Any of you buy this?.....

[Sarlacc83]

But you'll notice he lost to teams with great defenses in OSU and Auburn, and I suppose the main point which I didn't clarify as well as I should have is that you put a Kelly offense against a defense in the playoffs, and it's practically game over.

I 100% agree on paper. That said it's still a sample size of two. Plus, I'm not really sure how much we can apply college football bowl game results to the NFL playoffs.

As much as we like to think that Seattle will always crush finesse teams, they lost to Atlanta, they lost to the Dolphins, they lost to the Lions, they lost to the Colts, and they fell behind 21-0 at home to big bird. Any team with a strong armed, mobile enough, ballsy QB is a team we should respect.

I agree that we should respect them. I am just saying that past experience has taught me to expect Chip Kelly to break his own fans' hearts. And though you have watched your share of Ducks games you didn't experience the pain first hand, so you will take a wider and less personal view, ya know?

Moreover the Eagles couldn't take care of a dome team in cold weather, which favors my opinion.

Also, I don't think you can bring 2012 into the equation since that team had no pass rush.

 

[chris98251]

Remember Tampa last year, anytime you don't respect any opponent in the NFL you can get your ass kicked. We pulled it out but they brought their A game to us.

 

[Scottemojo]

Trying to make a coaches results in in college translate to the NFL, a proclivity for losing big games, etc, is just about impossible. Saban sucked in the NFL, rocks in college. Saban is a master recruiter and runs great schemes, but his players aren't always very fundamental. Kirk Ferentz is mediocre in college, and will continue to be, but would be great in the NFL because of his fundamentals teaching. He just can't get speed at Iowa, and won't.

Kelly will be very good, IMO, because he teaches fundamentals and values speed. He is to offense as Pete is to defense. Pete has made the Hawks multiple, the Hawks can matchup with a power block scheme one week, a ZBS scheme the next, and a spread offense the week after that. The Eagles can similarly exploit matchups on a week to week basis with their offense. They can go 5 wide or 3 tight ends, whatever they need to do that week they can do.

On top of that, they have McCoy and one of the 3 best offensive line in the NFL.

If I had to identify a weakness, that offense is not built to be patient of punishing beyond a couple of the offensive linemen. If they get the ball with 6 minutes and a 1 point lead, I don't think they can run the clock. And if they are ina game where they just plain need to keep their defense off the field, they can't do it.

 

[Mistashoesta]

Maragos out there talking that bull@#$% I see.

 

[Sarlacc83]

Trying to make a coaches results in in college translate to the NFL, a proclivity for losing big games, etc, is just about impossible. Saban sucked in the NFL, rocks in college. Saban is a master recruiter and runs great schemes, but his players aren't always very fundamental. Kirk Ferentz is mediocre in college, and will continue to be, but would be great in the NFL because of his fundamentals teaching. He just can't get speed at Iowa, and won't.

Kelly will be very good, IMO, because he teaches fundamentals and values speed. He is to offense as Pete is to defense. Pete has made the Hawks multiple, the Hawks can matchup with a power block scheme one week, a ZBS scheme the next, and a spread offense the week after that. The Eagles can similarly exploit matchups on a week to week basis with their offense. They can go 5 wide or 3 tight ends, whatever they need to do that week they can do.

On top of that, they have McCoy and one of the 3 best offensive line in the NFL.

If I had to identify a weakness, that offense is not built to be patient of punishing beyond a couple of the offensive linemen. If they get the ball with 6 minutes and a 1 point lead, I don't think they can run the clock. And if they are ina game where they just plain need to keep their defense off the field, they can't do it.

I agree with most of what you said, actually, but your last paragraph dances around my main point (I would argue that a running offense like the Eagles should be able to hold a lead; Kelly did it at Oregon). Chip Kelly is an innovator, there is no doubt (I did draft LeSean McCoy in Fantasy last year for a reason,) and one who does an excellent job of making the game easy for his players. But the dirty side of that is: he's shown now bias towards toughness through adversity, and it has shown. When his teams have gotten punched in the mouth, they've folded. (I probably could have pointed to the regular season failings against teams like LSU, to back this up. The postseason comments stemmed from the topic at hand.) This is my concern for him, because I am rooting for his success. But I've seen the major blind spot, and that blind spot will definitely translate to postseason failure in the NFL when the flags are thrown less and the play becomes more physical.

