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49ers Re-sign Garoppolo Highest Paid Player in NFL

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  • 5_Golden_Rings wrote:
    2_0_6 wrote:Kap sure looked good in filling in for Smith. Im sure you guys remember that guy.

    :lol:

    Kap looked good against Chicago, then the very next week started to look more like the Kap of today. HE never changed much. What changed was Randy Moss and Delanie Walker left, Vernon Davis got old, Anthony Davis retired to smoke weed, Mike Iupati and Frank Gore left, Ted Ginn left, Mario Manningham left, Alex Boone left, Jonathan Goodwin retired, Bruce Miller got cut, and so on.

    Jimmy G didn’t have all that. He was throwing to Lewis Murphy, Marquise Goodwin and some rookies, and he had the likes of terrible GUARD Zane Beadles blocking for him at RIGHT TACKLE. Put Jimmy G on the 2012 49ers and that team is significantly better.



    I know good quarterbacking when I see it. Kap never progressed beyond “potential.” Garoppolo even without any further improvement will be a quality starter. Why? Because he makes fast reads and gets ride of the ball quickly, and even though he has “game manager” tendencies, he can consistently throw in the 12-25 yard window that makes it hard to do the Alex Smith defense against him, and he can throw under pressure and convert third downs. If he DOESN’T progress, he will still be a worthy starter.


    The funny part is people who say "the league hasn't figured him out yet".

    That was fair with Kap...but Garoppolo?

    I've yet to see the solution to quick and decisive decision making, a lightning quick release, and great accuracy on short to mid range throws.

    He has work to do on long throws, but you can make a living in this league without it.
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  • 5_Golden_Rings wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:Image

    Image

    Get the feeling it will turn out like these guys .

    Then you haven’t watched the film.


    Yeah...and probably not of either of those guys either.
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  • theincrediblesok wrote:Am I the only one that thinks Jimmy G is overrated? 6 TD passing, 1 Rushing TD to 5 INT in 5 games, that don't scream anything special to me. I guess we will see this next season if they hit the jackpot, or took a hit on too many pots.

    I will give him that he can move the chains and sets up his Running backs who can actually score in the red zone and has a kicker that actually won a game for them.

    Smh. You can watch the tape (where you will see some of those INTs bounced of the able hands of guys like Lewis Murphy), or
    you can look at advanced stats, like PFF’s overal grade, which had him as the TENTH best QB in the NFL;

    https://www.profootballfocus.com/nfl/pl ... ppolo/8697

    Or you can look at his third down conversion percentage, which was highest in the NFL;

    http://stats.washingtonpost.com/fb/lead ... pe=Passing


    Or even ESPNs Total QBR, which had him second to Watson.




    Or if that is too much for you, you can look at the single most important statistic for a quarterback: yards per attempt. It will show you exactly why garoppolo is so much better than Kaepernick (8.8 vs 6.8. ).






    So ask yourself WHY Garoppolo dominated every advanced stat. The answer would be obvious IF YOU WATCHED THE FILM instead of taking a quick look at basic stats that never tell the whole story.



    *note: caps are not yeling. Just easier than italics for emphasis
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  • Yeah, he was pretty good against all the Rams backups. And in those meaningless games at the end of the year.
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  • The rest of the NFL will have "WATCHED THE FILM" as well.

    Let's see how they adjust.

    His 5 game run was against 2 bottom feeders, a couple of decent playoff teams from the AFC south playing at home and a game against a Rams team playing their reserves.

    I'll be more interested to see how he does when the teams are scheming against him.
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  • Uncle Si wrote:The rest of the NFL will have "WATCHED THE FILM" as well.

    Let's see how they adjust.

    His 5 game run was against 2 bottom feeders, a couple of decent playoff teams from the AFC south playing at home and a game against a Rams team playing their reserves.

    I'll be more interested to see how he does when the teams are scheming against him.


    To be fair, the Jags did go to the AFC champ game and were competitive
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  • Marvin49 wrote:
    5_Golden_Rings wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:Image

    Image

    Get the feeling it will turn out like these guys .

    Then you haven’t watched the film.


    Yeah...and probably not of either of those guys either.


    Watched all three play, you guys are blowing more hot air then a sex fanatic does into his blow up dolls, if they build around him he may be serviceable, however we have yet to see him play anything when all the cards are on the table.

    When he does that and elevates everyone and brings wins from the jaws of defeat we can talk all world guy.

    Till then he is a placeholder on a team that keeps changing them, he may at best be a Garcia or worst Tim Rattay.
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  • Uncle Si wrote:The rest of the NFL will have "WATCHED THE FILM" as well.

    Let's see how they adjust.

    His 5 game run was against 2 bottom feeders, a couple of decent playoff teams from the AFC south playing at home and a game against a Rams team playing their reserves.

    I'll be more interested to see how he does when the teams are scheming against him.


    Oh come on man. LOL.

    The Seahawks LOST to BOTH of those "decent playoff teams from the AFC South playing at home". The only reason you even added the "playing at home" part is because you needed further clarification for the obvious reply as the Seahawks were on the road.

    Maybe Jimmy G sucks and he never lives up to the hype, but get real. Stop trying to find reasons to discredit an astounding turnaround late in the year.

    Cracks me up. He beats the Bears and everyone says "thats just one game and they suck". He beats the Texans and they say, "OK, but both those teams suck" even though earlier in the year they couldn't beat anyone no matter how bad they were. He beats the Titans and people say "Yeah, but the Titans aren't as good as their record. Wait till next week against the Jags. That'll be the real test". They put up 44 points and knock off the Jags and people say "Well the Jags just had an off day and they were in the playoffs anyway" even though they still needed the win for playoff positioning. They Beat the Rams soundly and people say "Yeah, but the Rams didn't play their starters" which is actually fair but they don't get to choose who the other team puts out there.

