Miami Trade DB Minkah Fitzpatrick to the Steelers

[Seymour]

Of course the Dolphins WANT a 1st, but all reports have stated that it's more than likely going to be a 2nd or 3rd. No one's paying a 1st round for Fitzpatrick, they're just not. He's not an elite DB worthy of a 1st rounder, so let's get that out of the way.

Just my opinion, but I don't think a player needs to be elite to be worthy of a late 1st round pick. Most 1st round picks do not turn out to be elite, especially those in the bottom 10-12 of the 1st round. I'd take a young, cheap, quality starter that makes our team better for a late 1st all day long. I also think there's a good chance Fitzpatrick would be better than just a quality starter for a Pete Carroll coached defense.

*Yes, I am assuming that our pick will end up being in the bottom 10-12 of the 1st round because I think that is the most likely outcome.

It doesn't matter where the player was selected in the draft, Fitzpatrick's value is now what he's done and what his potential is.

Look no further than our own Earl Thomas, he was about to go to the Cowboys for a 2nd, and he was one of the best safeties in the league.

You rarely get back in value what you drafted a player at, especially for a tweener player like Fitzpatrick that no one can really figure out (including the Dolphins) where to play him.

So I HIGHLY doubt any teams is going to give up a 1st rounder for a nickel corner that MIGHT have potential to play safety or CB.

That was not based on talent. That was based on contract desires (top $$), and his age and his weak leg / bone situation along with what we learned from Kam and Cliff on 3rd contracts.

 

[Bobblehead]

Of course the Dolphins WANT a 1st, but all reports have stated that it's more than likely going to be a 2nd or 3rd. No one's paying a 1st round for Fitzpatrick, they're just not. He's not an elite DB worthy of a 1st rounder, so let's get that out of the way.

Just my opinion, but I don't think a player needs to be elite to be worthy of a late 1st round pick. Most 1st round picks do not turn out to be elite, especially those in the bottom 10-12 of the 1st round. I'd take a young, cheap, quality starter that makes our team better for a late 1st all day long. I also think there's a good chance Fitzpatrick would be better than just a quality starter for a Pete Carroll coached defense.

*Yes, I am assuming that our pick will end up being in the bottom 10-12 of the 1st round because I think that is the most likely outcome.

It doesn't matter where the player was selected in the draft, Fitzpatrick's value is now what he's done and what his potential is.

Look no further than our own Earl Thomas, he was about to go to the Cowboys for a 2nd, and he was one of the best safeties in the league.

You rarely get back in value what you drafted a player at, especially for a tweener player like Fitzpatrick that no one can really figure out (including the Dolphins) where to play him.

So I HIGHLY doubt any teams is going to give up a 1st rounder for a nickel corner that MIGHT have potential to play safety or CB.

That was not based on talent. That was based on contract desires (top $$), and his age and his weak leg / bone situation along with what we learned from Kam and Cliff on 3rd contracts.

Yep, big contracts is a deal breaker.. which is why this Fitz guy looks pretty good at the moment.

 

[Sgt. Largent]

Of course the Dolphins WANT a 1st, but all reports have stated that it's more than likely going to be a 2nd or 3rd. No one's paying a 1st round for Fitzpatrick, they're just not. He's not an elite DB worthy of a 1st rounder, so let's get that out of the way.

Just my opinion, but I don't think a player needs to be elite to be worthy of a late 1st round pick. Most 1st round picks do not turn out to be elite, especially those in the bottom 10-12 of the 1st round. I'd take a young, cheap, quality starter that makes our team better for a late 1st all day long. I also think there's a good chance Fitzpatrick would be better than just a quality starter for a Pete Carroll coached defense.

*Yes, I am assuming that our pick will end up being in the bottom 10-12 of the 1st round because I think that is the most likely outcome.

It doesn't matter where the player was selected in the draft, Fitzpatrick's value is now what he's done and what his potential is.

Look no further than our own Earl Thomas, he was about to go to the Cowboys for a 2nd, and he was one of the best safeties in the league.

You rarely get back in value what you drafted a player at, especially for a tweener player like Fitzpatrick that no one can really figure out (including the Dolphins) where to play him.

So I HIGHLY doubt any teams is going to give up a 1st rounder for a nickel corner that MIGHT have potential to play safety or CB.

That was not based on talent. That was based on contract desires (top $$), and his age and his weak leg / bone situation along with what we learned from Kam and Cliff on 3rd contracts.

Of which he got in free agency.........and we didn't get a 1st rounder. Neither did Houston for Clowney, nor will Miami.

If Fitzspatrick was a top 5 DB or safety? Yeah they'd get a 1st for him because of his team friendly contract and 3-4 years of team control.