Again, there is no doubt Kelly is a fantastic RB/QB/O-line developer. Brilliant. That's why I wanted Seattle to get him for O-coordinator. He's already influenced Carroll (the faster part of Bigger, Stronger, Faster, Louder), I'm guessing. However, his drafts don't make me think he's changing his view on how to build an NFL defense or run a stoic offense which laughs in the face of adversity. Maybe he does, and I'm (gladly) wrong, but it is necessary to implement the toughness through adversity if he doesn't want his Eagles to be another....well..... Eagles (Andy Reid). Furthermore, I believe you can prognosticate based on the philosophy a coach brings - hence the joy of getting Pete Carroll on this very board. (Saban is apparently a ratfink, and it makes sense he'd flunk out of the NFL with the dictator philosophy.) Carroll wanted to innovate with toughness and physicality, and it worked, correct? Kelly needs to learn from his fellow Pac 10 coach, or he's going to get booed by Philly fans and run out of town much the same way as his predecessor.

 

[BlueBlood]

Maragos was the ugly duckling and never really welcomed into the LOB. Sour Grapes... No LOB for you!

 

[Scottemojo]

Trying to make a coaches results in in college translate to the NFL, a proclivity for losing big games, etc, is just about impossible. Saban sucked in the NFL, rocks in college. Saban is a master recruiter and runs great schemes, but his players aren't always very fundamental. Kirk Ferentz is mediocre in college, and will continue to be, but would be great in the NFL because of his fundamentals teaching. He just can't get speed at Iowa, and won't.

Kelly will be very good, IMO, because he teaches fundamentals and values speed. He is to offense as Pete is to defense. Pete has made the Hawks multiple, the Hawks can matchup with a power block scheme one week, a ZBS scheme the next, and a spread offense the week after that. The Eagles can similarly exploit matchups on a week to week basis with their offense. They can go 5 wide or 3 tight ends, whatever they need to do that week they can do.

On top of that, they have McCoy and one of the 3 best offensive line in the NFL.

If I had to identify a weakness, that offense is not built to be patient of punishing beyond a couple of the offensive linemen. If they get the ball with 6 minutes and a 1 point lead, I don't think they can run the clock. And if they are ina game where they just plain need to keep their defense off the field, they can't do it.

I agree with most of what you said, actually, but your last paragraph dances around my main point (I would argue that a running offense like the Eagles should be able to hold a lead; Kelly did it at Oregon). Chip Kelly is an innovator, there is no doubt (I did draft LeSean McCoy in Fantasy last year for a reason,) and one who does an excellent job of making the game easy for his players. But the dirty side of that is: he's shown now bias towards toughness through adversity, and it has shown. When his teams have gotten punched in the mouth, they've folded. (I probably could have pointed to the regular season failings against teams like LSU, to back this up. The postseason comments stemmed from the topic at hand.) This is my concern for him, because I am rooting for his success. But I've seen the major blind spot, and that blind spot will definitely translate to postseason failure in the NFL when the flags are thrown less and the play becomes more physical.

Again, there is no doubt Kelly is a fantastic RB/QB/O-line developer. Brilliant. That's why I wanted Seattle to get him for O-coordinator. He's already influenced Carroll (the faster part of Bigger, Stronger, Faster, Louder), I'm guessing. However, his drafts don't make me think he's changing his view on how to build an NFL defense or run a stoic offense which laughs in the face of adversity. Maybe he does, and I'm (gladly) wrong, but it is necessary to implement the toughness through adversity if he doesn't want his Eagles to be another....well..... Eagles (Andy Reid). Furthermore, I believe you can prognosticate based on the philosophy a coach brings - hence the joy of getting Pete Carroll on this very board. (Saban is apparently a ratfink, and it makes sense he'd flunk out of the NFL with the dictator philosophy.) Carroll wanted to innovate with toughness and physicality, and it worked, correct? Kelly needs to learn from his fellow Pac 10 coach, or he's going to get booed by Philly fans and run out of town much the same way as his predecessor.