    Point of all of this is that at some point you have to run out of "yeah buts".

    Dude balled out. Its that simple.
    Last edited by Marvin49 on Mon Feb 12, 2018 12:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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  • chris98251 wrote:
    Marvin49 wrote:
    5_Golden_Rings wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:Image

    Image

    Get the feeling it will turn out like these guys .

    Then you haven’t watched the film.


    Yeah...and probably not of either of those guys either.


    Watched all three play, you guys are blowing more hot air then a sex fanatic does into his blow up dolls, if they build around him he may be serviceable, however we have yet to see him play anything when all the cards are on the table.

    When he does that and elevates everyone and brings wins from the jaws of defeat we can talk all world guy.

    Till then he is a placeholder on a team that keeps changing them, he may at best be a Garcia or worst Tim Rattay.


    ....m'kay.

    1) Um, what about a blow up doll?

    2) He HAS elevated everyone, but you are right that he hasn't brought wins from Jaws of defeat....although they were down in a few of those games and had a game winning drive vs the Titans.

    3) At best he's Jeff Garcia? Based on what exactly?
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  • Cracks me up...

    9er fan desperate for Seahawk approval.

    No, i added the "at home" part because two teams traveling from the east coast to the west for games is an issue. Nothing to do with the Seahawks.

    5 rather pressure less games. But you guys continue to try and validate his greatness amidst even the slightest skepticism. And you wonder where it comes from?

    The point of all of this is that some point you run out "Dude balled out" and recognize the sheer absurdity of claiming (as some of you have) that he's the 2nd coming of Steve Montana or whatever.

    5 games. 5 games against 2 abysmal teams, 1 team playing back ups (you left that out) and 2 above average teams who traveled the width of the US for the game.

    He played well. Suggesting that once NFL teams have reviewed the tape you so diligently watched and see how he does against it makes more sense than heaping as much praise as some of you are trying. can you even see the hypocrisy in that?
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  • Marvin49 wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:
    Marvin49 wrote:
    5_Golden_Rings wrote:Then you haven’t watched the film.


    Yeah...and probably not of either of those guys either.


    Watched all three play, you guys are blowing more hot air then a sex fanatic does into his blow up dolls, if they build around him he may be serviceable, however we have yet to see him play anything when all the cards are on the table.

    When he does that and elevates everyone and brings wins from the jaws of defeat we can talk all world guy.

    Till then he is a placeholder on a team that keeps changing them, he may at best be a Garcia or worst Tim Rattay.


    ....m'kay.

    1) Um, what about a blow up doll?

    2) He HAS elevated everyone, but you are right that he hasn't brought wins from Jaws of defeat....although they were down in a few of those games and had a game winning drive vs the Titans.

    3) At best he's Jeff Garcia? Based on what exactly?


    Garcia won games for you he played with a lot of guts and heart, but there was always something seemingly missing when I seen a 49er game, still can't put a finger on it, it was like he was a polite invite to the party that nobody thought would show up.
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  • Uncle Si wrote:Cracks me up...

    9er fan desperate for Seahawk approval.

    No, i added the "at home" part because two teams traveling from the east coast to the west for games is an issue. Nothing to do with the Seahawks.

    5 rather pressure less games. But you guys continue to try and validate his greatness amidst even the slightest skepticism. And you wonder where it comes from?

    The point of all of this is that some point you run out "Dude balled out" and recognize the sheer absurdity of claiming (as some of you have) that he's the 2nd coming of Steve Montana or whatever.

    5 games. 5 games against 2 abysmal teams, 1 team playing back ups (you left that out) and 2 above average teams who traveled the width of the US for the game.

    He played well. Suggesting that once NFL teams have reviewed the tape you so diligently watched and see how he does against it makes more sense than heaping as much praise as some of you are trying. can you even see the hypocrisy in that?


    No, you added "at home" because you were trying to fit a narrative.

    They were pressure less games. That I can't disagree with, but its not like I've seen anything that would lead me to believe pressure situations would be any different. Thats no guarantee of course, but you make it sound like not having experienced that pressure = he will be bad under pressure.

    At worst, its untested.

    I have not claimed he is the second coming of Joe Montana so I won't address that, but I have said he LOOKS like the best QB since Steve Young. That doesn't make him Joe Montana or Steve young but it means right now he looks better than Garcia, Smith, or Kap. I don't think thats so tall an order.

    I'm not disparaging those who say further game film will make him easier to defend as that is true for ALL QBs, but what I AM saying is that he isn't the gimmick QB that others have been that made simple changes very effective against them.

    What he does well doesn't go out of style.

    I am not unable to see that there is a possibility that he could flame out in a big way and totally suck. Of course thats possible. However, if you take all the numbers away both good and bad and just WATCH him without a prejudiced eye (IE WANTING to see him fail or succeed) you can just see "it". Calmness in the pocket, quick decisions, steps away from pressure with eyes downfield, lightning fast release, and accuracy on short to medium throws...all good stuff that works in almost all offenses and especially in a West Coast derivative.

    Peace.

    PS: I didn't leave out the game against backups.

    "They Beat the Rams soundly and people say "Yeah, but the Rams didn't play their starters" which is actually fair but they don't get to choose who the other team puts out there."
    Last edited by Marvin49 on Mon Feb 12, 2018 1:15 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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  • chris98251 wrote:
    Marvin49 wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:
    Marvin49 wrote:
    Yeah...and probably not of either of those guys either.


    Watched all three play, you guys are blowing more hot air then a sex fanatic does into his blow up dolls, if they build around him he may be serviceable, however we have yet to see him play anything when all the cards are on the table.

    When he does that and elevates everyone and brings wins from the jaws of defeat we can talk all world guy.

