Officiating is so bad, I quit!

[SoulfishHawk]

At one point, it was like 11 to 1 in penalties, and the Saints have zero penalties in the entire first half? Not the reason they lost, but come on. And that pick play in the end zone was about as obvious as it gets. Make the right call, and they setting for 3 instead of 7.

 

[HawkFan72]

It's obvious Pete's comments about scouting the crews were a jab at the league, but I'll bet 100% true.

Heavily penalized teams still win though. Yesterday, as one example, the Raiders set a record at 23 (24?) with Terry McCauley's crew (SB XLVIII coin interception ref) tossing yellow bean bags around, and they won the game!

The only calls that really bother me are the NON-calls, like the pick play for the TD. Deion Sanders commented during our highlights last night the "ahhh, every team runs that play". Sure Prime, we get that, but why do we get called for it a few weeks earlier and lose the points but other teams don't? Did we miss the memo?

Non-calls, and inconsistency, those are the issues.

Exactly. I think most of us don't mind that the penalty wasn't called. The problem is that it IS called on the Seahawks. Either call them both or lay off.

 

[Trrrroy]

A big part of the problem is that they add and emphasise new rules every year, yet have not removed or de-emphasised others. So now the NFL rulebook is a huge conviluted mess that makes it impossible for officials to ref consistently from game to game.

 

[Willyeye]

Seriously? What a bunch of whiners. Especially after the home-cooking you guys get. And PI on Julio by Sherman that everybody outside of Seattle recognized and said we got jobbed. What goes around comes around. Shut up the whining and take it like a man like you expect every other team too. Sheesh. What a bunch of cry-babies.

I'm sorry dude, but you're clueless. You seriously have no idea what I'm talking about. I'm not bringing this subject up because of yesterday's game. I don't care if the Hawks lose a game, especially when their offense has struggled the way it has. I'm not talking about one JJ play that you guys THINK cost you the game. That play doesn't normally get called anyway. The refs totally ignored the hands to the face by JJ on Sherman at the LOS. And on what would likely be the last play of the game for your offense, Ryan threw up a hail mary on 4th and 15 where he was hoping for a TD or a DPI. Refs RARELY IF EVER call DPI in that situation. You know that, but you're a sore loser.

That's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about 4-1/2 seasons worth of 4 or 5 offensive holding calls per game every time the Hawks get an important 1st down...it's called back. And truth be told, I don't even mind that, as long as they call it on both teams. We get the opposite. The refs call a couple of false starts and one offsides on our opponents and ignore 20 blatant holds of guys holding our D-Line guys. IT'S BLATANT. You're talking about one play in one game...I'm talking about 4-1/2 years of this crap.

I LOVE football. I've been a fan for 53 years. But this sport is seriously becoming unwatchable for a lot of people. Why do you think viewership is down 15% this year. It might never happen, but there's a good chance that one of these days this blows up for the NFL. All it takes is for one whistleblower to come out and say that, although the games are not necessarily fixed, the refs have been told to favor specific teams in certain games. If you think this never happens, you haven't been paying attention to what has been going on for years now. Maybe you're too young and you don't remember what the sport looked like 30 or 40 years ago.

Do you understand why the NFL was so successful and hit its peak last year? The salary cap forced PARITY. No longer could the same teams win every SB. At the beginning of a season, EVERY team has a chance to be the champion. They created the perfect storm to hold the interest of millions of fans throughout the season. It was GENIUS. When was the last time the Cowboys or 49ers won a SB? In the last 8 years, there have been 8 DIFFERENT SB winners. Take for example the 2014 season, the year after the Hawks won the SB. Refs called only 70 penalties against Seahawk opponents all year. That's only 4 penalties per game. Dirty teams like the Rams averaged like 10 penalties per game, but were only called for 3 or 4 against the Hawks. It was so obvious. 70 was incredibly low. The next team had 91 called on their opponents. So while the Hawks had only 70 calls in their favor, the rest of the NFL were beneficiaries of somewhere between 91 and 144 penalties. The Hawks penalty differential per game was -3.75. The next closest were the Pats at -1.75. On a graph, it's like all the league is in one big jumble, but the Hawks were way off by themselves in no man's land. The NFL probably figured that most people would be too stupid to notice this disparity. After all, there are no stats kept for non-calls.

