Many of the comments are spot on, Pete has not built a team identity and frankly since betraying the team by not giving the ball to Marshaun Lynch on the 1 yard line no one trusts his red zone judgement. That is the crux of the problem, he fired several players trying to move past it but the odor still prevails. He is always changing play calls for the oc and dc. That is not how you build confidence.

He maybe very talented but he is not a team builder. Look at what Tom Brady and Ariens did in one year with the Bucs. Now tell me how great Pete Carroll is, or is not.

The best we could do is to fire Pete Carroll and start rebuilding, instead of accepting peteball.

Roger Bruce

rogerwb01 wrote:Many of the comments are spot on, Pete has not built a team identity and frankly since betraying the team by not giving the ball to Marshaun Lynch on the 1 yard line no one trusts his red zone judgement. That is the crux of the problem, he fired several players trying to move past it but the odor still prevails. He is always changing play calls for the oc and dc. That is not how you build confidence.

He maybe very talented but he is not a team builder. Look at what Tom Brady and Ariens did in one year with the Bucs. Now tell me how great Pete Carroll is, or is not.

The best we could do is to fire Pete Carroll and start rebuilding, instead of accepting peteball.

Roger Bruce

It amazes me that people still act like giving the ball to ML would result in a automatic score. If it did, we wouldn't have had to rely on a FG and Sherman's tip to send us to SB48.

rogerwb01 wrote:Many of the comments are spot on, Pete has not built a team identity and frankly since betraying the team by not giving the ball to Marshaun Lynch on the 1 yard line no one trusts his red zone judgement. That is the crux of the problem, he fired several players trying to move past it but the odor still prevails. He is always changing play calls for the oc and dc. That is not how you build confidence.

He maybe very talented but he is not a team builder. Look at what Tom Brady and Ariens did in one year with the Bucs. Now tell me how great Pete Carroll is, or is not.

The best we could do is to fire Pete Carroll and start rebuilding, instead of accepting peteball.

Roger Bruce

Define "Peteball," please.

Beastmode though? On the 1 though? In the SuperBowl though? Yah.....sorry. He’s getting that 3 feet.

Elemas wrote:Beastmode though? On the 1 though? In the SuperBowl though? Yah.....sorry. He’s getting that 3 feet.

That's your opinion. But, he did get stuffed in the championship game just one year prior. I also seem to remember a couple third and ones in that SB, where had he picked those up, there wouldn't had been a need for a last minute score.

It'd be a lot easier on everyone if we'd all acknowledge the end of SB49 for what it was - a perfect storm of everything going wrong at the same time on the final Seahawks offensive play. Browner outleverages Kearse just enough. Butler closes with amazing speed. He arrives to the spot near simultaneously with Lockette, who is blown off the ball so hard that it seems to defy physics.

So many things went wrong at the same time. The play was fine, hell, if you pause it 4 frames before the ball arriving it looks like a touchdown all the way. Not perfect, but they got the look they needed to get.

Just face it. They got outexecuted, plain and simple. No pitchforks, no mob, no scapegoat. It all went wrong.

Certainly wasn't a guarantee he was going to score. Just because people think it was, doesn't make it so.
But, very few acknowledge that the defense gave up a 10 point lead in the 4th quarter. Because, apparently the defense is w/out fault, ever.

rogerwb01 wrote:Many of the comments are spot on, Pete has not built a team identity and frankly since betraying the team by not giving the ball to Marshaun Lynch on the 1 yard line no one trusts his red zone judgement. That is the crux of the problem, he fired several players trying to move past it but the odor still prevails. He is always changing play calls for the oc and dc. That is not how you build confidence.

He maybe very talented but he is not a team builder. Look at what Tom Brady and Ariens did in one year with the Bucs. Now tell me how great Pete Carroll is, or is not.

The best we could do is to fire Pete Carroll and start rebuilding, instead of accepting peteball.

Roger Bruce

I nominate this post for bump of the week

There are countless posts that have hijacked and ruined the discussion of so many other topics. Good to see this post in the appropriate thread. I think it proof that it is possible to avoid hijacking and destroying other discussions by posting to the correct topic.

Carry on with the "Pete Carroll needs to go" onslaught this is the place to post.