    Till then he is a placeholder on a team that keeps changing them, he may at best be a Garcia or worst Tim Rattay.


    ....m'kay.

    1) Um, what about a blow up doll?

    2) He HAS elevated everyone, but you are right that he hasn't brought wins from Jaws of defeat....although they were down in a few of those games and had a game winning drive vs the Titans.

    3) At best he's Jeff Garcia? Based on what exactly?


    Garcia won games for you he played with a lot of guts and heart, but there was always something seemingly missing when I seen a 49er game, still can't put a finger on it, it was like he was a polite invite to the party that nobody thought would show up.


    I think thats an accurate description of Garcia.

    He put up numbers and won some games...but he never passed the eye test for me. I feel about Jeff about the same as I feel about Cousins.

    He just isn't "the" guy.
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  • Marvin49 wrote:
    Uncle Si wrote:Cracks me up...

    9er fan desperate for Seahawk approval.

    No, i added the "at home" part because two teams traveling from the east coast to the west for games is an issue. Nothing to do with the Seahawks.

    5 rather pressure less games. But you guys continue to try and validate his greatness amidst even the slightest skepticism. And you wonder where it comes from?

    The point of all of this is that some point you run out "Dude balled out" and recognize the sheer absurdity of claiming (as some of you have) that he's the 2nd coming of Steve Montana or whatever.

    5 games. 5 games against 2 abysmal teams, 1 team playing back ups (you left that out) and 2 above average teams who traveled the width of the US for the game.

    He played well. Suggesting that once NFL teams have reviewed the tape you so diligently watched and see how he does against it makes more sense than heaping as much praise as some of you are trying. can you even see the hypocrisy in that?


    No, you added "at home" because you were trying to fit a narrative.

    They were pressure less games. That I can't disagree with, but its not like I've seen anything that would lead me to believe pressure situations would be any different. Thats no guarantee of course, but you make it sound like not having experienced that pressure = he will be bad under pressure.

    At worst, its untested.

    I have not claimed he is the second coming of Joe Montana so I won't address that, but I have said he LOOKS like the best QB since Steve Young. That doesn't make him Joe Montana or Steve young but it means right now he looks better than Garcia, Smith, or Kap. I don't think thats so tall an order.

    I'm not disparaging those who say further game film will make him easier to defend as that is true for ALL QBs, but what I AM saying is that he isn't the gimmick QB that others have been that made simple changes very effective against them.

    What he does well doesn't go out of style.

    I am not unable to see that there is a possibility that he could flame out in a big way and totally suck. Of course thats possible. However, if you take all the numbers away both good and bad and just WATCH him without a prejudiced eye (IE WANTING to see him fail or succeed) you can just see "it". Calmness in the pocket, quick decisions, steps away from pressure with eyes downfield, lightning fast release, and accuracy on short to medium throws...all good stuff that works in almost all offenses and especially in a West Coast derivative.

    Peace.

    PS: I didn't leave out the game against backups.

    "They Beat the Rams soundly and people say "Yeah, but the Rams didn't play their starters" which is actually fair but they don't get to choose who the other team puts out there."


    I added at "home" because of what it means exactly.

    If you are not here arguing with Seahawks fans on a Seahawk board about a 49er player, than what are you doing?

    And again... after 5 games, you're willing to say "He looks like Hall of Fame and Super Bowl MVP QB Steve Young"

    my goodness. But yes.. it's us that are struggling here to remain objective. My objectivity was simply "Let's see how he does when defenses have time and tape to prepare."

    Yours... he looks like a former Hall of Fame QB
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  • Uncle Si wrote:
    Marvin49 wrote:
    Uncle Si wrote:Cracks me up...

    9er fan desperate for Seahawk approval.

    No, i added the "at home" part because two teams traveling from the east coast to the west for games is an issue. Nothing to do with the Seahawks.

    5 rather pressure less games. But you guys continue to try and validate his greatness amidst even the slightest skepticism. And you wonder where it comes from?

    The point of all of this is that some point you run out "Dude balled out" and recognize the sheer absurdity of claiming (as some of you have) that he's the 2nd coming of Steve Montana or whatever.

    5 games. 5 games against 2 abysmal teams, 1 team playing back ups (you left that out) and 2 above average teams who traveled the width of the US for the game.

    He played well. Suggesting that once NFL teams have reviewed the tape you so diligently watched and see how he does against it makes more sense than heaping as much praise as some of you are trying. can you even see the hypocrisy in that?


    No, you added "at home" because you were trying to fit a narrative.

    They were pressure less games. That I can't disagree with, but its not like I've seen anything that would lead me to believe pressure situations would be any different. Thats no guarantee of course, but you make it sound like not having experienced that pressure = he will be bad under pressure.

    At worst, its untested.

    I have not claimed he is the second coming of Joe Montana so I won't address that, but I have said he LOOKS like the best QB since Steve Young. That doesn't make him Joe Montana or Steve young but it means right now he looks better than Garcia, Smith, or Kap. I don't think thats so tall an order.

    I'm not disparaging those who say further game film will make him easier to defend as that is true for ALL QBs, but what I AM saying is that he isn't the gimmick QB that others have been that made simple changes very effective against them.

    What he does well doesn't go out of style.

    I am not unable to see that there is a possibility that he could flame out in a big way and totally suck. Of course thats possible. However, if you take all the numbers away both good and bad and just WATCH him without a prejudiced eye (IE WANTING to see him fail or succeed) you can just see "it". Calmness in the pocket, quick decisions, steps away from pressure with eyes downfield, lightning fast release, and accuracy on short to medium throws...all good stuff that works in almost all offenses and especially in a West Coast derivative.

    Peace.

    PS: I didn't leave out the game against backups.