Even though the eagles run well, I have trouble calling it a running offense. The threat of Kelly's spread pass attack means the Eagles see a lot of nickel, and they take advantage when they run. Just like Denver. But can they run when a team sets up to stop the run? Not so far. As just like you say, it is a bad post season philosophy. No disagreement there.

I just think Kelly will be smart enough to adapt on the defensive side.

 

[scutterhawk]

lol Chris Maragos.

Okay, laugh's over. I buy it.

Seattle knew they were going to face the Saints or the Eagles. They had humiliated the Saints 34-7 about a month earlier.

They hadn't yet faced the Eagles, and the Hawks couldn't be sure how their defense would adapt to a hurry up offense of such high caliber. The Seahawks actually lost games to ballsy QBs with good arms and good enough mobility over the previous two seasons, the Colts, the Dolphins, the Lions (Stafford was impossible to sack in that game). The Eagles would also have more of a psychological advantage, playing with house money.

I was pumped when the Saints beat the Eagles. It felt like a free ticket to the NFCCG. Had the Eagles won I would have been a little nervous even though Seattle would obviously be heavily favored on paper.

I would agree if it was the 2012 Seahawks, but the 2013 Ballhawkers under Quinn's watch, not even the Bronco's with the most savvy, and experienced Quarterback ever, couldn't find a way to deal with the Seahawks Defensive speed and smother.
You'd have to ask yourself if you really believed that the LOB would actually have any apprehension playing against any team in the League.
My 2 cents, I think Maragos may have had some reservations, but I'm not buying the notion that it was universal.

 

[kearly]

Also, I don't think you can bring 2012 into the equation since that team had no pass rush.

The Seahawks put a ton of pressure on Stafford and still lost. They put pressure on Tannehill. The Atlanta game was the one where a lack of pass rush just killed us. But for the most part, mobility + arm + ballsiness = trouble. That hasn't changed.

When his teams have gotten punched in the mouth, they've folded.

I think that is a natural consequence of running a pass to set up the run hurry up offense. Chip Kelly's teams are glass cannons.

To be fair though, I think a lot of what you are referring to regarding a lack of toughness boils down to who is at QB. Darron Thomas and Marcus Mariota were effective but were not mentally tough. It was clear to me that Mariota's lack of mental toughness was the main reason he's winless against Stanford. That's one of the reasons I comp him to Kaepernick, he's amazing under normal circumstances but falls apart during duress.

Chip Kelly catches the blame for that, just like how Sark catches the blame for Keith Price unraveling when defenses like ASU and UCLA start knocking him around. But to me it's not really an issue of coaching, it was a personnel issue in college.

Is Foles a tough QB? I think he probably is, but we only have one season of data to go off of.

I would agree if it was the 2012 Seahawks, but the 2013 Ballhawkers under Quinn's watch, not even the Bronco's with the most savvy, and experienced Quarterback ever, couldn't find a way to deal with the Seahawks Defensive speed and smother.
You'd have to ask yourself if you really believed that the LOB would actually have any apprehension playing against any team in the League.
My 2 cents, I think Maragos may have had some reservations, but I'm not buying the notion that it was universal.

The Hawks smooshed Manning because he has no arm. QBs with good arms and good weapons have given our defense trouble. Most of Seattle's losses the last two seasons involved giving up big plays in the passing game.

 

[scutterhawk]

I would agree if it was the 2012 Seahawks, but the 2013 Ballhawkers under Quinn's watch, not even the Bronco's with the most savvy, and experienced Quarterback ever, couldn't find a way to deal with the Seahawks Defensive speed and smother.
You'd have to ask yourself if you really believed that the LOB would actually have any apprehension playing against any team in the League.
My 2 cents, I think Maragos may have had some reservations, but I'm not buying the notion that it was universal.

