Is it arrogance?

[Yxes1122]

The in vogue path to the Superbowl right now is:

Draft a rookie QB, spend big in FA and use draft capital to get proven talent.

We did it. Philly did it. LA did it. Now the Browns and (I guess?) the Cardinals are trying to replicate it.

You can even make the case that Atlanta and Denver bought Superbowl appearancest. But that is a volatile method of success. You're going to see a lot of ups and downs.

I'm fine with the Seahawks staying patient, but now they have to prove they actually have a plan and aren't just staring at their lack of cap space and draft capital like a deer in headlights.

It's a big year for Pete and John. This team outperformed it's talent level by miles last year, and now we've shed more talent. So how they replenish and adapt is going to say a lot.

Seems like John is playing the Comp pick game again. Hopefully next year, the draft is as deep as it is this year.

 

[Uncle Si]

Its not realistic to assume 12-4 and super bowl every year as an expectation.

Not one team hasnt made tough decisions like the ones you criticized above... while leaving out many positive decisions as well.

Its flat irratuonal to expect the team to continue the sort of success in the way they did in 2013 and 14 for multiple years.

Considering what they have accomplished, id say leadership has done fine. In gindsight could they have done a few things different, yeah of course.

But 5 playoff years and 10 win seasons since a super bowl loss is better than every nfl team except one. And that team does not deal with the mitigating factor of paying a qb.

So, you admit that the team is on a downward trajectory but are OK with it cause we did good things 5 years ago. At what point will you stop being OK with this mediocrity? This team has made continual garbage decisions over and over again but these decisions are just shrugged off with a "pobodys nerfect" and the irrational belief that some how we are about to turn the corner. The constant defense of this administration is baffling. It's like with players, you need to get rid of them a year too early instead of a year to late. Pete and John have put this team in such bad straights that when they are finally canned it is going to take multiple years (IF everything goes right) to get them back in competition. But I guess that it's fine that we are not a legit contenteder because we won it all in the Obama era.

Yes 10 win seasons and playoffs are some dire straights.

If you want to quantify a downward trajectory as "not winning 12 games a year and not making a super bowl" then i reckon conversing about how illogical that is makes no sense.

Also.. they continue to find diamonds in the rough. As apparent by the salaries those players are garnering from other teams

You must been a huge Browns fan in the 80s. I mean, they WENT to the AFC championship game four times in a row! I wish that I had your taste for losing, it would make things easier. The reality is that we are no longer a viable contender for the Super Bowl. That window is closed. The team keeps getting worse and worse (which you are OK with cause they make the playoffs) and will eventually tank. Yes, the goal of the team should be to win the Super Bowl. Every year. This regime is arrogant as they think that they are still ahead of the curve. The league has moved past them and figured them out. We lost a bunch of players and are sitting on our hands with only a couple draft picks. Pete and John think they can build a championship teams with reject players and we are gonna see more Mingo's added to the squad (while letting folks like Earl walk with no compensation). Can't wait for you to talk about how great the team is in a couple years when we have multiple 7-9 seasons and let Russel walk with no compesation. I mean, will there ever be a time when what this team did 6 years ago doesn't cover for their current failures for you?

But they dont get worse and worse, as many very simple metrics indicate.

Pete and john have created a model for building a championship team.. and they are in the process of restarting that model while adjusting it to paying a QBs salary.

Youre the one latched onto 6 years ago. Not me.

Simple..but hard to see if expectations of success are based on something so rarely achieved.

I dont disagree with the mistakes you detailed... and some were avoidable. But i also see the process and see it revolving into affect again.

 

[flv]

The NFL is a resource based competition and salary cap is a big resource. To get to the top requires being top whatever percent in overall resource management or being very lucky. Competing for FAs at the peak of the market price is unlikely to be a successful resource management strategy. It works only when there are very few holes to fill and it only works for a short period of time. 5 consecutive years over .500 is a phenomenal achievement. Anything can happen in the playoffs.

 

[DomeHawk]

We go through this most years. We let good players go and don’t address needs in free agency. I have always thought it is because Pete and JS think they are just that much brighter than everyone else. They think they can take other teams trash and turn it into starters. They ignore all the draft projections and take picks rounds earlier because they are just that much better. In the end they fail more than they succeed.

It’s frustrating.

There's a central theme in Carroll's program.

He always "believes" he can get the "most" out his players. Be it, his personality, scheme, etc.

This is why Seattle under Carroll does not do the "norm."

Carroll trusts his system.

Defensively, it's great to play in Carroll's system. It's very simple.

Attack the QB with a front 4. Linebackers don't let a RB hit the edge or run up the middle. And secondary keep everything in front of you.

Carroll's system is NOT complicated defensively. His scheme, he believes he can plug a lot of players to play it.