    "They Beat the Rams soundly and people say "Yeah, but the Rams didn't play their starters" which is actually fair but they don't get to choose who the other team puts out there."


    I added at "home" because of what it means exactly.

    If you are not here arguing with Seahawks fans on a Seahawk board about a 49er player, than what are you doing?

    And again... after 5 games, you're willing to say "He looks like Hall of Fame and Super Bowl MVP QB Steve Young"

    my goodness. But yes.. it's us that are struggling here to remain objective. My objectivity was simply "Let's see how he does when defenses have time and tape to prepare."

    Yours... he looks like a former Hall of Fame QB



    Nice Hyperbole.

    1) I was actually off this page AND the 'zone for almost 2 years, so please...give it up. If you are curious as to why it had a lot to do with politics.

    2) I didn't say he looks like Steve Young. I said he looks like the best 49ers QB SINCE Steve Young and stated specifically he looks better than Garcia, Smith, and Kap. Its all cool to argue, but please do me the courtesy of arguing the point I'm actually making and not the one you made up.

    3) I didn't argue your prepare statement. I actually agreed with you and said it applied to all QBs. I simply said I thought more preparation would be less effective simply because he isn't a gimmick QB.
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  • This is proof of how ridiculous the market for QBs is in the NFL. You don't even have to be proven to earn the big $$. Lynch better hope that Jimmy G doesn't end up like Brock Osweiler.
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  • hawkfan68 wrote:This is proof of how ridiculous the market for QBs is in the NFL. You don't even have to be proven to earn the big $$. Lynch better hope that Jimmy G doesn't end up like Brock Osweiler.


    If he does the 9ers can get out of it without penalty in two years.

    Now that the full deal is out in structure it’s basically the deal Kaepernick got + market inflation and more money shoved into the first year because they’ll never have this much cap room to burn again and it allows the APY to be artificially deflated in years 2-5. (Makes sense it would be a two year deal plus three years of team options like Kap’s as Paraag Marathe negotiated both of them).
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  • http://insider.espn.com/blog/nfcwest/po ... -set-at-qb

    Pretty good article about the possible next 3 years in the NFCW. I found it interesting that all basically agreed that the current contract for JimmyG might seem like a bargain in 2-3 years due to Goff and Wilson each likely getting extensions by then, with Russell probably averaging the mid 30’s annually.

    So it will be funny to see if we all come back and argue about how stupid it is to throw that much money at a QB...when it happens to our own lol.
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  • 5_Golden_Rings wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:Image

    Image

    Get the feeling it will turn out like these guys .

    Then you haven’t watched the film.

    So Jaws and Dilfer who both played QB in the NFL for a long time, both declared Kap was going to be the next GREAT QB, never watched film on him? But, you a guy on a football forum, has better film analysistic skills then those 2?

    No offense as you seem like a good guy and all and are one of the better rival teams posters here, but I believe you’re hugely over confident and overestimating your “abilities” IMHO.
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  • I don't understand the problem and it is looking like jealousy right now. You don't believe he is proven, yet you are upset the 49ERS did this. You believe he is overrated with such little experience, yet you are upset the 49ERS did this. You think the contract will ruin a team, yet you are upset the 49ERS did this. I can go on and on...

    I am upset the 49ERS did this because the eye test shows how good this guy is. He has quick feet, pocket presence, quickest release I have seen since Marino, goes through progressions fast and throws an accurate catchable pass. Not to mention the leadership qualities I seen from the Tennessee game where he was the one seeking the coaches to go over the plan for the final drive. Yes I think this is a dumb contract as a Seahawks fan but not for the reasons I have read here.

    Let's not forget those last few meaningless games, were only meaningless when you look at the 49ers record and how they were already eliminated from playoffs. They beat playoff teams Tennessee and Jacksonville, who really needed the wins at the time. I am not counting the Rams who rested everyone.
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  • Marvin49 wrote:
    5_Golden_Rings wrote:
    2_0_6 wrote:Kap sure looked good in filling in for Smith. Im sure you guys remember that guy.

    :lol:

    Kap looked good against Chicago, then the very next week started to look more like the Kap of today. HE never changed much. What changed was Randy Moss and Delanie Walker left, Vernon Davis got old, Anthony Davis retired to smoke weed, Mike Iupati and Frank Gore left, Ted Ginn left, Mario Manningham left, Alex Boone left, Jonathan Goodwin retired, Bruce Miller got cut, and so on.

    Jimmy G didn’t have all that. He was throwing to Lewis Murphy, Marquise Goodwin and some rookies, and he had the likes of terrible GUARD Zane Beadles blocking for him at RIGHT TACKLE. Put Jimmy G on the 2012 49ers and that team is significantly better.



    I know good quarterbacking when I see it. Kap never progressed beyond “potential.” Garoppolo even without any further improvement will be a quality starter. Why? Because he makes fast reads and gets ride of the ball quickly, and even though he has “game manager” tendencies, he can consistently throw in the 12-25 yard window that makes it hard to do the Alex Smith defense against him, and he can throw under pressure and convert third downs. If he DOESN’T progress, he will still be a worthy starter.


    The funny part is people who say "the league hasn't figured him out yet".

    That was fair with Kap...but Garoppolo?

    I've yet to see the solution to quick and decisive decision making, a lightning quick release, and great accuracy on short to mid range throws.

    He has work to do on long throws, but you can make a living in this league without it.