Elemas wrote:Beastmode though? On the 1 though? In the SuperBowl though? Yah.....sorry. He’s getting that 3 feet.

From a 2015 article: " Among 39 running backs with at least 10 carries from the 1-yard line in the past five seasons (including playoffs), Lynch’s touchdown percentage (45 percent) ranks 30th. Also consider that this season, Lynch scored a touchdown on 1-of-5 rushes from the 1-yard line." Now that said I'd have still given it to him twice if necessary. Reading the article though reminded me of the poor design of the play call even though we had been successful with it previously. Our personnel was out-sized by the patriots defense for a pick play and Browner had experience with the play in a large number of practices. He immediately jam grabbed the receiver and never allowed the receiver to leave the line much less set the pick. With everyone expecting Lynch to get it a play action would have been devastating. Butler just destroyed Lockette who was also a step slow. Somehow Belichick knew we would run this. The Patriots were filmed practicing against this very play!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeNYQaS ... hannel=NFL

Reading this old post was fun. Even I was more lenient just two years ago, but you can see and feel the fan base changing and seeing the light now. The 5 year extension was ridiculous and pushed me over the edge.

"Fire Pete" is the battle cry of dot net. If you haven't petitioned to had Pete fired, you don't belong on dot net?

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pittpnthrs wrote:Reading this old post was fun. Even I was more lenient just two years ago, but you can see and feel the fan base changing and seeing the light now. The 5 year extension was ridiculous and pushed me over the edge.

Some comments haven't stood the test of time:

jhball wrote:How many Lombardis does Andy Reid have?
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JustTheTip wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:Reading this old post was fun. Even I was more lenient just two years ago, but you can see and feel the fan base changing and seeing the light now. The 5 year extension was ridiculous and pushed me over the edge.

Some comments haven't stood the test of time:

jhball wrote:How many Lombardis does Andy Reid have?
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Same number as Pete.

Hopefully this thread can just tick along with no other new threads being added.

The same ol stuff is becoming tiresome, however, on thread rather than every other thread is easier to ignore.

Pete ain't going nowhere was just re-upped for 5 years and the team will still remain competitive.

Find another person to grumble about.

jammerhawk wrote:Pete ain't going nowhere was just re-upped for 5 years and the team will still remain competitive.

Until the playoffs start

JustTheTip wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:Reading this old post was fun. Even I was more lenient just two years ago, but you can see and feel the fan base changing and seeing the light now. The 5 year extension was ridiculous and pushed me over the edge.

Some comments haven't stood the test of time:

jhball wrote:How many Lombardis does Andy Reid have?
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...1? 1 which the year after saw his team get demolished in the Super Bowl?

Stands the test of time pretty well methinks

Maelstrom787 wrote:

JustTheTip wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:Reading this old post was fun. Even I was more lenient just two years ago, but you can see and feel the fan base changing and seeing the light now. The 5 year extension was ridiculous and pushed me over the edge.

Some comments haven't stood the test of time:

jhball wrote:How many Lombardis does Andy Reid have?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

...1? 1 which the year after saw his team get demolished in the Super Bowl?

Stands the test of time pretty well methinks

As Maulbert posted, the same number as Pete. And his was won much more recently.

JustTheTip wrote:

Maelstrom787 wrote:

JustTheTip wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:Reading this old post was fun. Even I was more lenient just two years ago, but you can see and feel the fan base changing and seeing the light now. The 5 year extension was ridiculous and pushed me over the edge.

Some comments haven't stood the test of time:

jhball wrote:How many Lombardis does Andy Reid have?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

...1? 1 which the year after saw his team get demolished in the Super Bowl?

Stands the test of time pretty well methinks

As Maulbert posted, the same number as Pete. And his was won much more recently.

Doug Pederson has a more recent title, too. You wanna say that makes him a better coach?

Maulbert wrote:

JustTheTip wrote:

Maelstrom787 wrote:

JustTheTip wrote:
Some comments haven't stood the test of time:

...1? 1 which the year after saw his team get demolished in the Super Bowl?

Stands the test of time pretty well methinks

As Maulbert posted, the same number as Pete. And his was won much more recently.

Doug Pederson has a more recent title, too. You wanna say that makes him a better coach?