The Hawks smooshed Manning because he has no arm. QBs with good arms and good weapons have given our defense trouble. Most of Seattle's losses the last two seasons involved giving up big plays in the passing game.

Manning was touted before the big game because he usually gets rid of the ball in a hurry.
Deep balls are not hard for the LOB to defend, and all the quick passes to most everything underneath was usually framed short or minimal gains if any, especially last Season, and 2 of our losses were against our NFC WEST rivals.
Not taking anything away from the Eagles, but they didn't have to play against the likes of the Cards, 9rs or Hawks Defenses, so we really can't know for a fact that they'd fair any better than the super prolific Donkos did.
Kelly did a superb job in his first Season with the Eagles (I knew he would), but, he was lucky he didn't have to play against hard nosed Defenses like the Seahawks.

 

[RolandDeschain]

If the Eagles win that game, they'd have been 10-3 in their previous 13 games with one of the best and most difficult to defend offenses in the league. They were #1 by a huge margin in explosive plays, and when Seattle does lose it is because of explosive plays. The Eagles were also one of the NFL's better road teams.

I'm really glad we got the Saints. The Saints had basically no chance and we knew that at the time. The Eagles had a small chance. Seattle has struggled some against heavy underdog opponents.

If we go into Philly this year and win by 3 scores, will you think that you were wrong about Philly in the playoffs last year? Just curious. I know this sounds like a combative question and I swear I don't mean it that way, I just don't think we were all that vulnerable to Philly's offense, and I'm curious what your thoughts would be if (and I do mean 'if', I'm not expecting to beat them by 3+ scores in their house later this year) we do win big over them.

 

[theincrediblesok]

We have the personnel to keep up with the Eagles up-tempo offense. I'm pretty sure Wilson remembers that Rose Bowl game and wants some revenge.

Maragos saying what he has to say to his new team it's almost a written rule to talk highly of your new teammates and downplaying your last team. Look at Emmanuel Sanders, Golden Tate, and Greg Jennings, and many others (hell even the guys that come to us) as examples of guys talking up their new team. Remember Harper? I can't wait for this game.

 

[IronSaint]

Seattle knew they were going to face the Saints or the Eagles.

Well, not exactly. Had the Eagles taken us out and the 49ers still beaten the Packers the next day, you guys would've gotten the 49ers in the Divisional Round and the Panthers would've gotten the Eagles. Highest seed always plays the lowest remaining seed, so it would've been 1st vs. 5th and 2nd vs. 3rd.

But, ya'll still could've gotten them in the NFCCG. :0190l:

I'm jealous though, I'd LOVE to play the Eagles this year. Malcolm Jenkins will be torched. :lol:

 

[SalishHawkFan]

an absolute juggernaut like the Seahawks

That's what I'm talkin' 'bout :th2thumbs:

 

[Cartire]

I get foles had a great year. But you guys really need to watch his performances. They were not all the spectacular.

Watch his Green Bay Performance (video highlights, bot). And then realize that 2 of those TD's shouldnt have happened. 1 should have been an INT. Im not a spiritual man, but someone was looking out for him that day. Hell, one TD bounced off 2 defenders hands, up into the air and landed right in D. Jacksons arms. Another one was a major under throw to Cooper who amazingly found it in the sun while the other 2 defenders kept running away from the ball. Point being, Foles threw into Double coverage, and miraculously got TD's instead of the more probable INT's he should have accrued. Its easy to stare at a stat line and judge. But I think as Hawks, we should know better by now that stats do not tell the whole story.

Please note, this is only 1 game. And even though Foles made some good plays as well throughout the year, this wasnt an uncommon occurrence. He has to be deemed as one of the luckiest QB's right now. If I was scared of anything, I was scared of fluke crap getting the best of us. The overall package of the Eagles though, no, I was not scared. They were extremely over-hyped last year. They benefited, just like Denver, playing mediocre to poor defenses all year long. Their offense wasnt as fast as everyone wants to make is sound.

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