Very good article about Tate's departure, FA stuff, and othe

[WilsonMVP]

Wow, I have rarely seen such a pile of self delusion in one article. Golden Tate is a prototype, he can break tackles, make the big play, and is not just a willing blocker, but a fantastic blocker. Success has gone to the heads of the FO and coach of the Hawks. They won not because of their expertise, but because of chemistry between coaches and players. They have broken it down, and will now start over. We may be good again in 2015, but this coming year will be more like 10-6. Remember how the GB dynasty of a couple of years ago looked? Guess what, same type of front office moves, team went in the dumpster.

GB also have had injury problems and Charles Woodson left which was one of the reasons that D was so good. OH and they never really had a running game. They barely even made the playoffs the year they won the superbowl and had to rely on 2-3 other teams blowing it at the end of the season to even get in. They year after the superbowl they also went 15-1 and then 11-5

 

[Penman96]

Pfftt - Tate is not a prototype

I respect that he took the cash and all that, but this front office showed that guy a lot of patience for the first two years while he sucked. Let's not forget that. He could have just as easily been cut in 2012 and he probably wouldn't be playing now if our FO hadn't given him 2nd, 3rd, and 4th chances.

He's a slot or a number 2 receiver at best. There are a dozen receivers in this draft that are better. That Detroit are stupid enough to pay him 6 million / year is irrelevant, we are talking about a team that's paying Stafford $17.8, Megatron $13 ($20 million next year), and Suh $22 million. They don't have a clue what they are doing.

Thank goodness we have JS and PC here. Good luck to Tate, but let's face it, we weren't exactly begging him to stay.

 

[-The Glove-]

Well, I am definitely drafting Tate in fantasy football now. At or near the top in YAC, punt return efficiency and drop rate every year, fast, blocks great, and never gets hurt. Now going to an offense that puts up video game pass attempt numbers, living in the shadow of Calvin Johnson.

$6 million is going to look like a steal for Tate in Detroit. That article is going to look silly in a year's time. Not for supporting Seattle's decision, but for underestimating Tate. Seattle will be just fine, we'll find guys that fit us and the loss of Tate will likely be marginal. I see no reason to dump on Tate though. Tate is about to break out.

I don't see it as a knock on Tate at all. Of course, Tate does a lot of things that make him more than just a type but he's not worth the 6+ mill per year on THIS offense

 

[-The Glove-]

Lol...a lot of butthurt going around. Geez.

 

[mjwhitay]

How can anyone think that Golden Tate is a "prototype" in the way the author of this article frames it? We have a much better version of this same guy. He wears #11. HE is a prototype.

 

[Cartire]

Some people must have missed the last 5 games of the year.

Like the last game of the season against the rams with that spectacular TD.

Must have missed it.

He's not as good as Doug or Harvin, and we needed to make the move to have one big WR. My guess is the 32 pick will be Mathews and people will forget all about Tate.

Prove to me that Doug is better then Tate without using a few clutch plays in the playoffs as an overall point of a WRs ability. Over the longevity of their careers here, please present something that makes this statement true in anyway.

Doug is great, but it seems like people get to attached to a few big plays, and then end up defining someone whole skill set on those.

DB had a great playoff run.
Tate and a great season run.

One is just more recent.

 

[sc85sis]

I think Tate may fall somewhere between just typical "type" and actual "prototype" because he has such good hands (best in the NFL the last 2-3 years), blocks well AND is an excellent punt returner. He's replaceable, but it might be a little more difficult to replace him with a guy that's good at all three things. We'd certainly preferred if he stayed, but the overall cost meant we couldn't.

And so, we move on.

Can you find me evidence of this, as well as comparing it to other WR's on Pass heavy Teams compared to our Run first team. Also as a QB to WR attempts/Targeted.. Because so far I don't see anything supporting this.. "Golden Tate has the best hands in the NFL"

"Golden Tate, who signed a three-year deal with the Lions on Wednesday, has dropped only five passes since 2011. He caught 144 of 149 catchable balls thrown his way in that time, according to ProFootballFocus.

"That's the best ratio of any receiver in the NFL."
http://www.mlive.com/lions/index.ssf/20 ... _tate.html

 

[Smelly McUgly]

Baldwin had a fine season as well.

Tate and Baldwin are two different types of receiver, so it's not a direct comparison. I truly believe that behind Welker, there is no better slot receiver in the game right now than Baldwin. Tate is much more of a flanker type. He's a good flanker, but I prefer having a precise route-runner over Tate's YAC and high-pointing abilities. I also think Baldwin has a ridiculous knack for getting open that even Tate doesn't have (though to be fair to Tate, the latter was playing #1 CBs for much of the second half of the year).

If I wanted to keep one, it would be Baldwin, but I said this before Tate left. I still hope they extend Baldwin right now. The guy just overwhelms slot CBs, knows where the sticks are, has body control on par with Tate, and is a fine blocker in his own right.

 

[Trenchbroom]

Golden Tate IS a prototype. The prototype of a #2 receiver.

