuccessful. I don't want to hear about some redzone fade that you didn't like. There are a dozen variables in every play. Big picture, do we score points? Under Bevell, that answer has been 'yes.'

 

[seahawks08]

I like Bevell. Its installing Pete's philosophy of playing conservative in the first 2 quarters is what gets us mostly. I think in games where we started with a fire and played lose, we were good. When you are forced to use some players or find to make them involved in a game, the plan goes haywire. Go with who is open and go with what the defense gives you rather than keep doing what we do unless they beat us mantra. I think the offense has evolved a lot until the playoffs where we went back to playing conservative and feeling out the defense first. By the time we caught up, we had to depend on luck or the time ran out. If we kept keeping the defense guessing and not forced using Marshawn in the first couple of drives, we would have been just fine in the Carolina game too. But hindsight and what ifs are not what gives you a win, so I rest my case.

 

[nash72]

I hate Bevell and have always said we win despite of him and not because of him. I can never forgive him for calling the worst play in sports history last superbowl, nor will I ever understand why the Seahawks have to run that lame conservative offense in every first half of every single game it seems. Look at the Seahawks over the last 4 or so years and see how many games they have blown people out? 1 maybe 2 a season. Theres no excuse for that. Nobody wants to take into consideration how many broken plays there are in a game either with Wilson running around and making a sandlot play out of nothing. The Vikings sure arent crying about missing Bevell when he left and I sure wouldnt either if he left Seattle.

Maybe we'll get lucky and Bevell will accept one of those many head coaching positions that are always offered to him. Oh wait,,,,,,,,

 

[McGruff]

DavidSven, hypothetically, what would it take for you to sour on Bevell?

What would it take? An offense that consistently under-performs over a meaningful period of time, based on either statistical evidence or a clear regression of the QB.

We have a Top-7 offense every year, in spite of horrendous OL play and a ball-control mentality. This year, we were arguably the 2nd or 3rd best offense in the NFL with a 30th ranked OL.

All I ever ask: show me the numbers that suggest he's been unsuccessful. I don't want to hear about some redzone fade that you didn't like. There are a dozen variables in every play. Big picture, do we score points? Under Bevell, that answer has been 'yes.'

I like you.

The classical art of rhetoric dictates that arguments should also be made from the general to the specific. But most fans tend to do it the other way. They argue from the specific to the general.

Since the play call in last year's Superbowl sucked, Bevell must be a bad playcaller!

it's called the fallacy of composition. It makes for arguments that are impossible to prove.

But when you start from the general and then regress to the specific, you can get a clearer picture. The fact is that the Seahawks offense under Darell Bevell is the most prolific offense in Seahawks history. Yes, even better than Mike Holmgren's. The fact is that the last three years it has been one of the most productive offenses in the league. Fact is it has been all these things with a cast of WR's that were undrafted, and an offensive line that is hodge podge at best and that this year was missing 2 of its 3 all pro players for most of the season.

Specific play calls are great to debate, if the debate is genuine. But any given play call is a confluence of 4 different events . . . was it a good call? Was it properly executed? Did the other team make a good defensive play call? And did they execute well? It would be fun to look at individual plays as a community and break them down, but that's not what we tend to do. When a play doesn't work, its a bad play call! Fire Bevell!

But the bottom line is that Bevell now has a three year history (at a minimum) of coordinating an offense that IN GENERAL gets good results from average overall talent.

 

[theENGLISHseahawk]

I mean, it depends, i guess. Are they Bleacher Report articles?

They put together a slideshow called: 'Pro's who don't rate Bevell'.

But they misspelt Bevell -- and actually called him Gil Brandt.

Ah right.

'Articles'.

Let's put our faith in those instead of Pete Carroll.

What a thoroughly hopeless argument.

It's not about "articles" it's about a general consensus around the league. By people who know what they are talking about i.e. not you. But we don't want to have our own opinions do we? I bet you made a great hall monitor.

You cited an article from June that lists Tom Clements, Pep Hamilton and Kyle Shanahan in the top 10....

Clements and Hamilton lost their jobs. Shanahan is under fire in Atlanta.

But I guess the Panthers should fire Mike Shula, as he did not crack this NFL.com article either. If only one of these "top 10" guys were running their offense -- they might be in the Super Bowl!

:lol: :lol: :lol:

It gets better.

 

[McGruff]

Look at the Seahawks over the last 4 or so years and see how many games they have blown people out? 1 maybe 2 a season. Theres no excuse for that.

