Jalen Carter scheduled to visit with the Hawks this week

[massari]

Now we're hearing he was missing and being late to meetings and practice

 

[massari]

Not even in the same stratosphere talent wise. But ok, I'll entertain you. Let me give you a list of players who also had red flags coming out of college.

Tyrann Mathieu: Booted from LSU after reports of multiple failed drug tests.

Janoris Jenkins: A talent perhaps on par with Vernon Hargreaves III, Jenkins got dismissed by the Gators after multiple arrests, including fighting and drug possession.

Jameis Winston: His college resume included an entire gamut of missteps, from the petty (shouting an untoward phrase in the student union, a BB gun complaint) to the face-palm type (shoplifting crab legs) and the downright serious (a rape allegation that never led to formal charges). But he still earned the No. 1 overall draft pick and became NFL Rookie of the Year in 2015 after accounting for 28 touchdowns in his first season.

Randy Moss: Dismissed from Notre Dame before he ever enrolled due to a high school fight, Moss subsequently lost his scholarship at Florida State due to a positive test for marijuana. He did not show up to the NFL combine in ’98 — some speculated it was to avoid a drug test — but still became a first-round pick as the Minnesota Vikings took him at No. 21 overall. Moss produced more than 15,000 receiving yards and 156 touchdowns at the NFL level as one of the greatest receivers of all-time.

Warren Sapp: Days before the NFL draft, reports surfaced of multiple failed drug tests (cocaine and marijuana). Sapp still insists an anonymous source fabricated the reports to hurt his draft stock, and Tampa Bay selected him at No. 12 overall in 1995. A seven-time Pro Bowl selection, Sapp made 96.5 sacks during his Hall of Fame NFL career, earning a spot on the NFL’s All-Decade team for both the ’90s and ’00s.

Micah Parsons: Was suspended from his first high school for allegedly “inciting a riot” in 2016 — he yelled “Gun!” while police were in the cafeteria. He was also named in an accusation by former Nittany Lions defensive back Isaiah Humphries about an alleged previous sexual assault stemming from the PSU locker room

In regards to Micah Parsons, according to NFL.com draft analyst Lance Zierlein,
"Parsons could slip due to character concerns," Zierlein said, "but his explosiveness, range and versatility would be hard to pass on with his high-impact potential."

Lance Zierlein reveals reason why Micah Parsons' NFL Draft stock could drop

...

247sports.com

Imagine passing on a talent like Micah Parsons (Jalen Carter) because you were afraid he'd be a Malik McDowell?

Shall we name all the players with red flags who didn't pan out, to see which list is longer? And how many of those guys no showed to meetings/practices, and couldn't stay on the field because of terrible conditioning for multiple seasons? Judging by his pro day debacle, he has yet to fix his issues.

How exactly was Carter and McDowell not in the same stratosphere? Entertain me further and elaborate pls!

 

[cymatica]

Collier. Brooks. Boye Mafe.

What's with the Mafe hate?

 

[rjdriver]

Does anyone else think all the buzz with Richardson could have precipitated the need to bring Carter in?

Whichever player you desire, you want to pick them for the least amount of draft capital possible.

If you want Richardson, you’d prefer to take him at five, not three. I’d want the whole world to think I’m going defense to mitigate the chances of being leapfrogged in a trade. Plus the last thing I want to do is give a division rival MY picks. If another QB hungry team thinks we are going D, maybe they make a move for #6 instead of #3.

It’s important to not give away your cards. Bluff as needed.

 

[SantaClaraHawk]

What's with the Mafe hate?

I don’t really hate Him, but he wasn’t a big contributor last year. And as a second rounder on a team that was assumed to not contend, there wasnt Much in pressure or expectations.

There will be this year. And for a top 10that’s on a contending team, there will e quintuple as much.

 

[Sprfunk]

Interior pressure is so valuable to a defense, and really hard to get consistently. It may be one of the hardest shoes to fill in the nfl. Just simply moving the qb off his spot within a second or two does so much.
If Carter can do that he is worth the pick bar non. Can he do it, stay healthy, and stay out of trouble? Those are the questions that the staff are paid to figure out.
Personally I think racing is really dangerous and can cost lives. That being said, I did it also, and wish I was smart enough to never have. It didn't cost lives but could have. He however had been getting flack as if he is responsible for the loss. He is not.

