State of the NFC West...

[rlkats]

If you're talking about how shitty Baalke is I agree. If you're calling the 49ers line bad, then I would like you to consider Russell Wilson's ankle versus Gabbert's zero sack night against Aaron Donald, Robert Quinn, William Hayes and Michael Brockers...

I think my point has been quite clear throughout this thread (apart from the bits that were wrongly edited IMO).

Baalke is a disease that the 49ers need rid of.

As for Beadles -- my point was that you traded up to draft a first round guard and ZB beat him out. You can say he's a former pro bowler. So was Jahri Evans. He's at a stage in his career where he's a cheap veteran stop gap. He's not remotely special. And IMO it's another example of bad drafting by Baalke.

Not a review of the Niners O-line performance and I've never commented on that.

While sometimes I read Englishes posts they give me headaches with his constant attacking and BS. But if you float through the crap he does make valid points.

Balke is killing this team pure and simple.

 

[xgeoff]

...Gabbert's zero sack night against Aaron Donald, Robert Quinn, William Hayes and Michael Brockers...

I didn't realize the Rams got zero sacks! Holy crap. If we have a game where we allow zero sacks against the Rams you might just see singing and dancing in the streets of Seattle

 

[Seahawkfan80]

...Gabbert's zero sack night against Aaron Donald, Robert Quinn, William Hayes and Michael Brockers...

I didn't realize the Rams got zero sacks! Holy crap. If we have a game where we allow zero sacks against the Rams you might just see singing and dancing in the streets of Seattle

Seattle, Boise, Spokane, Atlanta, Tattooine, Alderaan.....oops, maybe not Alderaan. :mrgreen: :greetingsearthling:

 

[Marvin49]

If you're talking about how shitty Baalke is I agree. If you're calling the 49ers line bad, then I would like you to consider Russell Wilson's ankle versus Gabbert's zero sack night against Aaron Donald, Robert Quinn, William Hayes and Michael Brockers...

I think my point has been quite clear throughout this thread (apart from the bits that were wrongly edited IMO).

Baalke is a disease that the 49ers need rid of.

As for Beadles -- my point was that you traded up to draft a first round guard and ZB beat him out. You can say he's a former pro bowler. So was Jahri Evans. He's at a stage in his career where he's a cheap veteran stop gap. He's not remotely special. And IMO it's another example of bad drafting by Baalke.

Not a review of the Niners O-line performance and I've never commented on that.

While sometimes I read Englishes posts they give me headaches with his constant attacking and BS. But if you float through the crap he does make valid points.

Balke is killing this team pure and simple.

Really don't want to get into the Baalke discussion but it is worth noting who looked really good Monday night.

Carlos Hyde. Trent Brown. Erik Armstead. Jimmie Ward. Eric Reid. Daniel Kilgore. Jaquaski Tartt. Rashard Robinson. DeForest Buckner. Ronald Blair. Vance McDonald. Quinton Dial.

Every single one of those guys plays very well. Two of those rookies (Buckner, Robinson) were ranked by PFF in the top 10 rookie performances this week.

I'm not going to have the Ballke sucks/doesn't suck argument but this is probably not the week to have it when so many of his draft picks played well.

As for Garnett....always cracks me up when people see a first round pick not start in week 1 and leap to him being a bad pick. They don't always start week one. He's a rookie who had to miss most of the offseason OTAs and he's learning. He didn't play poorly in the preseason. t wouldn't be at all surprised if he overtook Beadles at some point his season.

IMO, its just a red herring. Peeps can attack Baalke on the QB position or the WR position but just seems really odd when the line played so well to be attacking the pick of Garnett. We'll know over time if it was a good pick but not being a starter day one doesn't really mean much.

English also might want to mind the state of his OWN O-Line before throwing stones.

 

[Marvin49]

...Gabbert's zero sack night against Aaron Donald, Robert Quinn, William Hayes and Michael Brockers...

I didn't realize the Rams got zero sacks! Holy crap. If we have a game where we allow zero sacks against the Rams you might just see singing and dancing in the streets of Seattle

Seattle, Boise, Spokane, Atlanta, Tattooine, Alderaan.....oops, maybe not Alderaan. :mrgreen: :greetingsearthling:

Yeah, no longer existing can make celebration a challenge.

 

[Marvin49]

...Gabbert's zero sack night against Aaron Donald, Robert Quinn, William Hayes and Michael Brockers...

I didn't realize the Rams got zero sacks! Holy crap. If we have a game where we allow zero sacks against the Rams you might just see singing and dancing in the streets of Seattle

Really didn't get close either.