 

[253hawk]

I'm done for the year. I go all week getting hyped for the game and then feel like I just wasted 4 hours by that abortion of an effort by the refs. Even if we'd have won, I'd still have felt crappy about that game. This game isn't the sole reason, but it's the proverbial straw after watching every single game day since the first week of preseason.

People drone on about playing better -- we lost by 5 points, and 6 points came off of magically-extended drives on questionable third-down penalties where the stops were made and there should have been a punt instead of points. And the pick play in the end zone on the TD which should have been OPI -- also on third down. It is possible to win games by defense and special teams alone. Obviously you don't want it to come to that, but sometimes you just have to win ugly and unbalanced, incompetent officiating shouldn't be such a major factor when things get that gritty.

The Saints just came off of back-to-back games where they had 10 penalties in each. Then against one of the most aggressive defenses in the NFL, they suddenly don't commit any? Nothing but two false starts all day, one on special teams. Completely disciplined football between the whistles on both sides of the ball for 60 minutes after being one of the most penalized teams over the first 7 weeks. Please. 'Bad' officiating is tolerable if it's balanced on both sides, whether they are calling every ticky-tack thing or calling virtually nothing and just 'letting them play'. But such a huge disparity is inexcusable.

I'll still check the box scores, but that's it. Good job NFL, here's another 30+ year fan that's going to quit watching because you refuse to acknowledge that your stupid shield is flawed and that doing anything to fix it would be an admittance of fault which your egos and hubris wouldn't be able to handle.

 

[Anonymous]

That non-call on the pick play will be a point of emphasis throughout the week, with different talking heads saying different things. We may even hear booth comments to that affect next game.

A few years back we heard all sorts of parity talk, but it was more about player contract and free-agency rules affecting what the league was wanting to do in terms of evening-up the competition and eliminating advantages between clubs. As fans, we just shrugged that off at the time.

In a situation where officiating is deciding things and keeping team records closer, we fans are now deep into the mix. Couple this with ratings plunges, my prediction is a more-swift clarification being issued that will attempt to lessen fan alienation.

Not holding my breath though...

 

[hawksfansinceday1]

Seriously? What a bunch of whiners. Especially after the home-cooking you guys get. And PI on Julio by Sherman that everybody outside of Seattle recognized and said we got jobbed. What goes around comes around. Shut up the whining and take it like a man like you expect every other team too. Sheesh. What a bunch of cry-babies.

Opponents of the Seattle Seahawks called for fewest penalties in 2014, 2015 and 2nd fewest so far in 2016. Those are statistical FACTS.

NFL doctored the video of Sherman's DPI to NOT include Julio's hands to the face on that play. If that play is called correctly it's offsetting penalties. They literally tried and mostly succeeded in shaping public opinion that the play was all Sherman DPI and poor Julio and the poor Falcons were totally screwed. That is a FACT.

The NFL has become George Orwell's 1984.

 

[Willyeye]

A big part of the problem is that they add and emphasise new rules every year, yet have not removed or de-emphasised others. So now the NFL rulebook is a huge conviluted mess that makes it impossible for officials to ref consistently from game to game.

How can you make it sound like the refs are innocent in all of this and blame it all on the rules? Not all the rules were clear in the old days either, and there was never clear evidence of something fishy like there is now. Is it possible that some of these rule changes are designed to pull the wool over the eyes of fans to make it easier for refs to be biased without seeming to cheat? Is it impossible that the refs are actually helping loser teams with a little favoritism in order to perpetuate their ultimate goal of parity and getting better ratings and bigger profits? Think about it...the evidence is right in front of our faces...all we need is an open mind and it's pretty obvious. There's some old saying about coincidences, but I can't seem to remember it right now...suffice it to say that when too many coincidences happen, it's not because random events just happen that way...not year after year.

 

[hawksfansinceday1]

Willyeye: awesome posts on this thread, one and all.

 

[Willyeye]

It's obvious Pete's comments about scouting the crews were a jab at the league, but I'll bet 100% true.

Heavily penalized teams still win though. Yesterday, as one example, the Raiders set a record at 23 (24?) with Terry McCauley's crew (SB XLVIII coin interception ref) tossing yellow bean bags around, and they won the game!

The only calls that really bother me are the NON-calls, like the pick play for the TD. Deion Sanders commented during our highlights last night the "ahhh, every team runs that play". Sure Prime, we get that, but why do we get called for it a few weeks earlier and lose the points but other teams don't? Did we miss the memo?