If they take him ill be stoked for the potential, and hopeful, as Pc/Js are about the best in the business at a game of odds the draft is.

I

 

[Mistashoesta]

Shall we name all the players with red flags who didn't pan out, to see which list is longer? And how many of those guys no showed to meetings/practices, and couldn't stay on the field because of terrible conditioning for multiple seasons? Judging by his pro day debacle, he has yet to fix his issues.

How exactly was Carter and McDowell not in the same stratosphere? Entertain me further and elaborate pls!

If you want to name names, knock yourself out. The point I was making by listing names is that you can't make your decisions based solely on red flags alone. Each player is unique and you must do your homework and decide whether or not the upside of a particular player warrants a high pick or not. If Seattle views him as a player that could provide great value despite his "character issues" then pull the trigger. If not, move on.

Malik McDowell, although projected as a 1st round selection by many draft boards, he was not the overall BP at his position. That went to Jonathan Allen who was drafted by the Redskins.

McDowell was ranked as the 21st best player by PFF for the 2017 NFL Draft. Jalen Carter, is ranked at #2 on PFF's big board for the 2023 NFL Draft. Some boards even have Carter as the #1 overall best player. 1 or 2 vs 21 is a massive difference in player talent.

If you had to compare players from the 2017 draft to this year's draft, Myles Garrett would be a Will Anderson comp, Jonathan Allen would be Jalen Carter, and Malik McDowell would be Brian Bresee, who is also the 21st ranked prospect on PFF's big board for this year. And while he is physically gifted, I think we can agree that Brian Bresee is no Jalen Carter.

 

[Blazin Hawk]

All I know is if after our front office finishes their assessment of Jalen Carter, they decide he is worth the 5th overall pick… I will be very happy. Because that means they believe the reward is worth the risk. And the reward could anchor this D-line for a decade.

 

[LickMyNuts]

I think the problem with Carter is that he seems both lazy and immature. That’s a dangerous combination.

 

[Bear-Hawk]

The new CBS mock has Carter and Nolan Smith coming to Seahawks at 5 and 20. Add them to Dre’Mont Jones, and we would have a hell of a pass rush. Good chemistry, too, because Carter and Smith are best friends.

 

[Mistashoesta]

Now we're hearing he was missing and being late to meetings and practice

Maybe I heard it differently, but to me that wasn't a definite statement that there is inside knowledge of Carter being late to practice or meetings, but more so if one had knowledge, they would lead the questioning with such information. I say that because in the very next sentence, Lance specifically states that "one thing I have heard is that he thinks staff has been positive with him, that he's doing things right". Clarifying exactly what it is that he heard.

I can't find any reports anywhere that claim Carter was late to practice or meetings. Do you have a link to that info other than the video posted above?

 

[massari]

The point I was making by listing names is that you can't make your decisions based solely on red flags alone. Each player is unique and you must do your homework and decide whether or not the upside of a particular player warrants a high pick or not. If Seattle views him as a player that could provide great value despite his "character issues" then pull the trigger. If not, move on.

Those examples aren't valid considering none of them had on the field issues, and problems showing up to meetings and practices like Carter. The only thing comparable is his multiple run ins with the police because of his disregard for speed limits.

Malik McDowell, although projected as a 1st round selection by many draft boards, he was not the overall BP at his position. That went to Jonathan Allen who was drafted by the Redskins.

McDowell was ranked as the 21st best player by PFF for the 2017 NFL Draft. Jalen Carter, is ranked at #2 on PFF's big board for the 2023 NFL Draft. Some boards even have Carter as the #1 overall best player. 1 or 2 vs 21 is a massive difference in player talent.

If you had to compare players from the 2017 draft to this year's draft, Myles Garrett would be a Will Anderson comp, Jonathan Allen would be Jalen Carter, and Malik McDowell would be Brian Bresee, who is also the 21st ranked prospect on PFF's big board for this year. And while he is physically gifted, I think we can agree that Brian Bresee is no Jalen Carter.