Defining "blowout" as winning by 2 touchdowns or more . . .

2015 - 7 blowout wins
2014 - 6 blowout wins
2013 - 7 blowout wins
2012 - 5 blowout wins

 

[scutterhawk]

I quoted an article earlier about who was considered the top-ten OC's in the NFL and no one mentioned Bevell who is OC of arguably the most talented team in the league. I have read tons of articles listing top OC's and he's never mentioned. His biggest claim to fame is making the worst call in the history of the NFL. Everyone knows that PC is a defense minded coach who prefers a conservative mistake free offense but without a competent oline and RB it stalls drives where we can't convert third downs. We saw the result of that the first half of the season. Everyone here thinks Bevell was responsible for RW's late season success but it was because we went away from his offense, not because of it, and then let RW be the dynamic player he is.

Read back through your post, and then break it down.
Your first sentence counters your own argument.....Bevell is the OC to "Arguably The Most Talented Team In The League"------They've succeeded WITH Bevell's help.
Bevell is NOT responsible for the development of the shitty play by the Offensive Line, what he is responsible for is, COORDINATING the Offensive Line to help give Wilson every opportunity to succeed, but all too often they get blown up because Defenses breech the non cohesive O-line and force Russell Wilson to go away from drawn up and practiced play-calls.
There's a reason that they call him a Coordinator.....It doesn't mean that he has sole responsibility for the failure of Cable's O-Line.
I have to question just how many of the "Professionals" that you're touting, have received a call from Pete Carroll asking them for advice......I'm betting that it's an itsy-bitsy, teensy-weensy number, eh?
There's lots of moving parts, lots of blame to go around..... Like who's responsible for the Defense falling apart in the first half of the Season, and letting several of the leads that we held that slipped away, for losses.
The blame is on the whole TEAM, not just one person.
OH AND ,Russell Wilson didn't have much faith in the O-Line giving him protection....It was Bevell who convinced him to give a try at passing from the pocket....Amazing how that worked out eh?

 

[dogorama]

We have had a good offense because we had RB that ran over people and didn't need a great Oline AND a future hall of fame QB who has the ability to extend plays that have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH THE PLAY CALLED. As for leaving up to the board to decide if Bevell is a good OC, no offense but most of these guys never even played high school football. Of course you would prefer that to professional opinions. Tell you what, next time you are having severe medical symptoms go down to the local watering hole and ask the locals what they think might be wrong with you. Good luck!

 

[canfan]

Hey 12's, long time fan/lurker, and first time poster. Anyways, as I was watching us shred the Panthers to pieces in the 2nd half of the game, I was just thinking "Bevell, where was this up tempo offense in the 1st half?" and then after the game it hit me, I know who could be a great O-Coordinator for us.

Lane Kiffin.

Think about it, he has turned Alabama into an explosive offensive ever since he's been there after being fired at SC. I hate him as a head coach (I'm also an SC fan) but DAMN, I think he would be perfect for us, especially since him and Pete go back to their SC days a decade ago.

Anyways, just wanted to hear some thoughts on this! :th2thumbs:

The only positive thing I can say about this is that I would drink more on Sundays. Its the only possible way I could tolerate seeing that smug face on the Seahawks sideline during a game. ukeface:

 

[marymoorhawk]

#4 in total yards in the league (#9 last year)
#4 in points per game in the league (#10 last year)

Bevell is the .net whipping boy, i get it, but at the end of the day this is a results driven league and those results are damn good and a lot more concrete than an article going on opinions of "coaching buddies".

Replacing him at this point would be crazy. You don't fire an OC who's offense was just top 5 in the league in both yards and scoring. Fortunately, Pete won't do that.

 

[hawksfansinceday1]

I get so tired of listening to fans who negatively rail on players on coaches all the time, and Bevell has been a never ending target for this Seahawks team.

I realize it's trendy to point fingers at scapegoat/mob mentality.

But sometimes it's got a point. A lot of Ruskell critics were hatched before the 2009 draft ever arrived. I remember quite a few people being ready to jettison the guy before Aaron Curry was ever drafted. (Anyone remember Puntilaphille?)

And I remember the contrarian pushback, calling the Ruskell criticism "mob mentality" and saying we should wait a while. John Morgan over at Fieldgulls reacted so strongly to the premature pitchforks and torches that he became a flat-out Ruskell apologist for most of the year.

Turns out the mob was right. They had little idea of WHY they were right, but they weren't wrong.