Couple factors...

1) Gabbert was getting the ball out on average in 2.03 seconds.
2) The up tempo pace slows down the rush.
3) The Line is much improved, particularly at RT. Trent Brown might be one of Baalkes best picks, but to be honest just a serviceable RT is a HUGE improvement over Pears from last year and Martin the year prior.

 

[theENGLISHseahawk]

 

[Ramfan128]

While that was fun for the Niners fans to watch on Monday, I think we will look back at that game similarly to the Niners/Vikings game last year. The Rams just flat out weren't ready to play - and not a single player played the way they are capable of. We're not great but we're definitely better than that.

While we obviously won't be as good as the Vikings were last year, I think we'll still be a 6-8 win team as usual with unexpected wins and unexpected losses - a true hallmark of Jeff Fisher - and I am still confident that the Niners will be worse than us overall this year.

 

[5_Golden_Rings]

While that was fun for the Niners fans to watch on Monday, I think we will look back at that game similarly to the Niners/Vikings game last year. The Rams just flat out weren't ready to play - and not a single player played the way they are capable of. We're not great but we're definitely better than that.

While we obviously won't be as good as the Vikings were last year, I think we'll still be a 6-8 win team as usual with unexpected wins and unexpected losses - a true hallmark of Jeff Fisher - and I am still confident that the Niners will be worse than us overall this year.

I appreciate your optimism, but I doubt it. I haven't seen a Rams passing game that inept since... Maybe 1997 or so when Isaac Bruce was injured?

There was several big differences between this game and last year's opener. In the Vikings/Niners game, the Vikings left a TON of big plays on the field due to Teddy overthrowing multiple WRs, and one instance of a sure touchdown stopped by pass interference that wasn't called. AP had been out for an entire year, and the Vikings had so many miscues. The only thing the 49ers did well that game was run all over Minnesota, but most teams did that anyway. They were ranked 21st in average per rush allowed.

The Rams handed the game to the 49ers, sure. But it wasn't because of their mistakes and penalties. It was because of an absolutely horrendous offense. And I don't think it's going to get better this year. As for the numerous defensive holding penalties they gave up, well, there are two reasons for a defense to give up a lot of defensive holding: either they are way too physical on the back end (like Seattle), or they are getting beat and have no choice. If the 49ers WRs were forcing your guys to hold, it will be a very long season indeed for the Rams. Because they aren't scoring more than two touchdowns per game this season.

 

[Ramfan128]

While that was fun for the Niners fans to watch on Monday, I think we will look back at that game similarly to the Niners/Vikings game last year. The Rams just flat out weren't ready to play - and not a single player played the way they are capable of. We're not great but we're definitely better than that.

While we obviously won't be as good as the Vikings were last year, I think we'll still be a 6-8 win team as usual with unexpected wins and unexpected losses - a true hallmark of Jeff Fisher - and I am still confident that the Niners will be worse than us overall this year.

I appreciate your optimism, but I doubt it. I haven't seen a Rams passing game that inept since... Maybe 1997 or so when Isaac Bruce was injured?

There was several big differences between this game and last year's opener. In the Vikings/Niners game, the Vikings left a TON of big plays on the field due to Teddy overthrowing multiple WRs, and one instance of a sure touchdown stopped by pass interference that wasn't called. AP had been out for an entire year, and the Vikings had so many miscues. The only thing the 49ers did well that game was run all over Minnesota, but most teams did that anyway. They were ranked 21st in average per rush allowed.

The Rams handed the game to the 49ers, sure. But it wasn't because of their mistakes and penalties. It was because of an absolutely horrendous offense. And I don't think it's going to get better this year. As for the numerous defensive holding penalties they gave up, well, there are two reasons for a defense to give up a lot of defensive holding: either they are way too physical on the back end (like Seattle), or they are getting beat and have no choice. If the 49ers WRs were forcing your guys to hold, it will be a very long season indeed for the Rams. Because they aren't scoring more than two touchdowns per game this season.

The Niners absolutely earned the win. The point I was trying to make is that the roster is much more talented than we showed on Monday night. That passing attack was similarly awful last year. We've won games with that awful passing attack.

As for the penalties...I mean, the Niners didn't get called for one until what, late in the 3rd quarter? Maybe early 4th? Saw two blocks in the backs on a punt return with no penalties called.