    Absolutely you can Marvin..
    Montana showed that and seeing over the line with JG makes those short/mid fast throws deadly.
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  • I hope he's good next year.
    Really , we need a kick in the ass.
    I miss harbs and wish you guys had him back or some other yahoo I could sports hate just as much
    The year we won the SB was pretty boring watchin us smoke teams left and right .
    I always enjoyed a challenging season much more than an easy one and I never realized that until it happened.
    Just for the fun of it I hope he sucks a little bit too but I know deep down I'd rather have battles than blowouts so here's to you dreamin mofo's and wannabe heroes :179417: 2019 OR BUST :179417: Good fricken luck n I wish this were in the shack :stirthepot: :stirthepot: :stirthepot: :stirthepot: :stirthepot: :stirthepot: :irishdrinkers: :irishdrinkers: :irishdrinkers: :irishdrinkers: :irishdrinkers: :irishdrinkers:
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  • I disagree. Watching my team dominate its opponent NEVER gets old. It’s fun and NEVER boring.
    That’s why XLVIII was so great. Complete and total domination from start to finish! :)
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  • Jealousy? We have Russell Wilson. There is nothing to be jealous of. Paying that kind of coin to a guy who has 7 starts, and won some meaningless games is extremely risky.
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  • SoulfishHawk wrote:Jealousy? We have Russell Wilson. There is nothing to be jealous of. Paying that kind of coin to a guy who has 7 starts, and won some meaningless games is extremely risky.


    Actually tend to agree.

    Jealousy is the wrong word.

    If there is any jealousy it would simply be that the 49ers might have their QB for the next 5 years at 27.5 per while when Wilson resigns it might be has high as 35 mil per...but I don't think what I see here is jealousy.

    I think what I see here is HOPE that the 49ers are paying a ton of money for a guy who sucks.

    I can't fault that. I can't say I wouldn't enjoy seeing a rival spend a ton of money and cap space on a player that doesn't help them. Thats understandable.

    I'm also not blind to the fact that Jimmy G is not by any means a proven commodity. The reasoning that its a risk isn't unfounded.

    I just think its a risk worth taking and I like almost everything I've seen from him so far both on and off the field.
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  • I think he looks like the real deal, just for the record. But we shall see. The team has a lot more issues, but I expect them to be real good in 2019.
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  • Marvin49 wrote:I'm also not blind to the fact that Jimmy G is not by any means a proven commodity. The reasoning that its a risk isn't unfounded.

    I just think its a risk worth taking and I like almost everything I've seen from him so far both on and off the field.


    Very much this. I have yet to see a rival fan say they should have let him walk, and with the contract structure and the 9ers cap situation it's practically impossible to argue that they should have franchise tagged him instead.
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  • SoulfishHawk wrote:I think he looks like the real deal, just for the record. But we shall see. The team has a lot more issues, but I expect them to be real good in 2019.


    I like JG a lot so far too, but I'm a little more circumspect on the prospects of the team overall.

    I think overall they had a great offseason last year. I think they'll have two stack two more (at least) above average offseasons this year and next year to be really good by 2019.

    This team still has some massive holes. For instance, with the roster as it is currently constructed there's a non-zero chance that 12 months from now the 49ers won't have a single starter-caliber offensive lineman, edge, linebacker, or cornerback on the entire roster. I don't think that will actually end up being true, but to argue against it you have to impute a lot of things that haven't happened yet.

    This is still a bad team which now has what may be a good QB.
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  • Popeyejones wrote:
    SoulfishHawk wrote:I think he looks like the real deal, just for the record. But we shall see. The team has a lot more issues, but I expect them to be real good in 2019.


    I like JG a lot so far too, but I'm a little more circumspect on the prospects of the team overall.

    I think overall they had a great offseason last year. I think they'll have two stack two more (at least) above average offseasons this year and next year to be really good by 2019.

    This team still has some massive holes. For instance, with the roster as it is currently constructed there's a non-zero chance that 12 months from now the 49ers won't have a single starter-caliber offensive lineman, edge, linebacker, or cornerback on the entire roster. I don't think that will actually end up being true, but to argue against it you have to impute a lot of things that haven't happened yet.

    This is still a bad team which now has what may be a good QB.


    While I don't EXPECT the playoffs next year, I'm not as sure they won't be competitive sooner than 2019.

    Jimmy G made a huge difference down the stretch, but they also got some good performances from rookies last year. I think Kittle is the real deal as a TE. I love Taylor as a 3rd down player. I think Marquise will be a good #3 to stretch the field. I think Garcon coming back will be huge.

    I get your point on all of those positions...but:

    OL) That is about to be a huge focus. They are set at starter at Center (I like Kilgore more than most) and Tackle. They need depth though and they need a lot of help at OG.

    Edge) Absolutely. Will be focus of FA and Draft.

    Linebacker) Reuben hurts us here. If he's on the field, he's a monster. Malcolm Smith will be back. Coyle was decent. I'm sure there will be FA and picks here too.

    Cornerback) I like Witherspoon and Williams in the slot. They need another guy for sure...and again, FA and Draft. They are looking at Vontae Davis today, but not sure what he has left.

    The good news on all these positions is that they have cash and picks to address them.

    We'll see if they can do so successfully.

    Also, all good teams have holes. Even if they can't address ALL of these positions, that may not preclude them from contending. A good QB can cover ALOT of flaws.
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  • We know that all too well. We had one of the worst O Lines in history and still won 9 (would have been 10 if wide right didn't miss in the Zona game). Russ carried the team so many times. Ugh
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  • Marvin49 wrote:
    Popeyejones wrote:
    SoulfishHawk wrote:I think he looks like the real deal, just for the record. But we shall see. The team has a lot more issues, but I expect them to be real good in 2019.


    I like JG a lot so far too, but I'm a little more circumspect on the prospects of the team overall.

    I think overall they had a great offseason last year. I think they'll have two stack two more (at least) above average offseasons this year and next year to be really good by 2019.