I am not saying either of them is, though I believe both are more adaptable. That and Andy has a better idea of how to use a franchise QB.

JustTheTip wrote:

Maulbert wrote:

JustTheTip wrote:

Maelstrom787 wrote:

...1? 1 which the year after saw his team get demolished in the Super Bowl?

Stands the test of time pretty well methinks

As Maulbert posted, the same number as Pete. And his was won much more recently.

Doug Pederson has a more recent title, too. You wanna say that makes him a better coach?

I am not saying either of them is, though I believe both are more adaptable. That and Andy has a better idea of how to use a franchise QB.

Tell that to Donovan McNabb.

Or maybe there's a simpler answer; having Patrick Mahomes on a rookie QB deal gave the Chiefs a really great roster for a short window. Much like having Russell Wilson on a rookie QB deal led to some all time great rosters.

Aaron Rodgers was playing for a $6.5m cap hit the only year he won the Super Bowl. Big Ben was on a rookie deal in Super Bowl XL (4.2m). Joe Flacco was playing on his rookie deal when he won one with the Ravens. Doug Peterson had two cheap QBs with the Eagles. There may be other factors that are worth discussing in all of those situations, but 'good QB on a cheap deal' is such a dominant advantage in the NFL that's it's difficult to fairly evaluate other factors.

AgentDib wrote:Or maybe there's a simpler answer; having Patrick Mahomes on a rookie QB deal gave the Chiefs a really great roster for a short window. Much like having Russell Wilson on a rookie QB deal led to some all time great rosters.

Aaron Rodgers was playing for a $6.5m cap hit the only year he won the Super Bowl. Big Ben was on a rookie deal in Super Bowl XL (4.2m). Joe Flacco was playing on his rookie deal when he won one with the Ravens. Doug Peterson had two cheap QBs with the Eagles. There may be other factors that are worth discussing in all of those situations, but 'good QB on a cheap deal' is such a dominant advantage in the NFL that's it's difficult to fairly evaluate other factors.

I agree with this as well. For his many faults, Andy is well ahead of Pete in ability to utilize a QB.

JustTheTip wrote:

AgentDib wrote:Or maybe there's a simpler answer; having Patrick Mahomes on a rookie QB deal gave the Chiefs a really great roster for a short window. Much like having Russell Wilson on a rookie QB deal led to some all time great rosters.

Aaron Rodgers was playing for a $6.5m cap hit the only year he won the Super Bowl. Big Ben was on a rookie deal in Super Bowl XL (4.2m). Joe Flacco was playing on his rookie deal when he won one with the Ravens. Doug Peterson had two cheap QBs with the Eagles. There may be other factors that are worth discussing in all of those situations, but 'good QB on a cheap deal' is such a dominant advantage in the NFL that's it's difficult to fairly evaluate other factors.

I agree with this as well. For his many faults, Andy is well ahead of Pete in ability to utilize a QB.

Reid is an offensive guy Pete is defensive, Reid doesn't know how to get secondary players to play at their potential so he is crap also.

See you can flip that, Reid has had great offenses but has failed due to his defensive side of the ball time after time.

He has won the same amount of Super Bowls as Pete.

The question to me is how many years is zero or one win in the playoffs acceptable? This is supposed to be the glory years. Yes, this is better than many years the team sucked and some here believe that since we sucked in the past we should be happy with our yearly post season participation trophy. I simply don't agree but won’t get into the dozens of stupid things the front office has done to turn us into a regular season success and a post season paper tiger.

He does need to adjust a lot better as a coach in the playoffs. That doesn't mean I don't appreciate what he has done for the team. But, at some point it's a pattern and it might be time for a fresh start at head coach. It's not happening any time soon, so...…..

SoulfishHawk wrote:He does need to adjust a lot better as a coach in the playoffs. That doesn't mean I don't appreciate what he has done for the team. But, at some point it's a pattern and it might be time for a fresh start at head coach. It's not happening any time soon, so...…..

He has done extremely well in the regular season. Kudos to that. And yes, you can't get to the playoffs without a good regular season. We all want the Seahawks to win though we may disagree on how to get there.