It obviously didn't impact the game at all, but citing penalties as any kind of reason for why a team will or won't be bad is foolish. I'm sure the Niners held on offense and defense a few times...most teams do throughout the course of a game. Just didn't get called. And I would disagree with you as to what it means anyways. If anything it goes more toward my thinking that the Rams just weren't ready to play football. When a team plays that poorly top to bottom, it's something other than the talent. Saying it was similar to last years game was just a way of me saying I don't think this outcome will have meant anything come seasons end.

 

[Marvin49]

While that was fun for the Niners fans to watch on Monday, I think we will look back at that game similarly to the Niners/Vikings game last year. The Rams just flat out weren't ready to play - and not a single player played the way they are capable of. We're not great but we're definitely better than that.

While we obviously won't be as good as the Vikings were last year, I think we'll still be a 6-8 win team as usual with unexpected wins and unexpected losses - a true hallmark of Jeff Fisher - and I am still confident that the Niners will be worse than us overall this year.

The Vikings game is what has pretty much all prudent Niner fans hitting the pause button on any real celebration. This is particularly true considering they now have to go cross country to Carolina, 10AM start, short rest, vs defending NFC champ who lost their opener, and who themselves are playing on 10 days rest.

Yeah...that'll be ugly.

Oh yeah, then they get to go to Seattle.

I'm glad they won Monday Night because it'll likely be their only win in September.

 

[Ramfan128]

While that was fun for the Niners fans to watch on Monday, I think we will look back at that game similarly to the Niners/Vikings game last year. The Rams just flat out weren't ready to play - and not a single player played the way they are capable of. We're not great but we're definitely better than that.

While we obviously won't be as good as the Vikings were last year, I think we'll still be a 6-8 win team as usual with unexpected wins and unexpected losses - a true hallmark of Jeff Fisher - and I am still confident that the Niners will be worse than us overall this year.

The Vikings game is what has pretty much all prudent Niner fans hitting the pause button on any real celebration. This is particularly true considering they now have to go cross country to Carolina, 10AM start, short rest, vs defending NFC champ who lost their opener, and who themselves are playing on 10 days rest.

Yeah...that'll be ugly.

Oh yeah, then they get to go to Seattle.

I'm glad they won Monday Night because it'll likely be their only win in September.

It is ridiculous that they make you guys travel for a 1pm eastern time game after that late Monday nighter. Especially considering what happened last year at Pittsburgh. Just scrap the late Monday night game altogether...but if you make teams play it, at least give them the luxury of playing a home game. Rams lucked out in that regard.

 

[Marvin49]

While that was fun for the Niners fans to watch on Monday, I think we will look back at that game similarly to the Niners/Vikings game last year. The Rams just flat out weren't ready to play - and not a single player played the way they are capable of. We're not great but we're definitely better than that.

While we obviously won't be as good as the Vikings were last year, I think we'll still be a 6-8 win team as usual with unexpected wins and unexpected losses - a true hallmark of Jeff Fisher - and I am still confident that the Niners will be worse than us overall this year.

The Vikings game is what has pretty much all prudent Niner fans hitting the pause button on any real celebration. This is particularly true considering they now have to go cross country to Carolina, 10AM start, short rest, vs defending NFC champ who lost their opener, and who themselves are playing on 10 days rest.

Yeah...that'll be ugly.

Oh yeah, then they get to go to Seattle.

I'm glad they won Monday Night because it'll likely be their only win in September.

It is ridiculous that they make you guys travel for a 1pm eastern time game after that late Monday nighter. Especially considering what happened last year at Pittsburgh. Just scrap the late Monday night game altogether...but if you make teams play it, at least give them the luxury of playing a home game. Rams lucked out in that regard.

Its not just a short week for Niners cross country.

Panthers played on THURS and get 10 days rest for HOME game.

Schedule maker should be shot. Niners likely lose this game anyway, but thats just a ludicrous set of circumstances.

 

[Marvin49]

This week in the NFC West....

Pretty much learned nothing I didn't already know.

They have some good young defenders who are apt to make young defender mistakes. They don't have a QB. They really don't have any WRs.

They've got more talent than people think, but they are lacking at the most important position on the field.

Add that 4 fewer days rest against the defending NFC champion at home in 90+ degrees with high humidity....

Yeah...not sure how this was ever NOT going to be a blowout. Niners were likely always going to lose so don't want to infer that it was just the conditions, but the conditions were certainly stacked against them.

Next week should be interesting.

 

[Hawk-Lock]

I don't think a ton has changed in the NFC West from last year. Only difference is that both us and the Cardinals have taken a step back (at least for the time being). Niners look improved from last year, but are ways away from competing. Rams will be about the same.