Non-calls, and inconsistency, those are the issues.

The Raiders game is a POOR example to make your case that heavily-penalized teams can still win games. I still can't believe the Raiders game. The Raiders should have won that game 70-10. They outyarded the Bucs 626 to 270, and barely won in OT. I almost thought there was going to be another tie. The Raiders were penalized 23 times for 200 yards while the Bucs were penalized 6 times for 64 yards. The game was pretty much unwatchable. It was clearly the intention of the refs to take a win away from a strong team in the strong AFCW and give it to a weak team in the weak NFCS. You should be saying that the Raiders won IN SPITE OF the refs best efforts to have them lose. 626 yards by the Raiders. And the game ALMOST ended in a tie. Carr threw a 41-yard TD pass with 1:55 left in OT. 30-24 in an overtime game where your offense gains 626 yards and your D holds the opposition to 270 total yards?

I have to wonder if the refs weren't told to look the other way in the 3 games where 3 NFCS teams could really use some help to salvage their seasons before it's too late. Maybe the South is where the NFL has lost many of its viewers.

 

[twisted_steel2]

Just saying it happens every week. I saw Sherman mugged WR'S today too with no calls. It happens. BUT the way this board reacted 2 weeks ago towards Falcons fans who were upset at the refs ... now the tables are turned and now you're trying to play the victim card.

This isn't a one time call, or a one time game people are concerned about.

This is something Seahawk fans have been dealing with for years... I get it, the media will cover 1 call on us every year or two, Julio Jones, the Fail Mary, yadda yadda. It's almost like a smokescreen. It gives the perception that we somehow get all the love from the refs, when in reality its the opposite.

But the overwhelming evidence is that the Seahawks have been #1 or one close to the top penalized team for years. I mean you can write that off, to saying that's just how they play, they really push the envelope, which is fair to say.

But how do you explain that the teams the Seahawks play, are the least penalized. Always coming in under their average when they play us? It's strange, well and frustrating.

When you see Seahawk fans 'cry' over this, its not over 1 play, its like what we saw yesterday. The Seahwks playing with a different set of rules compared to their opponents.

Since 2014, the Hawks have been called for 7.5 penalties per game, 2nd most in the NFL. Their opponents have had 4.8, lowest in NFL.

Also:

This is a graph from 2014, Fieldgulls.



http://www.fieldgulls.com/2016/10/30/13 ... -penalties

Since the start of 2014, the Seahawks have been called for 7.5 penalties per game, which is the second highest rate in the NFL over that time period, including leading the league in ‘14.

But here’s where it starts to get wonky: over that same 2+ year stretch, the Seahawks’ opponents have been called for the fewest penalties in the league. Not only that, teams playing Seattle were called for the fewest penalties in the league in 2014, then were called for the fewest penalties in the league again in 2015. We’ll hva eto wait for the rest of this week’s games to finish, but as it stands right now, Seahawks’ opponents have been called for the second-fewest penalties so far in 2016.

For teams playing the Seahawks to consistently get flagged at a far-below-average rate, year over year, is beyond the scope of random distribution.

So again, this is not a 1 game thing for us, or a 1 missed non-call like the Atlanta fans, this is an accumulation of a crazy discrepancy in penalties that has been going on for years.

So if you want to keep pounding that drum about Julio Jones.... go ahead. But your missing the big picture.

 

[Hawks46]

I think Pete Carroll nailed it. Their scouting and game plan for that group of officials was off this week. To me that was the difference in the game. It happens.

When it gets to the point that the coaching staff has to scout and gameplan for officials is the day I'm done. My foot is already outside the door, I'm just tired of wasting so much time, energy and more importantly my hard earned money and THIS is the end result.

Sea....11 penalties for 76 yards

N.O...2 for 10 yards,

And the AZ game was very similar.

I'm kind of here as well at this point. Sunday is really my only family day, and to waste it on a game that really bases my enjoyment on how well the officiating goes seems shaky and inconsistent.

I used to watch the NFL, all the games I could. I've watched a few this year that weren't Seahawks games, and they were fairly unwatchable and it was due to officiating. The common denominator is bad calls against the defense in favor of the offense, and typically in critical moments that extend drives. It's not unique to us, although at times it's more obvious because to even a game out against an elite group of guys like the Hawks defense you have to be more obvious about it, but it IS aggravating.