None of this is accurate, even saying Garrett would be an Anderson comp. McDowell is closer to Carter and Allen than Bresee.

 

[Hawkinaz]

Georgia rotates their defensive lineman to keep them fresh. It's effective. A statline is not going to tell the entire whole story. In this instance, you really have to watch the film & zero in on him to get the full picture.

Talent wise, he's the most dominate defensive player in this draft. It's not close.

I mean the guy is getting comparisons to Warren Sapp.

Since Georgia rotated their players to keep them fresh there is no excuse for Carter to be winded but he was during the regular season and the playoff game vs Ohio St which he was criticized for being poorly conditioned. Then he looks awful in his pro day which IMO is impossible to do the player is in total control. It has been compared to flunking a take home open book test that’s just a case of somebody not giving a f*ck

 

[cymatica]

I don’t really hate Him, but he wasn’t a big contributor last year. And as a second rounder on a team that was assumed to not contend, there wasnt Much in pressure or expectations.

There will be this year. And for a top 10that’s on a contending team, there will e quintuple as much.

Meh. He was a rookie and they didn't use him much on a bad front 7 with a new DC and players that didn't fit the scheme.

 

[Bear-Hawk]

Since Georgia rotated their players to keep them fresh there is no excuse for Carter to be winded but he was during the regular season and the playoff game vs Ohio St which he was criticized for being poorly conditioned. Then he looks awful in his pro day which IMO is impossible to do the player is in total control. It has been compared to flunking a take home open book test that’s just a case of somebody not giving a f*ck

A lot of people around here are going to be damn disappointed when the Seahawks draft Carter. Your best hope is that the Cards trade down instead of taking Anderson. Right now though, if I had to bet, I’d say Carter is on the way to becoming a Seahawk.

 

[pmedic920]

How big of a deal is the “visit”?

We can’t be the only “visit” on his itinerary.

Probably our biggest need, potentially the best football player in this draft.

I say the possible reward is worth the risk.
I hope we take him if he’s available.

 

[Hawkinaz]

How big of a deal is the “visit”?

We can’t be the only “visit” on his itinerary.

Probably our biggest need, potentially the best football player in this draft.

I say the possible reward is worth the risk.
I hope he take him if he’s available.

IMO the visit is being over valued. The teams going to pro days and having player visits isn’t just players they are interested in drafting but also for getting intel for the future.

At the visit the Seahawks won’t be allowed to do any physical testing just asking questions and getting a feel for the player

 

[WarHawks]

Great post Mista. It seems that the Malik McDowell effect is stronger than we think. I'm guilty of that myself.

 

[SantaClaraHawk]

Now we're hearing he was missing and being late to meetings and practice

Step One, I’d ask him to diagram a play that he feels he can succeed in. He Was a DT in college, does he see himself as a nt? Or Ilb? Or edge?

Step Two, I’d ask Him flat out how much time he’d need off if His dog died. If his mom or friend were diagnosed with cancer. If his gf had a miscarriage. Or a live birth. Get him riled up so you see his stress response as a professional.

 

[Bear-Hawk]

IMO the visit is being over valued. The teams going to pro days and having player visits isn’t just players they are interested in drafting but also for getting intel for the future.

At the visit the Seahawks won’t be allowed to do any physical testing just asking questions and getting a feel for the player

This is a job interview. They already know what he can do on a football field. The tape is WAY more important than his poor performance at combine/pro day where he was still mentally/physically affected by being involved in a drunken drag race with two people dead. If the interview is convincing, they will not worry about his fixable issues since January.

He has two things in his favor for this interview. First, he has a very experienced agent who has been through this with other "risky"
players he has successfully represented. Second, Carter has interviewed with other teams already, so they will be very prepared for the questions.

Anyway, if you don't want Carter, my trade offer is still on to trade down to #9. The Bears will probably take him. And if the Bears go for Johnson, the Eagles will take him. For me, it doesn't matter unless he goes to the Lions.