Very good article about Tate's departure, FA stuff, and othe

[SoulfishHawk]

Aaron Curry - Safest Pick in the Draft

Smell Diaper

 

[StoneCold]

Well, I am definitely drafting Tate in fantasy football now. At or near the top in YAC, punt return efficiency and drop rate every year, fast, blocks great, and never gets hurt. Now going to an offense that puts up video game pass attempt numbers, living in the shadow of Calvin Johnson.

$6 million is going to look like a steal for Tate in Detroit. That article is going to look silly in a year's time. Not for supporting Seattle's decision, but for underestimating Tate. Seattle will be just fine, we'll find guys that fit us and the loss of Tate will likely be marginal. I see no reason to dump on Tate though. Tate is about to break out.

Best freaking post on Tate. Well done and thank you.

SC

 

[plyka]

Some people must have missed the last 5 games of the year.

Like the last game of the season against the rams with that spectacular TD.

Must have missed it.

He's not as good as Doug or Harvin, and we needed to make the move to have one big WR. My guess is the 32 pick will be Mathews and people will forget all about Tate.

Prove to me that Doug is better then Tate without using a few clutch plays in the playoffs as an overall point of a WRs ability. Over the longevity of their careers here, please present something that makes this statement true in anyway.

Doug is great, but it seems like people get to attached to a few big plays, and then end up defining someone whole skill set on those.

DB had a great playoff run.
Tate and a great season run.

One is just more recent.

How in the world is anyone going to "prove" one is better than the other? Tate has played 4 years now, Baldwin has played 2 years. If you put weight on how each player played during their first 2 years then of course Baldwin would be miles ahead of Tate. If you look at just last year you could make an argument that Tate was more productive, but that Baldwin beat him in other areas like efficiency (yards per catch, yards per target, etc). If you put weight on Baldwin's first year, then he had more total production than Tate. If you put more wieght on the specific stats that Tate is better, like YAC or breaking tackles, then Tate has the advantage.

But who is going to decide what you put more weight on? Further clouding the issue are the folks that make up random stats --how many times have I heard it that Baldwin's production is actually due to Tate, because even though Tate did nothing in the playoffs, he somehow "opened things up" for Baldwin, etc.

In the end you have to use some common sense. Baldwin and Tate are probably close. Baldwin obviously has more room to grow as a WR, since he is just going into his 3rd year --the year most NFL WRs breakout. While Tate is at or close to his peak, going into his 5th year I believe.

edit: Correction, Baldwin has played 3 seasons not 2.

 

[gargantual]

Whatever everyone has to tell themselves to feel better.

Sheesh.

 

[mjwhitay]

If Harvin is a prototype why does he rank 6th in receiving yards out of the 2009 draft class, with 0 1000 yard seasons, something all 5 above him plus another have managed? Something 24 players managed last year? Players playing with all manner of QBs. Josh Gordon led the league last year playing for the Browns with NO running game, Ponder is no excuse.

The whole "prototype" thing is bull**** anyway, Aaron Curry was a prototype remember?

Anyone thinking we can just pick up another guy and he'll slot right in and perform to Tate's level needs to open their eyes to how many receivers we've HAD to try out over the last 4 years because the ones we had weren't up to scratch.
Did you know that Tate's 898 yards last year is the highest total since Carroll took over? Maybe just maybe it's got something to do with how little we pass that he's not a "prototype number 1 receiver" than anything else. That and - like the reason for Harvin's numbers, his value isn't measured in yardage, he is a short-to-middle route receiver, his value is in being able to receive the ball within 10 yards of the line of scrimmage and break a few tackles to take it further. How often do you see him run a deep route? Almost never, because we've got a guy like Baldwin doing that (who does it very well, and hence the reason for his much higher average yards per catch).

Tate will be a great player in Detroit, and I'd go as far as saying that Detroit can now rival Chicago for the best WR tandem in the league.

If you judge Percy Harvin on receiving yards, we can't even have a conversation. You don't have a firm grasp on what makes him so unique and I'll never win the argument.

 

[CEHawk]

A lot of misguided posts on here... I love Tate and love his YAC but Tate is a poor man's Percy Harvin. Similar players and Baldwin is our slot and 3rd down guy and also similar to Tate. In fact we have 3 guys that run slot well. We need a big man in there and JS and PC know it. Did Tate have value for us? sure but he was not a great fit with what we already have. And for those comparing Tate and Baldwin this year, they both had great years.

Tate and Baldwin had different roles, but including Post Season Baldwin had 980 yards off 88 targets. Tate had 959 yards off 113 targets.

I think Detroit is a better fit for Tate and he will do extremely well there.

I also think that if we get a big man as our number one or two we will be better off as well.