    This team still has some massive holes. For instance, with the roster as it is currently constructed there's a non-zero chance that 12 months from now the 49ers won't have a single starter-caliber offensive lineman, edge, linebacker, or cornerback on the entire roster. I don't think that will actually end up being true, but to argue against it you have to impute a lot of things that haven't happened yet.

    This is still a bad team which now has what may be a good QB.


    While I don't EXPECT the playoffs next year, I'm not as sure they won't be competitive sooner than 2019.

    Jimmy G made a huge difference down the stretch, but they also got some good performances from rookies last year. I think Kittle is the real deal as a TE. I love Taylor as a 3rd down player. I think Marquise will be a good #3 to stretch the field. I think Garcon coming back will be huge.

    I get your point on all of those positions...but:

    OL) That is about to be a huge focus. They are set at starter at Center (I like Kilgore more than most) and Tackle. They need depth though and they need a lot of help at OG.

    Edge) Absolutely. Will be focus of FA and Draft.

    Linebacker) Reuben hurts us here. If he's on the field, he's a monster. Malcolm Smith will be back. Coyle was decent. I'm sure there will be FA and picks here too.

    Cornerback) I like Witherspoon and Williams in the slot. They need another guy for sure...and again, FA and Draft. They are looking at Vontae Davis today, but not sure what he has left.

    The good news on all these positions is that they have cash and picks to address them.

    We'll see if they can do so successfully.

    Also, all good teams have holes. Even if they can't address ALL of these positions, that may not preclude them from contending. A good QB can cover ALOT of flaws.

    Are these two ex Hawks?
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  • IndyHawk wrote:
    Marvin49 wrote:
    Popeyejones wrote:
    SoulfishHawk wrote:I think he looks like the real deal, just for the record. But we shall see. The team has a lot more issues, but I expect them to be real good in 2019.


    I like JG a lot so far too, but I'm a little more circumspect on the prospects of the team overall.

    I think overall they had a great offseason last year. I think they'll have two stack two more (at least) above average offseasons this year and next year to be really good by 2019.

    This team still has some massive holes. For instance, with the roster as it is currently constructed there's a non-zero chance that 12 months from now the 49ers won't have a single starter-caliber offensive lineman, edge, linebacker, or cornerback on the entire roster. I don't think that will actually end up being true, but to argue against it you have to impute a lot of things that haven't happened yet.

    This is still a bad team which now has what may be a good QB.


    While I don't EXPECT the playoffs next year, I'm not as sure they won't be competitive sooner than 2019.

    Jimmy G made a huge difference down the stretch, but they also got some good performances from rookies last year. I think Kittle is the real deal as a TE. I love Taylor as a 3rd down player. I think Marquise will be a good #3 to stretch the field. I think Garcon coming back will be huge.

    I get your point on all of those positions...but:

    OL) That is about to be a huge focus. They are set at starter at Center (I like Kilgore more than most) and Tackle. They need depth though and they need a lot of help at OG.

    Edge) Absolutely. Will be focus of FA and Draft.

    Linebacker) Reuben hurts us here. If he's on the field, he's a monster. Malcolm Smith will be back. Coyle was decent. I'm sure there will be FA and picks here too.

    Cornerback) I like Witherspoon and Williams in the slot. They need another guy for sure...and again, FA and Draft. They are looking at Vontae Davis today, but not sure what he has left.

    The good news on all these positions is that they have cash and picks to address them.

    We'll see if they can do so successfully.

    Also, all good teams have holes. Even if they can't address ALL of these positions, that may not preclude them from contending. A good QB can cover ALOT of flaws.

    Are these two ex Hawks?


    Yes they are
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  • Well there is now film on Garopollo now, teams will start tracking his tendencies and take away his #1 option as much as they can. The first level of adjustments should be telling on how he adjusts and how his stats look early on. It's now about constant adjustments for him to find something they didn't take away. How he does that will determine his success.
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  • chris98251 wrote:Well there is now film on Garopollo now, teams will start tracking his tendencies and take away his #1 option as much as they can. The first level of adjustments should be telling on how he adjusts and how his stats look early on. It's now about constant adjustments for him to find something they didn't take away. How he does that will determine his success.


    Thats fair.

    I don't think it will make a huge difference though.

    The Jags were jumping all over his first option with lightning fast LBs and they just couldn't get there due to the speed of his release.

    In time he'll actually know the offense better so he'll know better where those 2nd and 3rd reads will be.

    He can of course still regress badly, but I really don't think its gonna happen.
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  • Small sample size to date, nobody knows for sure yet - that's the bottom line.

    He looked good. Whether that is a long-term trend or not remains to be seen.
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  • SoulfishHawk wrote:We know that all too well. We had one of the worst O Lines in history and still won 9 (would have been 10 if wide right didn't miss in the Zona game). Russ carried the team so many times. Ugh
    11.
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  • I'm not forgetting anything. The D crapped the bed after Russ took them to what should have been a game winner. 3 missed fg's or not, the D blew that game just as much.
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  • SoulfishHawk wrote:I'm not forgetting anything. The D crapped the bed after Russ took them to what should have been a game winner. 3 missed fg's or not, the D blew that game just as much.


    Quit blaming the Defense for the lack of talent on the O line and a bad kicker, bad Coordinators, they had a series of injuries and played from behind most the time in a protect scheme and not attacking, they held up well under the circumstances, would love to see you in a ass kicking contest with only one leg.
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  • RolandDeschain wrote:Small sample size to date, nobody knows for sure yet - that's the bottom line.

    He looked good. Whether that is a long-term trend or not remains to be seen.


    Absolutely agreed.

    And that's what makes the structure of the deal so important.

    If what we've seen from him so far is a total aberration and he actually sucks, in 24 months the 9ers can get out of the deal with only 4 million in dead money (on a cap projected over 205 million), and having only spent cap room that they had way too much of to begin with anyway (115 million this year), and with Shanahan and Lynch still only halfway through their contracts.