The article is spot on IMO.

 

[-The Glove-]

Some people must have missed the last 5 games of the year.

Like the last game of the season against the rams with that spectacular TD.

Must have missed it.

He's not as good as Doug or Harvin, and we needed to make the move to have one big WR. My guess is the 32 pick will be Mathews and people will forget all about Tate.

Prove to me that Doug is better then Tate without using a few clutch plays in the playoffs as an overall point of a WRs ability. Over the longevity of their careers here, please present something that makes this statement true in anyway.

Doug is great, but it seems like people get to attached to a few big plays, and then end up defining someone whole skill set on those.

DB had a great playoff run.
Tate and a great season run.

One is just more recent.

Golden Tate
2013
64 rec. 898 yds. 14 avg. 5 TDs

Doug Baldwin
2013
50 rec. 778 yds. 15.6 avg. 5 TDs

Career
Tate
165 rec. 2195 yds. 13.3 avg. 15 TDs
DB
130 rec. 1932 yds. 14.9 avg. 12 tds

Keep in mind Tate was our #1 for like half the season and he has 1 yr over Baldwin

 

[WilsonMVP]

Some people must have missed the last 5 games of the year.

Like the last game of the season against the rams with that spectacular TD.

Must have missed it.

He's not as good as Doug or Harvin, and we needed to make the move to have one big WR. My guess is the 32 pick will be Mathews and people will forget all about Tate.

Prove to me that Doug is better then Tate without using a few clutch plays in the playoffs as an overall point of a WRs ability. Over the longevity of their careers here, please present something that makes this statement true in anyway.

Doug is great, but it seems like people get to attached to a few big plays, and then end up defining someone whole skill set on those.

DB had a great playoff run.
Tate and a great season run.

One is just more recent.

I dont know if Baldwin is "better" but they are pretty much the same
Tate 98 Targets 64 catches 898 yards 5 TD
Baldwin 73 Targets 50 catches 778 yards 5 TD

Baldwin had a higher AVG, same ammount of TDs and unlike Tate came up huge during the playoffs.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

This is pertinent -- this is what a friend who's a Lions fan wrote to me when I said Tate could rip it up in the Lions offense:

...or we'll further discover how excellent Russell Wilson was at accuracy when Tate sees his excellent hands falter trying to bring in Stafford's wounded ducks.

That definitely made me think. Could part of the reason our entire team has great catch rate numbers be related to Wilson's accuracy and touch? Would our group have the same "hands" numbers if they were catching side-arm ducks from Stafford?

Didn't you ever notice how our chronic Holmgren-era drop problems lessened dramatically after 2010?

 

[Exittium]

I think Tate may fall somewhere between just typical "type" and actual "prototype" because he has such good hands (best in the NFL the last 2-3 years), blocks well AND is an excellent punt returner. He's replaceable, but it might be a little more difficult to replace him with a guy that's good at all three things. We'd certainly preferred if he stayed, but the overall cost meant we couldn't.

And so, we move on.

Can you find me evidence of this, as well as comparing it to other WR's on Pass heavy Teams compared to our Run first team. Also as a QB to WR attempts/Targeted.. Because so far I don't see anything supporting this.. "Golden Tate has the best hands in the NFL"

"Golden Tate, who signed a three-year deal with the Lions on Wednesday, has dropped only five passes since 2011. He caught 144 of 149 catchable balls thrown his way in that time, according to ProFootballFocus.

"That's the best ratio of any receiver in the NFL."
http://www.mlive.com/lions/index.ssf/20 ... _tate.html

Okay so my point still remains true "Catch-able Balls thrown" 144 out of 149.. what happened to his 2010 season when we drafted him? Does it say exactly how many times he was targetd and thrown to. Because I know quiet a few times this yr RW had some very catch-able throws that DB, JK and PH went out for.. Still not seeing any validity anything you've mentioned. Also I be you believe Foles is the next best up and coming Manning Legacy type QB based off his Qbr for NOT starting.. you know once again the less there is to average the better the number is..

 

[Meeker]

This is pertinent -- this is what a friend who's a Lions fan wrote to me when I said Tate could rip it up in the Lions offense:

...or we'll further discover how excellent Russell Wilson was at accuracy when Tate sees his excellent hands falter trying to bring in Stafford's wounded ducks.

That definitely made me think. Could part of the reason our entire team has great catch rate numbers be related to Wilson's accuracy and touch? Would our group have the same "hands" numbers if they were catching side-arm ducks from Stafford?

Tate dropped zero passes in 2011 with Tarvaris Jackson throwing him the ball...he will be fine.

 

[theascension]

Tate is very good and I'm going to miss him but the Superbowl made clear our priorities are defense and that's really the end of the story.

Bennett and great linemen are more valued by pc/js and I don't think anyone can disagree that's the wrong methodology until results prove otherwise (if lions win superbowl next year, sure I'll admit it was a big mistake).