But he's not, he's a very good DB that Miami can't figure out where to put him, so he's been playing nickel. That's worth a 1st? I sure don't see it.

 

[Chapow]

Of course the Dolphins WANT a 1st, but all reports have stated that it's more than likely going to be a 2nd or 3rd. No one's paying a 1st round for Fitzpatrick, they're just not. He's not an elite DB worthy of a 1st rounder, so let's get that out of the way.

Just my opinion, but I don't think a player needs to be elite to be worthy of a late 1st round pick. Most 1st round picks do not turn out to be elite, especially those in the bottom 10-12 of the 1st round. I'd take a young, cheap, quality starter that makes our team better for a late 1st all day long. I also think there's a good chance Fitzpatrick would be better than just a quality starter for a Pete Carroll coached defense.

*Yes, I am assuming that our pick will end up being in the bottom 10-12 of the 1st round because I think that is the most likely outcome.

It doesn't matter where the player was selected in the draft, Fitzpatrick's value is now what he's done and what his potential is.

Look no further than our own Earl Thomas, he was about to go to the Cowboys for a 2nd, and he was one of the best safeties in the league.

He was also much older, wanting a big fat new contract, and coming off back to back serious injuries.

You rarely get back in value what you drafted a player at, especially for a tweener player like Fitzpatrick that no one can really figure out (including the Dolphins) where to play him.

So I HIGHLY doubt any teams is going to give up a 1st rounder for a nickel corner that MIGHT have potential to play safety or CB.

I agree with you in that I think it's unlikely that the Dolphins will get a 1st for him. I was just explaining why I wouldn't have a problem with it if Pete and John did give our 1st for him. If they can get him for a 2nd? Even better.

 

[Chapow]

But he's not, he's a very good DB that Miami can't figure out where to put him, so he's been playing nickel. That's worth a 1st? I sure don't see it.

You don't think Pete could figure out how to use Fitzpatrick?

If there's one position group I have the utmost faith that Pete can get the absolute best out of players and put them in the best possible position to succeed, better than any other coach, it's DB.

And it kind of seems like there's a lot of things Miami can't figure out. Not sure they're the best barometer.

 

[jammerhawk]

I will be very surprised if Minka isn't with another team by day's end Saturday. He would upgrade the secondary immediately and long term for many teams in contention currently. I suspect somebody will pay a high price and it will be worth it. If it cost us a 1st, I wouldn't balk.


For those of you with Twitter check out what Jim Nagy (Schneider guy) has to say about Minkah today.

BFS, is there a link?

 

[Sgt. Largent]

So I HIGHLY doubt any teams is going to give up a 1st rounder for a nickel corner that MIGHT have potential to play safety or CB.

I agree with you in that I think it's unlikely that the Dolphins will get a 1st for him. I was just explaining why I wouldn't have a problem with it if Pete and John did give our 1st for him. If they can get him for a 2nd? Even better.[/quote]

I would not be OK giving up a 1st for Fitzspatrick, he's not a front line elite starter.

It's also the draft position Schneider uses for draft capital and positioning to move back to get more picks. So if we lose our 1st? We better get a proven front line starter, and I don't think Fitzspatrick is that........yet anyway.

 

[Chapow]

So I HIGHLY doubt any teams is going to give up a 1st rounder for a nickel corner that MIGHT have potential to play safety or CB.

I agree with you in that I think it's unlikely that the Dolphins will get a 1st for him. I was just explaining why I wouldn't have a problem with it if Pete and John did give our 1st for him. If they can get him for a 2nd? Even better.

I would not be OK giving up a 1st for Fitzspatrick, he's not a front line elite starter.

It's also the draft position Schneider uses for draft capital and positioning to move back to get more picks. So if we lose our 1st? We better get a proven front line starter, and I don't think Fitzspatrick is that........yet anyway.

What do you think the chances are that we are going to get a front line elite starter with next years 1st round pick?

And aren't we already pretty loaded with draft capital in next years draft? Do we really need a bunch more picks? I mean, there are only 53 roster spots...

I dunno man, I'd still be perfectly fine with trading next years 1st for Fitzpatrick.

 

[Seymour]

I will be very surprised if Minka isn't with another team by day's end Saturday. He would upgrade the secondary immediately and long term for many teams in contention currently. I suspect somebody will pay a high price and it will be worth it. If it cost us a 1st, I wouldn't balk.


For those of you with Twitter check out what Jim Nagy (Schneider guy) has to say about Minkah today.

BFS, is there a link?