Puntilaphile and I were probably the first two to call for Timmmmmy's head and we got an incredible amount of grief here for it. As for why, I just felt like there was a slow but steady regression of the team after XL*. Well that, and the bungling of the Hutch thing.

As for Bevell, I'm not a huge fan of the guy, but I think he has been hamstrung by Pete's conservative offensive nature and having o-lines that have been at best below average and at worst horrific.

 

[canfan]

Oh, I just read the whole thread. I guess I'm too late for the "lets hang Bevell" circle jerk, but let me give it a try. Lets see....Pete and John are completely blind and too loyal to a total incompetent who costs this team game after game! And when he does happen to be involved in a victory it has nothing to do with his game plan or his calls. In these cases the team ignored his insane ramblings and fought their way to victory. Every defeat is only a product of the team's inability to overcome the "Bevell factor".

Carroll and Schneider are completely compromising the ability of the team to win games and if they would only fire Bevell, Britt will become inspired to be a pro bowl guard and the entire offensive line will begin to function like that well oiled machine we know they can be if it JUST WASN'T FOR BEVELL! (I almost forgot - a good hate Bevell circle jerk must ALWAYS include a few all cap words).

There, that should cover it. Now I can just sit back and wait for the Seahawks front office to heed my sage advice. I will check in next week to see who our new OC is. After all, there is no way the seahawks can keep
Bevell after Pete reads all the compelling arguments in this thread.

 

[117Jesus]

It's a hopeless argument because outside of smart-ass remarks you have no argument. It's a football message board where opinions are exchanged, not a place where you pretend to be the exclusive bastion of knowledge.

Im sorry, but anyone who thinks Bevell is a better play caller than Kiffin is a fool and pays no attention to detail.

 

[canfan]

It's a hopeless argument because outside of smart-ass remarks you have no argument. It's a football message board where opinions are exchanged, not a place where you pretend to be the exclusive bastion of knowledge.

Im sorry, but anyone who thinks Bevell is a better play caller than Kiffin is a fool and pays no attention to detail.

So why didn't Pete bring Kiffin on staff when USC let him go? He was certainly available and Pete certainly knows the relative value of both men better than most, having worked with both of them for several years. And I love how anybody who disagrees with your opinion is a "fool". So now you are omnipotent? Most of us don't take our usernames quite as seriously as you do "117Jesus"

 

[Sgt. Largent]

It's a hopeless argument because outside of smart-ass remarks you have no argument. It's a football message board where opinions are exchanged, not a place where you pretend to be the exclusive bastion of knowledge.

Im sorry, but anyone who thinks Bevell is a better play caller than Kiffin is a fool and pays no attention to detail.

The NFL is the ultimate meritocracy, if Kiffin was a better anything he'd still be coaching in the NFL..........instead of being bounced out of every job he's been at, and bounced out early.

Plus he's shady, just ask the University of Tennessee.

 

[dogorama]

Here's the deal, at midpoint of the season 90% of you would have called for Bevell's head. RW's second half success changed that and that wasn't because of Bevell it was because RW was allowed to have a freeer hand.

 

[dogorama]

I quoted an article earlier about who was considered the top-ten OC's in the NFL and no one mentioned Bevell who is OC of arguably the most talented team in the league. I have read tons of articles listing top OC's and he's never mentioned. His biggest claim to fame is making the worst call in the history of the NFL. Everyone knows that PC is a defense minded coach who prefers a conservative mistake free offense but without a competent oline and RB it stalls drives where we can't convert third downs. We saw the result of that the first half of the season. Everyone here thinks Bevell was responsible for RW's late season success but it was because we went away from his offense, not because of it, and then let RW be the dynamic player he is.

Read back through your post, and then break it down.
Your first sentence counters your own argument.....Bevell is the OC to "Arguably The Most Talented Team In The League"------They've succeeded WITH Bevell's help.
Bevell is NOT responsible for the development of the shitty play by the Offensive Line, what he is responsible for is, COORDINATING the Offensive Line to help give Wilson every opportunity to succeed, but all too often they get blown up because Defenses breech the non cohesive O-line and force Russell Wilson to go away from drawn up and practiced play-calls.
There's a reason that they call him a Coordinator.....It doesn't mean that he has sole responsibility for the failure of Cable's O-Line.

nobody is going to argue that the Oline is anything but horrible but to blame some of those comebacks on the defense is just ignorant. Go back back and watch the games...the offense went three-and-out over and over. They simply wore out.