Which is why Carroll DOES not want to (at least now) pay a lot for free agents now.

Just my two cents.

Yes, the basic scheme is simple but within that there are techniques that not everybody has been able to master.

http://www.espn.com/blog/seattle-seahaw ... on-defense

 

[Fade]

The Packers have the Highest Paid QB in the sport and it hasn't stopped them from going crazy in Free Agency. The casuals on here need to stop using that old trope as it has nothing to do with it. (If you pay the QB, you can't afford anything else propaganda.)

It is philosophical not financial.

I am fine with letting guys walk, and staying out of Free Agency at the start when the dumb money is paid.

Seattle has flushed so much money down the toilet in the last 5 years in FA it is a good thing they are sitting it out.

Though I wanted to add a pass rusher or two to the team, and Seattle doesn't seem interested which is the only question mark for me. They may still find someone though, and after everyone has spent dumb money the Seahawks can scoop up some descent rushers at a great price.

These guys all are flawed, but something could get done on the cheap by giving them a prove it contract.

Ziggy Ansah
Derrick Morgan
Nick Perry
Timmy Jernigan
David Irving

 

[TwistedHusky]

Don't spend anything in FA for the big names or contracts, unless they are your own guys.

They keep screwing this up so it is nice to see they are not making the mistake and going against that above rule this year.

At least we won't be bringing in guys that don't produce AND eat up the cap.

That is an improvement, it isn't arrogance. It is more finally learning from their mistakes.

 

[Seymour]

One signing we still could pull off is TJ Lang. He played well last year and letting Sweezy go could possibly be a sign it could happen.

I would put him clearly above Fluker also.

Edit....well debatable since I did not realize he missed 10 games. maybe a bargain contract signing??

https://www.profootballfocus.com/ne...an-intriguing-option-for-teams-in-free-agency

 

[SoulfishHawk]

Isn't he dealing with injury problems though?

 

[lukerguy]

Does Kam's money count against the cap until the contract ends?

Injured players shouldn't count against the cap.

 

[Seymour]

Isn't he dealing with injury problems though?

He was...I made that edit. Not sure the condition of his neck injury now??

If he can get healthy and return to his best, Lang would provide an instant upgrade to most lines in the NFL. He’s a player that has recorded pass-blocking grades of at least 80.0 in six of his 10 professional seasons, and pass-blocking grades of at least 85.0 in each of his last five. Since 2014, he’s allowed a total of just 72 pressures (and only seven sacks) on his 2568 pass-blocking snaps over that span, while his cumulative pass-blocking grade of 93.1, his pressure rate of 2.8%, and his pass-blocking efficiency of 98.5 rank second, third, and fourth among 133 offensive guards with at least 500 pass-blocking snaps in that span, respectively.

 

[Seymour]

Does Kam's money count against the cap until the contract ends?

Injured players shouldn't count against the cap.

That doesn't account for the Belicheat factor. He would just have players fake injury to get them off the cap and rest them for post season.

 

[WestcoastSteve]

We go through this most years. We let good players go and don’t address needs in free agency. I have always thought it is because Pete and JS think they are just that much brighter than everyone else. They think they can take other teams trash and turn it into starters. They ignore all the draft projections and take picks rounds earlier because they are just that much better. In the end they fail more than they succeed.

It’s frustrating.

Checks to see if OP is new here...

Listen free agency is like when the new Iphone comes out. People racing out to buy the new shiny toy.

You can argue that the Seahawks haven't drafted as well lately and you're probably right but sitting out free agency is not a bad thing. The Patriots largely do it. Even our glory years (2012-2014) were built via the draft rather than free agency.

When we did dip into free agency it was 1 year value deals like what we got with Bennett and Avril.

Most free agents only play 2-3 years before they are cut again. Go look at the 2016 free agent class, you will laugh at how many of those guys are out of the league or free agents right now.

 

[WestcoastSteve]

That is a downward trajectory. Then take in the terrible moves this team has made since then. Jimmy Graham trade. Sheldon Richardson one year rental. Malik Mcdowell. Resigning Kam. Letting Earl walk for no compensation. Cutting Sherman instead of trading him to get something. Trading Bennet for pennies. Penny. And look at the team now. Barely any draft capital. Holes all over the place. This team was better last year than in 2017 but that was a mirage. But hey, they did good stuff 5 years ago so we should be happy, right?[

They made some bad decisions and it appears to me they are in the process of fixing it. Signing a bunch of overpaid free agents won't fix the issue. Being smart with their money and drafting well would.

 

[WestcoastSteve]

Woah... This is starting to feel like the twilight zone. The league year has barely even started maybe we should wait until after the draft before we bury this team in irrelevancy.

There's always a contingent of people who are unhappy that the front office doesn't pick up the big name, big dollar free agents the first few days. FOMO is real.