 

[themunn]

If Harvin is a prototype why does he rank 6th in receiving yards out of the 2009 draft class, with 0 1000 yard seasons, something all 5 above him plus another have managed? Something 24 players managed last year? Players playing with all manner of QBs. Josh Gordon led the league last year playing for the Browns with NO running game, Ponder is no excuse.

The whole "prototype" thing is bull**** anyway, Aaron Curry was a prototype remember?

Anyone thinking we can just pick up another guy and he'll slot right in and perform to Tate's level needs to open their eyes to how many receivers we've HAD to try out over the last 4 years because the ones we had weren't up to scratch.
Did you know that Tate's 898 yards last year is the highest total since Carroll took over? Maybe just maybe it's got something to do with how little we pass that he's not a "prototype number 1 receiver" than anything else. That and - like the reason for Harvin's numbers, his value isn't measured in yardage, he is a short-to-middle route receiver, his value is in being able to receive the ball within 10 yards of the line of scrimmage and break a few tackles to take it further. How often do you see him run a deep route? Almost never, because we've got a guy like Baldwin doing that (who does it very well, and hence the reason for his much higher average yards per catch).

Tate will be a great player in Detroit, and I'd go as far as saying that Detroit can now rival Chicago for the best WR tandem in the league.

If you judge Percy Harvin on receiving yards, we can't even have a conversation. You don't have a firm grasp on what makes him so unique and I'll never win the argument.

If you read my post correctly you'd see I wasn't, and I was chastising those that are judging Tate on receiving yards

 

[Popeyejones]

http://seattlesportsnet.com/2014/03/12/golden-tate-and-the-conundrum-of-replaceable-players/

I love the way the article starts out...

There are more than a few dozen Golden Tates. He is a type. He is not the prototype. He is not Calvin Johnson. You can replace a Golden Tate with another Tate-type. You cannot replace a Calvin Johnson, a prototype, when only one of his kind, a six-foot-five-inch speedster with hands like cocoa butter, exists.

Hooray for false dilemmas! And where are these teeming masses who have taken the position that Tate IS the equivalent of Calvin Johnson? :lol:

As for there being more than a few dozen Golden Tate's (meaning at least 50 similar players in the NFL right now), I'd sure like to see the author's list. Just because a guy leads the league in a couple of positive statistical categories doesn't mean he's the best in the league, but it also draws into question if he's the proverbial dime a dozen that the author claims.

Put another way, if the standard of contribution to a team is being the prototype, we wouldn't have teams.

Or by way of comparison, Hines Ward wasn't Calvin Johnson either. Stupid, worthless, Hines Ward.

(sorry, as already established I'm a pretty big Tate fan).

 

[MontanaHawk05]

Would you like some irony?

A year ago at this time, I was jonesing to win a Super Bowl in order to shut up the rest of the country.

Now I'm jonesing to win another Super Bowl in order to shut up A BUNCH OF SEAHAWKS FANS.

 

[Hawkstorian]

That article is complete horseshit. You think you can "replace" a guy? How about we draft a guy in the 4th round! Oh wait he sucked and we CUT him.

The concept of "replacement value" in MLB does not work in the NFL. Replacement Value means Bryan Walters, not Golden Tate. If he's confident we can go out and find a bunch of Bryan Walters then I agree completely. WHOOOPEEEE!!!

Stupid Stupid Stupid.

 

[rigelian]

Would you like some irony?

A year ago at this time, I was jonesing to win a Super Bowl in order to shut up the rest of the country.

Now I'm jonesing to win another Super Bowl in order to shut up A BUNCH OF SEAHAWKS FANS.

Let's face it... Seahawks fans aren't happy unless we believe that we are somehow courting disaster. The Super Bowl led to unprecedented euphoria, now some of us have to restore the karmic balance.

Personally, I think Tate was great. However, if we assume a reasonably healthy Percy Harvin, Golden Tate's value on this team becomes marginal.

Personally, I am not concerned about Percy Harvin, his injuries do not appear to be chronic. Keeping Tate as some kind of Harvin insurance doesn't make much sense.

Oh one more thing. All of receivers seem to be good blockers. I think that is something that is emphasized on our run first team.

 

[bmorepunk]

Would you like some irony?

A year ago at this time, I was jonesing to win a Super Bowl in order to shut up the rest of the country.

Now I'm jonesing to win another Super Bowl in order to shut up A BUNCH OF SEAHAWKS FANS.

Actually LOL'ed.

 

[Lady Talon]

Tate had

1. a QB in RW that limited bad throws and turnovers (and extended plays to allow separation).
2. an offense and team that bought into our philosophy and worked hard and encouraged each other towards championship seasons.