And why do I want to spend my precious spare time being aggravated ?

I'm getting the NFL back. I was going to buy a Lynch and Chancellor jersey this year. I was honestly also considering a Wilson jersey. I won't spend a dime on this stuff until they start to fix the officiating.

 

[RichNhansom]

Just saying it happens every week. I saw Sherman mugged WR'S today too with no calls. It happens. BUT the way this board reacted 2 weeks ago towards Falcons fans who were upset at the refs ... now the tables are turned and now you're trying to play the victim card.

This isn't a one time call, or a one time game people are concerned about.

This is something Seahawk fans have been dealing with for years... I get it, the media will cover 1 call on us every year or two, Julio Jones, the Fail Mary, yadda yadda. It's almost like a smokescreen. It gives the perception that we somehow get all the love from the refs, when in reality its the opposite.

But the overwhelming evidence is that the Seahawks have been #1 or one close to the top penalized team for years. I mean you can write that off, to saying that's just how they play, they really push the envelope, which is fair to say.

But how do you explain that the teams the Seahawks play, are the least penalized. Always coming in under their average when they play us? It's strange, well and frustrating.

When you see Seahawk fans 'cry' over this, its not over 1 play, its like what we saw yesterday. The Seahwks playing with a different set of rules compared to their opponents.

Since 2014, the Hawks have been called for 7.5 penalties per game, 2nd most in the NFL. Their opponents have had 4.8, lowest in NFL.

Also:

This is a graph from 2014, Fieldgulls.



http://www.fieldgulls.com/2016/10/30/13 ... -penalties

Since the start of 2014, the Seahawks have been called for 7.5 penalties per game, which is the second highest rate in the NFL over that time period, including leading the league in ‘14.

But here’s where it starts to get wonky: over that same 2+ year stretch, the Seahawks’ opponents have been called for the fewest penalties in the league. Not only that, teams playing Seattle were called for the fewest penalties in the league in 2014, then were called for the fewest penalties in the league again in 2015. We’ll hva eto wait for the rest of this week’s games to finish, but as it stands right now, Seahawks’ opponents have been called for the second-fewest penalties so far in 2016.

For teams playing the Seahawks to consistently get flagged at a far-below-average rate, year over year, is beyond the scope of random distribution.

So again, this is not a 1 game thing for us, or a 1 missed non-call like the Atlanta fans, this is an accumulation of a crazy discrepancy in penalties that has been going on for years.

So if you want to keep pounding that drum about Julio Jones.... go ahead. But your missing the big picture.

If they had called PI on Sherman it would have been screwing the Seahawks. Not because it didn't happen, it did but they let both teams play all game, even on that same play were Atlanta should have also been fouled for blatant hands to the face on two different players and Marsh getting tackeled from behind to prevent pressure on Ryan. All that on hail mary play.

The other part about penalty disparity also coincides with the period of time the Seahawks have been consistently considered one of or the best teams in football.

Suddenly all our popponents start playing mistake free football? Now that they are up against some of thier biggest challenges? It doesn't add up.

 

[Silver Hawk]

Willyeye, I was pretty much with you until you jumped the shark, with "corporations" now universally being bad.

 

[twisted_steel2]

The other part about penalty disparity also coincides with the period of time the Seahawks have been consistently considered one of or the best teams in football.

Suddenly all our opponents start playing mistake free football? Now that they are up against some of their biggest challenges? It doesn't add up.

Exactly.

 

[Silver Hawk]

I will say however, that over the course of this season, I've had a lot of the same thoughts, about how the NFL product is being so significantly affected by the officials. For all the teams, not only the Seahawks. I watch parts of almost every game on Sunday. I watch most all of each Sunday, Monday and Thursday night game. It just seems like every game is a flag fest. Then on top of that, the micro analysis of things like "what is a catch and what is not a catch". The officiating just plain sucks. It truly is starting to make the product unwatchable and unenjoyable. This coming from someone who has been watching any form of football that has been available for the last 45 years.

 

[Trrrroy]

A big part of the problem is that they add and emphasise new rules every year, yet have not removed or de-emphasised others. So now the NFL rulebook is a huge conviluted mess that makes it impossible for officials to ref consistently from game to game.