    And if what we've seen from so far his isn't an aberration and is an accurate reflection of his quality as a quarterback, the 9ers are paying through the nose for him this year (in a year when they have more cap room than they know what to do with) and get a top flight QB for the four years after that on a bargain as they build around him.

    Personally, I've got a list of three of four things I'm going to need to see from him to really feel comfortable that he's a top 12-15 or so QB in the NFL or better, but I think people criticizing the deal probably don't actually know the details of it.
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  • If you have all that cap space, why not? I don't get criticisms of this deal at all, SF is a young, rebuilding team and they can afford to make mistakes. Foster doesn't work out? Barely matters IMO. I think that Bill would've given Jimmy G this deal and kept Brady if he had an extra 25M in cap space. If you have the money, there's no good reason not to.
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  • Boy I sure expect the NFC west to a scary division again
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  • We'll have to see how it plays out. From me watching him, he does seem to have that "clutch" gene or "it factor" or whatever - something that Wilson also seems to have.

    But he's still unproven. They took it to Jacksonville, which was impressive. But I need to see a full season out of him. I think the media is severely overrating him right now by talking about the Niners as if they will be a playoff team next year. It's possible...but if the Cardinals land Cousins or another QB, the Niners could be staring at last place again.
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  • Jimmy G is a good QB. Y'all very lucky. You don't need to see many games to know who got it and who don't and Jimmy G got it. Sure he will have his struggles, but who doesn't.
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  • Sports Hernia wrote:
    5_Golden_Rings wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:Image

    Image

    Get the feeling it will turn out like these guys .

    Then you haven’t watched the film.

    So Jaws and Dilfer who both played QB in the NFL for a long time, both declared Kap was going to be the next GREAT QB, never watched film on him? But, you a guy on a football forum, has better film analysistic skills then those 2?

    No offense as you seem like a good guy and all and are one of the better rival teams posters here, but I believe you’re hugely over confident and overestimating your “abilities” IMHO.

    Another classic example of ignoring highly relevant details to make your argument seem more sound than it is.

    The claim by Jaws was made after the Bears game, and it was based ENTIRELY on physical talent. Not many people doubt that Kap is one of the most physically gifted quarterbacks to ever play the game. Elite arm, elite speed, elite size and strength, etc.


    But it was too early to see if he possessed the necessary mental attributes, such as the ability to consistently throw with anticipation, the ability to make the necessary quick reads and decisions of the NFL game, and the ability and willingness to take the check down (recall the INT in the NFC championship game; a wr was wide open five yards down the field. He couod have gotton out of bounds and Kap couod have lived to play again. But he makes his decisions before the ball is snapped). It was too early to tell because he never had to do these things in college, due to his physical abilities.



    Garoppolo, by contrast, has played PLENTY enough to show that he throws accurately with anticipation, that he makes quick decisions, that he quickly and accurately disgnosis the defense, and that he manages the game well, including taking the necessary check downs. HOW do I know this? Because unlike Kaepernick, he has been doing it SINCE COLLEGE. Watch his college tape and you will see the same quarterback.

    Kaepernick was a physical monster that guys like Jaws ASSUMED would add the necessary skills an NFL quarterback must have. Garoppolo ALREADY HAS THEM and has had them since his days in college.







    That is the difference, and it’s why this comparison to Kap is at best ignorant and at worst idiotic. Worst case scenario for Garoppolo, besides career ending injury: he becomes a quality NFL starter, somewhere around the Matthew Stafford/Andy Dalton level. I know this because there is no projection or hope that he will someday have the minimum traits required to manage an NFL offense. He already has them and has had them since college.
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  • 5_Golden_Rings wrote:
    Sports Hernia wrote:
    5_Golden_Rings wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:Image

    Image

    Get the feeling it will turn out like these guys .

    Then you haven’t watched the film.

    So Jaws and Dilfer who both played QB in the NFL for a long time, both declared Kap was going to be the next GREAT QB, never watched film on him? But, you a guy on a football forum, has better film analysistic skills then those 2?

    No offense as you seem like a good guy and all and are one of the better rival teams posters here, but I believe you’re hugely over confident and overestimating your “abilities” IMHO.

    Another classic example of ignoring highly relevant details to make your argument seem more sound than it is.

    The claim by Jaws was made after the Bears game, and it was based ENTIRELY on physical talent. Not many people doubt that Kap is one of the most physically gifted quarterbacks to ever play the game. Elite arm, elite speed, elite size and strength, etc.


    But it was too early to see if he possessed the necessary mental attributes, such as the ability to consistently throw with anticipation, the ability to make the necessary quick reads and decisions of the NFL game, and the ability and willingness to take the check down (recall the INT in the NFC championship game; a wr was wide open five yards down the field. He couod have gotton out of bounds and Kap couod have lived to play again. But he makes his decisions before the ball is snapped). It was too early to tell because he never had to do these things in college, due to his physical abilities.



    Garoppolo, by contrast, has played PLENTY enough to show that he throws accurately with anticipation, that he makes quick decisions, that he quickly and accurately disgnosis the defense, and that he manages the game well, including taking the necessary check downs. HOW do I know this? Because unlike Kaepernick, he has been doing it SINCE COLLEGE. Watch his college tape and you will see the same quarterback.

    Kaepernick was a physical monster that guys like Jaws ASSUMED would add the necessary skills an NFL quarterback must have. Garoppolo ALREADY HAS THEM and has had them since his days in college.







    That is the difference, and it’s why this comparison to Kap is at best ignorant and at worst idiotic. Worst case scenario for Garoppolo, besides career ending injury: he becomes a quality NFL starter, somewhere around the Matthew Stafford/Andy Dalton level. I know this because there is no projection or hope that he will someday have the minimum traits required to manage an NFL offense. He already has them and has had them since college.