To be honest, his comments after the playoff loss really bothered me, a LOT.
He was ok punting on 4th and short, down 10, in the playoffs with less than 8 minutes to go. Against the best D in the league. That's just plain not acceptable. Love Pete, but he really lost a ton of my confidence in him after that.

SoulfishHawk wrote:He does need to adjust a lot better as a coach in the playoffs. That doesn't mean I don't appreciate what he has done for the team. But, at some point it's a pattern and it might be time for a fresh start at head coach. It's not happening any time soon, so...…..

I will always appreciate what he did for this team. And I don't think anybody else could have done it. But nostalgia for that is not a reason to keep Pete around. This is one of the things that allowed Bellicheck to operate the way he did over the last 2 decades. The Pats fanbase was more concerned about winning than nostalgia. Look at all the big names that went through there without the fans batting an eye when the team moved on from them.

Absolutely. Bill B. is maybe the best in game adjustment coach we have ever seen. Let alone his incredible ability to be prepared in the big games and/or taking away the opponents strengths. Just look at the Super Bowl over the Rams. They held that explosive offense to 3 damn points. Prepared, over and over again in the playoffs. Not to blast Pete, but it feels like Russ has had to save him countless amount of times. Whereas, Bill and Tom together got it done. I can't stand the Pats, but it's reality.

chris98251 wrote:

JustTheTip wrote:

AgentDib wrote:Or maybe there's a simpler answer; having Patrick Mahomes on a rookie QB deal gave the Chiefs a really great roster for a short window. Much like having Russell Wilson on a rookie QB deal led to some all time great rosters.

Aaron Rodgers was playing for a $6.5m cap hit the only year he won the Super Bowl. Big Ben was on a rookie deal in Super Bowl XL (4.2m). Joe Flacco was playing on his rookie deal when he won one with the Ravens. Doug Peterson had two cheap QBs with the Eagles. There may be other factors that are worth discussing in all of those situations, but 'good QB on a cheap deal' is such a dominant advantage in the NFL that's it's difficult to fairly evaluate other factors.

I agree with this as well. For his many faults, Andy is well ahead of Pete in ability to utilize a QB.

Reid is an offensive guy Pete is defensive, Reid doesn't know how to get secondary players to play at their potential so he is crap also.

See you can flip that, Reid has had great offenses but has failed due to his defensive side of the ball time after time.

He has won the same amount of Super Bowls as Pete.

I agree with this as well. But then why pay a QB top dollar. Get yourself a dilfer equivalent and continue to pump money into the defense.

Reason is probably he knows his job would already be gone without Wilson.

SoulfishHawk wrote:Absolutely. Bill B. is maybe the best in game adjustment coach we have ever seen. Let alone his incredible ability to be prepared in the big games and/or taking away the opponents strengths. Just look at the Super Bowl over the Rams. They held that explosive offense to 3 damn points. Prepared, over and over again in the playoffs. Not to blast Pete, but it feels like Russ has had to save him countless amount of times. Whereas, Bill and Tom together got it done. I can't stand the Pats, but it's reality.

The thing is, there is a stat for that. Twenty-one fourth quarter comebacks of the ninety-three wins since they have been together. Twenty-two percent is a bit high, but there are people acting like it happens all the time. The most troubling thing is people are so quick to write off the Waldron hire that should have the fan base excited. The main reason it doesn't is this "Wilson camp" crap that may very well have been reporters chasing clicks after the Seahawks are listening to offers and Wilson's agent released the "Wilson is willing to play for these teams" reports, which were real and verifiable.

Waldron's hire is a significant sign that things are about to change offensively. There are people in the fanbase who gasped in horror when Carroll said he wants to run more. The question is why? We were bottom half of the league in rushing attempts last season. Removing the eighty-three times Wilson actually ran lowers us almost to the very bottom of rushing attempts. We were a passing team last season and it cost us horribly in the end.

As far as adjustments go, Waldron comes from a coaching tree that is all about variations. They will run six or seven different plays out of the same formation. This has been missing here for years. The Waldron hire has Carroll admitting that he needs to adapt written all over it. I am cautiously optimistic that there are strong parallels to the Martz hire when he finally got his chance and the greatest show on turf came about.

Fingers crossed. I'll believe Pete can adjust and open his mind to doing things different than his "way" of doing things when I see it. Though I am hopeful.