He'll have none of those in Detroit. I'd argue quite the opposite.

I'm not expecting Tate to be an FA bust, but I wouldn't predict a Wes Welker type first season away from Seattle. He was great in a unique situation and time in Seahawks history, and that just got taken away from him. Tate is a pretty emotional type.

 

[-The Glove-]

Welp...you guys are all right. Tate is irreplaceable. We're doomed

 

[rcaido]

If money was not an option of course we would have sign Tate. Trying to say he's not worth the 6million is ridiculous & just butt hurt fans. Tate brought a lot from his catching, blocking, attitude, & good teammate. He will be missed, Lions got a future star.

We should be grateful for all players who played for us this year. We won a freaken Superbowl! If they decide to go make their money let them & be happy for them. All this trash talking players after they leave is just childish & ungrateful.

 

[Lady Talon]

Welp...you guys are all right. Tate is irreplaceable. We're doomed

Tate is hard to replace and I'll miss him, but the decision to let him walk was correct, IMO.

 

[byau]

I think a lot of people are underestimating Tate. I think he will have an even better season next year with more receptions.

Been rewatching the 2013-2014 season (yeah!) and Tate made some incredible catches, AND he took some real big hits. That guy is compact, quick, durable, athletic, incredible.

If you check out one of Yahoo's articles

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/wr-tate-ag ... EAkTJNbK5_

Tate, 25, led all NFL receivers in forced missed tackles and yards after catch per reception in 2013, according to Pro Football Focus. He was also second in punt-return yards and first in punt-return efficiency.

Tate (5-foot-10, 202 pounds) was among the top available receivers in free agency and the Lions' top target after catching 64 passes for 898 yards and five touchdowns as the Super Bowl champion Seahawks' top receiver for most of the season.

Tate has caught 165 passes for 2,195 yards and 15 touchdowns in four seasons. The last two seasons have seen him catch 109 of those passes for 1,586 yards and 12 touchdowns.

That being said, I do wish we could hold on to Tate, but Tate is right on getting paid on a team that he will get more opportunities for more plays (thus I agree, underrated).

At the same time, while he made plays for Seattle, with Seattle's focus more on running and defense, I don't think the question is if we can find another Tate who is a borderline star. I think the question is if we can find another receiver that will fill in what the Seahawks need. The Seahawks don't necessarily need someone to make plays after the hit or get guys to miss tackles, they will do fine with receivers who can keep their hands on the ball first and foremost and help Russell with short to medium gains. If they can make plays after the catch, that's a bonus.

 

[Popeyejones]

Welp...you guys are all right. Tate is irreplaceable.

Who said this where now?

Was it the same people who said Tate was comparable to Calvin Johnson ?

Let's wag our fingers at those people together, assuming we can find them of course. ;

 

[-The Glove-]

Welp...you guys are all right. Tate is irreplaceable.

Who said this where now?

Was it the same people who said Tate was comparable to Calvin Johnson ?

Let's wag our fingers at those people together, assuming we can find them of course. ;

Who the hell said Tate was comparable to Calvin Johnson?

 

[-The Glove-]

I think a lot of people are underestimating Tate. I think he will have an even better season next year with more receptions.

Been rewatching the 2013-2014 season (yeah!) and Tate made some incredible catches, AND he took some real big hits. That guy is compact, quick, durable, athletic, incredible.

If you check out one of Yahoo's articles

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/wr-tate-ag ... EAkTJNbK5_

Tate, 25, led all NFL receivers in forced missed tackles and yards after catch per reception in 2013, according to Pro Football Focus. He was also second in punt-return yards and first in punt-return efficiency.

Tate (5-foot-10, 202 pounds) was among the top available receivers in free agency and the Lions' top target after catching 64 passes for 898 yards and five touchdowns as the Super Bowl champion Seahawks' top receiver for most of the season.

Tate has caught 165 passes for 2,195 yards and 15 touchdowns in four seasons. The last two seasons have seen him catch 109 of those passes for 1,586 yards and 12 touchdowns.

That being said, I do wish we could hold on to Tate, but Tate is right on getting paid on a team that he will get more opportunities for more plays (thus I agree, underrated).

At the same time, while he made plays for Seattle, with Seattle's focus more on running and defense, I don't think the question is if we can find another Tate who is a borderline star. I think the question is if we can find another receiver that will fill in what the Seahawks need. The Seahawks don't necessarily need someone to make plays after the hit or get guys to miss tackles, they will do fine with receivers who can keep their hands on the ball first and foremost and help Russell with short to medium gains. If they can make plays after the catch, that's a bonus.

He should have a better season with the Lions. They pass a bunch. That's why he's worth 6 mill there. In Seattle...not so much