 

[Marvin49]

I don't think a ton has changed in the NFC West from last year. Only difference is that both us and the Cardinals have taken a step back (at least for the time being). Niners look improved from last year, but are ways away from competing. Rams will be about the same.

Yeah...I think the Rams and Niners have some pieces in place, but they are lacking badly at the games most important one.

With the Rams they have Goff to look forward to. Niners? Who knows.

Deshaun Watson? lol. Who knows.

 

[Ramfan128]

In a way beating the Seahawks was just frustrating. You see what this defense is capable of but there is NO DOUBT that Winston lights us up this week.

We play good against the division (week 1 notwithstanding) and terrible against everyone else. Division games are important, but there are 10 games against non-division opponents.

On top of that, we are averaging 4.5 points per game - FOUR and a HALF points per game.

My favorite baseball team, the Indians, are averaging more runs per game this season than the Rams are averaging points through two weeks. It's a miracle that we won one of those games, but I can't help but feel like we would be lucky to average 17 points per game this year - if you take into account the state of the NFL, that is basically a record in futility. And you can clearly see that it's coaching. The Niners talent on offense is roughly the same as ours - and yet they are averaging 27 points per game, having played against really good defenses themselves, and one of those being an early game after the late Monday nighter.

So the state of the Rams is worse than I thought, even though I expected to be 1-1 at worst after these two games.

The most frustrating thing about that is that the idiots in the media who predicted us to go 4-12 might actually be right.

 

[Marvin49]

In a way beating the Seahawks was just frustrating. You see what this defense is capable of but there is NO DOUBT that Winston lights us up this week.

We play good against the division (week 1 notwithstanding) and terrible against everyone else. Division games are important, but there are 10 games against non-division opponents.

On top of that, we are averaging 4.5 points per game - FOUR and a HALF points per game.

My favorite baseball team, the Indians, are averaging more runs per game this season than the Rams are averaging points through two weeks. It's a miracle that we won one of those games, but I can't help but feel like we would be lucky to average 17 points per game this year - if you take into account the state of the NFL, that is basically a record in futility. And you can clearly see that it's coaching. The Niners talent on offense is roughly the same as ours - and yet they are averaging 27 points per game, having played against really good defenses themselves, and one of those being an early game after the late Monday nighter.

So the state of the Rams is worse than I thought, even though I expected to be 1-1 at worst after these two games.

The most frustrating thing about that is that the idiots in the media who predicted us to go 4-12 might actually be right.

I wouldn't fret to much over it.

Couple things...

1) The Rams D-Line is no joke. Seriously. The Niner O-Line is much better than advertised. They only allowed one sack in Carolina the next week and that was when their starting guard went out and Marcus Martin got beat (dude sucks hard). Through two weeks with a rebuilt right side of the O-Line, the Niners have given up very little pressure vs two very good D-Lines. Trent Brown in particular has been stellar in pass protection.

2) Rams O has been slowed down by a Seattle D that's at worst AMONG the best D's in the league and despite what happened in Carolina, SFs is better than advertised.


My point here isn't "my Niners are awesome" because they aren't. Not by a long shot. QB, WR and OLB are huge problems. I'm simply saying that past assumptions may not really give you a clear picture where the Rams stand. 4.5 points? Yeah...not good, but long year ahead and you have a few pieces on offense. Gurley in particular.

 

[b8rtm8nn]

I'll post an update - our biggest concern is CB2 - we have gone through about 10 candidates and changed out 2 more in the last two weeks. We are now at: Williams (the converted RB), M Cooper (from KC), T Simon (cut from Hawks), Bethel (ST ProBowler).

Cooper just got DPOW for his two INTs and will be splitting time with Williams, Simon is working on getting reps at ST and Bethel seems to be only ST at this point and had 3 ST tackles.

This is all good - but so far our DLine is about par with SEA, way less than Rams and still trying to figure out SF. And our LB play is below them all except maybe (MAYBE) Rams.

Offense is what it is, although BA was upset at the offense after the 40 point game last week because of all the mental errors.

 

[Marvin49]

The state of the NFC West is that the Rams are leading the division. Who saw THAT one coming 2 weeks ago.

As for Niners...

...more of the same. Gabbert sucks. WRs suck. No pass rush from the OLB position (other than Brooks and thankfully get Aaron Lynch back in 2 weeks).

Most frustrating were all the converted third downs an ridiculous distances. Constant 3 man rushes leaving Wilson all day to find a guy deep. Sigh.

Trent Brown at RT looks better every week.

Anyway...

What happened to the Cards?