I found this.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/JimNagy_SB/status/1172450145293619202[/tweet]

 

[bestfightstory]

That's the tweet I was referencing. I never did know how to link a link here, nor have the sufficient motivation to learn. Fortunately, others do. The discussion following that tweet is curious, as well. One wise guy sez "If I am JS I'm selling the Dolphins hard on Tedric being able to help them tank" lol

 

[Chapow]

I will be very surprised if Minka isn't with another team by day's end Saturday. He would upgrade the secondary immediately and long term for many teams in contention currently. I suspect somebody will pay a high price and it will be worth it. If it cost us a 1st, I wouldn't balk.


For those of you with Twitter check out what Jim Nagy (Schneider guy) has to say about Minkah today.

BFS, is there a link?

I found this.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/JimNagy_SB/status/1172450145293619202[/tweet]

Still very young
Inexpensive
3 years remaining on his rookie deal

 

[jammerhawk]

Add complains about playing football.

That however may be b/c he sees he's going to be on a losing team for a very long time.

 

[Chapow]

Add complains about playing football.

That however may be b/c he sees he's going to be on a losing team for a very long time.

He complains about playing football? I haven't seen that anywhere, do you have a link?

 

[quadsas]

he complained about being played at positions he's not comfortable playing. Not sure that's such a bad thing, let him play slot and free safety and he won't be complaining

 

[Bobblehead]

Add complains about playing football.

That however may be b/c he sees he's going to be on a losing team for a very long time.

Forum members here have said it many times, it's hard to switch positions, he just wants to play one position and further, he knows he's no Kam.. put him at FS and keep him there.

 

[jammerhawk]

Except his team has zero idea of where to play him when he would clearly be best playing NCB or FS instead of being quasi rover LB or SS.

I get the grumble on his part but he didn't need to go public. I suspect most of his grumble is really that his team will suck for quite a while and he wants out as he wants to play for winning program.

 

[A-Dog]

Is he talking about not suited to playing nickel corner or is he talking about box safety? I don't know anything about Miami's scheme or how Fitz has been utilized. The two are not necessarily the same. Coleman was a top slot corner and he was 180-something pounds. The lines are blurred nowadays with all the hybrid positions so "slot corner" or "nickel corner" can mean different things depending on what responsibilities are involved.

From the PFF article:

Not only has his best football all come at slot cornerback, but Fitzpatrick’s play elsewhere shouldn’t push anyone to switch things up. He earned sub 60.0 overall and coverage grades at outside cornerback, free safety and box* in 2018, all while playing 90 or more defensive snaps at each of the positions.

[Editor’s Note*: In Premium Stats 2.0, which is made available to all of PFF’s ELITE subscribers, defensive snaps played at off-ball linebacker or strong safety are labeled as “Box” snaps.]

Also, I agree that Minkah's desire to leave is probably a lot more about playing for an abysmal organization than it is about having to play inside.

 

[McGruff]

I suspect Minkah wants to play one position and not 4

 

[Seymour]

Add complains about playing football.

That however may be b/c he sees he's going to be on a losing team for a very long time.

He complains about playing football? I haven't seen that anywhere, do you have a link?

Sounds too soft to play here with this attitude.

"I'm not 215 pounds, 220 pounds. So playing in the box isn't best suited for me, but that's what Coach is asking me to do."

When he said inside the box I'm assuming he's talking about slot DB but wasn't aware they played him as a HB LB role. I consider that good news. :2thumbs:

That said if he is that good at slot the chances are he'd be a better DB2 than Flowers IMO. They can justify a 2nd and even a first if he upgrades LOBad at DB and backup FS also.

 

[AgentDib]

I'd like Fitzpatrick at the right price as well but I think fans may be jumping the gun a little bit here. Pete loves experience on his defense. Read his comments on Lano Hill today:

He's ahead of where he was in terms of awareness of the scheme and what's asked of him and all of that. We're very comfortable with him playing.... He's got all of the right stuff, he just needed to kind of grow up with us and we feel like he's had the time to do that.

That's about a 23 year old player who has been in our system for two and a half years and Pete is just now getting comfortable (maybe) to giving him snaps in his secondary.

Fitzpatrick has a ton of long-term upside but we are in the middle of 2019 NFL season right now and he has no experience with our system. Fans who think we would trade for Fitzpatrick just to immediately slot him in at FS are seriously underestimating how much work NFL athletes put into the game besides simply being fast and having good athleticism.

We could potentially slot him in at big nickel. That's something he does have experience with and requires less scheme knowledge to play.

But why should we give up a high draft pick for a nickel corner when one of Pete's best attributes has been developing those guys? We traded a 7th round pick for Justin Coleman, a 6th round pick for Marcus Burley and drafted Jeremy Lane in the 6th round. Yet for some reason the fan base is suddenly all aboard trading a first round pick for Fitzpatrick. It seems like really short-term thinking mostly driven from seeing one really bad mistake by Thompson last week.