    Also Jaws said after Buttfumble Sanchize was drafted, he was destined for greatness. Could make all the throws, anticipates well...we know how that turned out. I don't put much faith in Jaws.
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  • https://twitter.com/Eric_Branch/status/ ... 3588100096

    Seems Richard Sherman thought highly of Garoppolo.

    Per Eric Branch: "Richard Sherman on how presence of Jimmy Garoppolo influenced his decision: "That had a huge part in it.""

    Full quote from Cam Inman:

    https://twitter.com/CamInman/status/973247199998980096

    "That had a huge part. The way he played down the stretch was inspiring, it was incredible. Sometimes quarterbacks can get hot and the next year fall of the face of the Earth and not hear from them again. I saw poise, leadership, respect."

    I'm guessing the "fall off the earth" comment was about his success in New England in 2015 followed up by him doing it again in 2017.
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  • 5_Golden_Rings wrote:https://twitter.com/Eric_Branch/status/973247003588100096

    Seems Richard Sherman thought highly of Garoppolo.

    Per Eric Branch: "Richard Sherman on how presence of Jimmy Garoppolo influenced his decision: "That had a huge part in it.""

    Full quote from Cam Inman:

    https://twitter.com/CamInman/status/973247199998980096

    "That had a huge part. The way he played down the stretch was inspiring, it was incredible. Sometimes quarterbacks can get hot and the next year fall of the face of the Earth and not hear from them again. I saw poise, leadership, respect."

    I'm guessing the "fall off the earth" comment was about his success in New England in 2015 followed up by him doing it again in 2017.


    That seems odd though, Garoppolo really only has had short stints of success. He had less than 100 passes with NE, it has very little weight. I am not discrediting his work last season, he looked good. Certainly reason for hope. He absolutely could fall off a cliff in his first full season, however.
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  • Coug_Hawk08 wrote:
    5_Golden_Rings wrote:https://twitter.com/Eric_Branch/status/973247003588100096

    Seems Richard Sherman thought highly of Garoppolo.

    Per Eric Branch: "Richard Sherman on how presence of Jimmy Garoppolo influenced his decision: "That had a huge part in it.""

    Full quote from Cam Inman:

    https://twitter.com/CamInman/status/973247199998980096

    "That had a huge part. The way he played down the stretch was inspiring, it was incredible. Sometimes quarterbacks can get hot and the next year fall of the face of the Earth and not hear from them again. I saw poise, leadership, respect."

    I'm guessing the "fall off the earth" comment was about his success in New England in 2015 followed up by him doing it again in 2017.


    That seems odd though, Garoppolo really only has had short stints of success. He had less than 100 passes with NE, it has very little weight. I am not discrediting his work last season, he looked good. Certainly reason for hope. He absolutely could fall off a cliff in his first full season, however.
    As could anyone but that is besides the point. We all know Sherman is no dummy, very intelligent, and is trying his best to take away the bad blood and at the same time endear himself to the new fan base. I mean look no further than him saying he meant no malice for eating turkey on the 50 yard line in SF... LOL

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  • Garoppolo is probs elite yall.
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  • Coug_Hawk08 wrote:
    5_Golden_Rings wrote:https://twitter.com/Eric_Branch/status/973247003588100096

    Seems Richard Sherman thought highly of Garoppolo.

    Per Eric Branch: "Richard Sherman on how presence of Jimmy Garoppolo influenced his decision: "That had a huge part in it.""

    Full quote from Cam Inman:

    https://twitter.com/CamInman/status/973247199998980096

    "That had a huge part. The way he played down the stretch was inspiring, it was incredible. Sometimes quarterbacks can get hot and the next year fall of the face of the Earth and not hear from them again. I saw poise, leadership, respect."

    I'm guessing the "fall off the earth" comment was about his success in New England in 2015 followed up by him doing it again in 2017.


    That seems odd though, Garoppolo really only has had short stints of success. He had less than 100 passes with NE, it has very little weight. I am not discrediting his work last season, he looked good. Certainly reason for hope. He absolutely could fall off a cliff in his first full season, however.

    It might be a small sample size, but I mean, it's hard to deny this:

    Image

    Since I have to compile the stats myself, it won't be as extensive. However, the change from Alex Smith to Kaepernick wasn't nearly as dramatic. And even though Alex Smith is a quality QB, it still shows that the comparison to Kaepernick just isn't very valid. Kaepernick didn't really elevate the team all that much, not the way Jimmy G did.

    Points per game Alex Smith: 26.53 (note: this is more exact that most websites, because I actually calculated Alex Smith's exact number of games [rounded to the nearest hundredth of a quarter] before he was replaced by Kap 19 seconds past midway through the 2nd quarter, which means he played exactly 0.3865 of the game)

    Points per game Kap: 29.02 (including playoffs and 0.6135 of the first Rams game)






    Passing yards per game Alex: 226.76

    Passing yards per game Kap: 228.01 (including playoffs)





    Rushing yards per game Alex: 189.94 (including the 54 yards rushing gained before Alex went out)

    Rushing yards per game Kap: 164.1 Believe it or not this is accurate! This was very surprising to me, so I double checked the numbers. Looking closer you can see why. In 7.3865 games, the Alex Smith 49ers went over 150 rushing yards 4 times, for more than 54% of their games, while with Kaepernick they went over 150 4 out of 10.6135 games for less than 37% of the time. Very surprising.



    I could go on, but the point is Kaepernick made the offense a little better in most categories in 2012, while Jimmy G took an offense at the bottom of the league and made it one of the best in the league.


    That is very, very hard to ignore, regardless of sample size, and it is a FAR greater impact than Kaepernick had in 2012.
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