 

[DavidSeven]

This is pertinent -- this is what a friend who's a Lions fan wrote to me when I said Tate could rip it up in the Lions offense:

...or we'll further discover how excellent Russell Wilson was at accuracy when Tate sees his excellent hands falter trying to bring in Stafford's wounded ducks.

That definitely made me think. Could part of the reason our entire team has great catch rate numbers be related to Wilson's accuracy and touch? Would our group have the same "hands" numbers if they were catching side-arm ducks from Stafford?

Didn't you ever notice how our chronic Holmgren-era drop problems lessened dramatically after 2010?

Yes. Personally, I always felt D-Jack and our other WRs were unfairly criticized for dropping passes. Hasselbeck had almost no touch on his balls early in his Seahawks tenure. Everything he threw early on was a bullet to the chest.

 

[HawkFan72]

Well, I am definitely drafting Tate in fantasy football now. At or near the top in YAC, punt return efficiency and drop rate every year, fast, blocks great, and never gets hurt. Now going to an offense that puts up video game pass attempt numbers, living in the shadow of Calvin Johnson.

$6 million is going to look like a steal for Tate in Detroit. That article is going to look silly in a year's time. Not for supporting Seattle's decision, but for underestimating Tate. Seattle will be just fine, we'll find guys that fit us and the loss of Tate will likely be marginal. I see no reason to dump on Tate though. Tate is about to break out.

I do agree with this. I said after he signed that if notoriety and money were what he wanted, Tate absolutely made the right decision.

He was never going to be a "star" in Seattle (he said so himself) but he has a chance to be a very successful WR in Detroit. Big numbers and good press.

If that's what is most important to him, Seattle could never give him that.

 

[plyka]

Wow, I have rarely seen such a pile of self delusion in one article. Golden Tate is a prototype, he can break tackles, make the big play, and is not just a willing blocker, but a fantastic blocker. Success has gone to the heads of the FO and coach of the Hawks. They won not because of their expertise, but because of chemistry between coaches and players. They have broken it down, and will now start over. We may be good again in 2015, but this coming year will be more like 10-6. Remember how the GB dynasty of a couple of years ago looked? Guess what, same type of front office moves, team went in the dumpster.

Is this a serious post? The team is going to come crashing down to a 10-6 record and even further travesty in the future because Golden Tate is not here, lol...I understand the emotional attachment that fans have towards TAte but this is getting C-R-A-Z-Y!

Tate is an average WR. I wish him all the luck, but he is not even an above average WR. He is a #3 guy on most teams, PERHAPS a #2 if he can improve his ability to get open. He is damn good after the catch, and has good hands --these are his highlights. His lowlights are his inability to beat press coverage and get open when a DB is covering him 1 v 1.

In fact the exact opposite of your post is true. For a SB team to come crashing down, what they do is overpay for mediocre, yes i said mediocre, players, OVerpaying Tate would be the formula you need to follow to turn this team into a 10-6 team and a team which would crash later on to becoming mediocre.

 

[themunn]

How can anyone think that Golden Tate is a "prototype" in the way the author of this article frames it? We have a much better version of this same guy. He wears #11. HE is a prototype.

If Harvin is a prototype why does he rank 6th in receiving yards out of the 2009 draft class, with 0 1000 yard seasons, something all 5 above him plus another have managed? Something 24 players managed last year? Players playing with all manner of QBs. Josh Gordon led the league last year playing for the Browns with NO running game, Ponder is no excuse.

The whole "prototype" thing is bull**** anyway, Aaron Curry was a prototype remember?

Anyone thinking we can just pick up another guy and he'll slot right in and perform to Tate's level needs to open their eyes to how many receivers we've HAD to try out over the last 4 years because the ones we had weren't up to scratch.
Did you know that Tate's 898 yards last year is the highest total since Carroll took over? Maybe just maybe it's got something to do with how little we pass that he's not a "prototype number 1 receiver" than anything else. That and - like the reason for Harvin's numbers, his value isn't measured in yardage, he is a short-to-middle route receiver, his value is in being able to receive the ball within 10 yards of the line of scrimmage and break a few tackles to take it further. How often do you see him run a deep route? Almost never, because we've got a guy like Baldwin doing that (who does it very well, and hence the reason for his much higher average yards per catch).

Tate will be a great player in Detroit, and I'd go as far as saying that Detroit can now rival Chicago for the best WR tandem in the league.

 

[SalishHawkFan]

This is pertinent -- this is what a friend who's a Lions fan wrote to me when I said Tate could rip it up in the Lions offense:

...or we'll further discover how excellent Russell Wilson was at accuracy when Tate sees his excellent hands falter trying to bring in Stafford's wounded ducks.

That definitely made me think. Could part of the reason our entire team has great catch rate numbers be related to Wilson's accuracy and touch? Would our group have the same "hands" numbers if they were catching side-arm ducks from Stafford?

Didn't you ever notice how our chronic Holmgren-era drop problems lessened dramatically after 2010?

I always blamed that on Matt. WR's who had chronic dropsies would get cured of the dropsies once they left the Hawks while WR's who had never had the dropsies would suddenly have them once Matt was throwing to them.