How can you make it sound like the refs are innocent in all of this and blame it all on the rules? Not all the rules were clear in the old days either, and there was never clear evidence of something fishy like there is now. Is it possible that some of these rule changes are designed to pull the wool over the eyes of fans to make it easier for refs to be biased without seeming to cheat? Is it impossible that the refs are actually helping loser teams with a little favoritism in order to perpetuate their ultimate goal of parity and getting better ratings and bigger profits? Think about it...the evidence is right in front of our faces...all we need is an open mind and it's pretty obvious. There's some old saying about coincidences, but I can't seem to remember it right now...suffice it to say that when too many coincidences happen, it's not because random events just happen that way...not year after year.

The refs have to take some blame, too. I agree. I'm just not a conspiracy theorist that believes they have an agenda to effect game outcomes. I think more likely is that someone (eg. Bruce Arians) tells the NFL that Seattle is doing things that shouldn't be allowed. The NFL then tells the refs to specifically look for and penalize said things. Then the refs overcorrect and penalize every ticky tack call. That I think is bullshit. Refs shouldn't have little birds in their ear telling them how to call games.

At the same time, I'm of the opinion that the NFL has too many vague rules. The refs could honestly throw a flag every play and be perfectly within the rulebook to do so. Luckily that doesn't happen, but it's trending the wrong way.

 

[HawkGA]

You can get frustrated all you want but simply blaming the refs for us losing this game is just missing the mark. Tom Cable has a lot of work to do(!) and I personally think that Gilliam is now about as out of his depth as Sowell ever was! Fant looked better than Gilliam today. And it appears to be lack of effort more than anything else. The knock on effect of playing that poorly is that it A)becomes impossible to keep your QB or your RB's healthy, B)Invites the referees to the party C) keeps your defense on the field for the whole damn game, where they can then get injured. It has gotten so bad that it is taking Pete Carrol off his game plan. We are not controlling the clock and we are losing the turnover battles! Not Seahawk football as we know it.The OL is the key to everything in our immediate future if post season aspirations still exist. The Next 2 weeks will no doubt be a tough test. Our Defense deserves a tip of the cap for keeping us in the past few games, but we simply cannot continue to lay it at their feet every game.

I don't think it is about blaming the refs for the loss. I think it is about blaming the refs for the crapshow that has become watching football. Would I have felt a little better had Seattle won? Probably. But even when I thought they were going to drive for the winning score, I was already questioning whether or not watching NFL football is worth it anymore.

 

[StoneCold]

You can get frustrated all you want but simply blaming the refs for us losing this game is just missing the mark. Tom Cable has a lot of work to do(!) and I personally think that Gilliam is now about as out of his depth as Sowell ever was! Fant looked better than Gilliam today. And it appears to be lack of effort more than anything else. The knock on effect of playing that poorly is that it A)becomes impossible to keep your QB or your RB's healthy, B)Invites the referees to the party C) keeps your defense on the field for the whole damn game, where they can then get injured. It has gotten so bad that it is taking Pete Carrol off his game plan. We are not controlling the clock and we are losing the turnover battles! Not Seahawk football as we know it.The OL is the key to everything in our immediate future if post season aspirations still exist. The Next 2 weeks will no doubt be a tough test. Our Defense deserves a tip of the cap for keeping us in the past few games, but we simply cannot continue to lay it at their feet every game.

I don't think it is about blaming the refs for the loss. I think it is about blaming the refs for the crapshow that has become watching football. Would I have felt a little better had Seattle won? Probably. But even when I thought they were going to drive for the winning score, I was already questioning whether or not watching NFL football is worth it anymore.

I am amazed at how many friends I know and people on this board have said exactly this. Along with the WWE comments. I'm going to spend more time perfecting my gumbo recipe.

 

[PNW9erFan]

You hawk fans are a funny bunch...

Why should anyone believe you guys got screwed for any # of *bad calls*, when just a few years ago, your whole DEFENSE was known for blatantly "challenging" refs to call PI calls on every play!

source: http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB100014240 ... 0005285822

Quote: The Seahawks didn't respond to requests for comment, but defensive coordinator Dan Quinn said earlier this season that the Seattle coaches educate their players on what type of interference plays are being called around the league.

So, now that the tables are turned, you suckers wanna blame the "REFS"??

Ya'll a funny bunch!

And you wonder why more and more people hate your team and its fan-base..when sh** don't go your way, you blame everyone else BUT YOUR OWN TEAM!