Yup that's it. You see Jets fans beating their chest right now as off-season champions but will you be shocked when they win 7 games?

 

[WestcoastSteve]

One signing we still could pull off is TJ Lang. He played well last year and letting Sweezy go could possibly be a sign it could happen.

I would put him clearly above Fluker also.

Edit....well debatable since I did not realize he missed 10 games. maybe a bargain contract signing??

https://www.profootballfocus.com/ne...an-intriguing-option-for-teams-in-free-agency

We don't need another injury prone OL we have Simmons and potentially Fluker.

He seems like the next Mike Wahle. Hard Pass

 

[jammerhawk]

Does Kam's money count against the cap until the contract ends?

Injured players shouldn't count against the cap.

That doesn't account for the Belicheat factor. He would just have players fake injury to get them off the cap and rest them for post season.

The way to deal with that cheat is to make the money for players subject to recall part of the cap.

 

[Seymour]

One signing we still could pull off is TJ Lang. He played well last year and letting Sweezy go could possibly be a sign it could happen.

I would put him clearly above Fluker also.

Edit....well debatable since I did not realize he missed 10 games. maybe a bargain contract signing??

https://www.profootballfocus.com/ne...an-intriguing-option-for-teams-in-free-agency

We don't need another injury prone OL we have Simmons and potentially Fluker.

He seems like the next Mike Wahle. Hard Pass

He is NOT injury prone. Nothing like the others. Last year was his first major (over 3 games) issue with that.

However, with two years under his belt, Lang quickly established himself as one of the most reliable pass-protecting guards in the NFL. About as durable as they came, Lang played at least 900 snaps in each season from 2011 to 2016, and he recorded pass-blocking grades north of 75.0 in five of those six seasons. His career-best stretch came between 2015 and 2016, where he earned elite pass-blocking grades of 90.1 and 91.9, respectively, while he allowed a grand total of 31 total pressures on his combined 1299 pass-blocking snaps over that span.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

Its not realistic to assume 12-4 and super bowl every year as an expectation.

Not one team hasnt made tough decisions like the ones you criticized above... while leaving out many positive decisions as well.

Its flat irratuonal to expect the team to continue the sort of success in the way they did in 2013 and 14 for multiple years.

Considering what they have accomplished, id say leadership has done fine. In gindsight could they have done a few things different, yeah of course.

But 5 playoff years and 10 win seasons since a super bowl loss is better than every nfl team except one. And that team does not deal with the mitigating factor of paying a qb.

So, you admit that the team is on a downward trajectory but are OK with it cause we did good things 5 years ago. At what point will you stop being OK with this mediocrity? This team has made continual garbage decisions over and over again but these decisions are just shrugged off with a "pobodys nerfect" and the irrational belief that some how we are about to turn the corner. The constant defense of this administration is baffling. It's like with players, you need to get rid of them a year too early instead of a year to late. Pete and John have put this team in such bad straights that when they are finally canned it is going to take multiple years (IF everything goes right) to get them back in competition. But I guess that it's fine that we are not a legit contenteder because we won it all in the Obama era.

Yes 10 win seasons and playoffs are some dire straights.

If you want to quantify a downward trajectory as "not winning 12 games a year and not making a super bowl" then i reckon conversing about how illogical that is makes no sense.

Also.. they continue to find diamonds in the rough. As apparent by the salaries those players are garnering from other teams

You must been a huge Browns fan in the 80s. I mean, they WENT to the AFC championship game four times in a row! I wish that I had your taste for losing, it would make things easier. The reality is that we are no longer a viable contender for the Super Bowl. That window is closed. The team keeps getting worse and worse (which you are OK with cause they make the playoffs) and will eventually tank. Yes, the goal of the team should be to win the Super Bowl. Every year. This regime is arrogant as they think that they are still ahead of the curve. The league has moved past them and figured them out. We lost a bunch of players and are sitting on our hands with only a couple draft picks. Pete and John think they can build a championship teams with reject players and we are gonna see more Mingo's added to the squad (while letting folks like Earl walk with no compensation). Can't wait for you to talk about how great the team is in a couple years when we have multiple 7-9 seasons and let Russel walk with no compesation. I mean, will there ever be a time when what this team did 6 years ago doesn't cover for their current failures for you?

So, how many Super Bowls in a seven-year span are enough for you?

 

[Fade]

Lang is definitely an option to explore. He won't count against the comp pick formula either.

If he is right health wise, sign me up.

 

[MontanaHawk05]

Lang is definitely an option to explore. He won't count against the comp pick formula either.

If he is right health wise, sign me up.

That would be truly epic. Pete and John almost got ridden out of town a couple of years ago when they didn't get Lang. Watch them get him now and he doesn't cost a comp pick.