Poll: Can Hawks Reach&Win Super Bowl w/o effective run game?

[Hawkscanner]

Thanks for the responses so far guys. Good thoughts overall. I have a slightly different question that I'd love to get some thoughts on, and that's this ...

With the time remaining this season, can Seattle's run game improve to the point of being NFL average?"

That's an interesting question and it all depends on how you look at it. According to Football Outsiders, they have the Seahawks run game ranked #18 in terms of DVOA (admittedly DVOA is far from a perfect measuring rod), so if you accept their opinion, Seattle is virtually there. As it stands right now, Seattle's run game is averaging 3.5 yards/carry. Can they improve to the point where they're consistently giving more like 4.0 yards/carry? Given the inexperience of this O-Line, is that too high of a mountain to scale though in too short an amount of time? Personally, I think if they make it a real intense point of emphasis, I wonder if it might not be possible. And if that happens, I would add this -- if this Seahawks team can get back to generating just average NFL production ... then this team most certainly is a serious Super Bowl title contender. Thoughts?

This is a tale of two seasons. DVOA takes into account the entire season. We were terrible at the beginning of the season, but when Rawls came back we were noticeably better. So with Rawls we could have an NFL average run game.

I should also restate myself a little bit. I said we wouldn't have a dominant or good run game which is true, but it's a bit facile to state we're going to have to rely solely on our passing game.

We can establish a good passing game if Wilson is accurate. Graham can be dangerous in the short, intermediate and deep game. The same can be said of both Baldwin and Lockett. Baldwin and Lockett can also challenge the defense both vertically and horizontally. You can get that DL running side to side...especially if you can get blocks on the outside, which we can with both Graham and Willson who are both athletic enough to beat LBers to the outside for screens, yet agile enough to catch DB's and pummel them. It also gives us formations where we can disguise looks and give variety.

Once we hit a few screens, hit a few seams and maybe a deep ball, the defense softens up a bit then you can hit them with the run. If folks can remember, Holmgren did this to great effect before we had a dominant OL; using the pass to set up the run. Also look at last year's faster rhythm passing game that included more short passes that were like longer hand offs.

Excellent point regarding Holmgren's use of the short rhythm passing game to set up the run. I had forgotten that, but you're absolutely correct. And that's precisely where having Procise and his speed and catching ability would be so darned valuable. One of the bigger X factors (I think especially as this team heads into the playoffs) ... will be the health of Lockett and Willson. Those 2 have been banged up for most of the season and are just now getting their legs back under them. Their agility, speed, and quickness could certainly serve to open things up for the running game ... especially if they put Russell Wilson in motion on the rollouts and/or naked bootleg. They could also advantage of Wilson's escapability -- put him in motion and tire those opposing lineman out from chasing him. Good thoughts.

 

[scutterhawk]

Week to week it appears that the Seahawks are facing the best defensive front in the league.

We all know that 16 teams are not the best in the league, so at some point, fingers need to be pointed in the O-Lines direction. The mere fact that we are still rotating RT at this point of the season is a harbinger.

It's hard to envision the way this team is playing right now as a SB champion. Up...Down...Up....Down, what?.....are we on a friggin merry-go-round?

We should be able to run on AZ and SF to close out the year but that is hardly confidence building competition, as it will get way tougher going forward.

I don't think most here are taking the reboot & rebuilding of the O-Line into account...Cable has made it abundantly clear, that the O-Line has pretty much put the Run Pushing duties on the back burner since mid season last year, and the Seahawks O-Line last season was marginally better, as it had fewer Rookies being tossed into the heat of battle.
Russell Wilson seems to have lost some of his confidence in the Pass Protection.
The Run Game is NOT on the same level as when Marshawn Lynch was here, so Rawls & co is going to have to pick it back up, and Wilson is going to need a game plan designed around a much sparser run game, plays that are designed for him getting the damned ball out a little quicker, because the O-Line is not ready for prime time as of yet.... Designed plays I'm speaking of are plays like the ones the Seahawks O used to counter Aaron Donald and the Rams really good Defensive front.

 

[hawks85]

Mission Impossible? -- Finding the Running Game ...

Can this Seahawks team both reach and win the Super Bowl without an effective running game?

Can this Seahawks team once again find its running game in the time remaining this season? Those are key questions and ones that I believe will ultimately decide the fate of this Seahawks team in the postseason.

From the coaching staff to all of us 12’s, I don’t think that anyone would argue that a HUGE Priority for this team in this upcoming game (arguably Priority #1) NEEDS to be establishing the run. This team has simply has GOT to find its running game heading into the playoffs ... and Saturday’s contest against the Cardinals is the last opportunity – the last true test of the regular season to be able to do that. AND there is good reason to believe that the Seahawks running game could have some success against the Cardinals this Saturday.

I've been taking a look at the Cardinals Rush Defense numbers ... and though (heading into yesterday) they were the 7th Best in terms of Rush DVOA, there is an interesting disparity in the Cardinals Defensive numbers -- home vs. road. I’ve highlighted those for you below …

Week	Opponent	Result	Opp. Rush Offense DVOA Rank	Carries Against	Rushing Yards Allowed	[Rushing TD’s Allowed
1	vs. Patriots	23-21 Loss	16	31	106	1
2	vs. Bucs	40-7 Win	31	21	85	0
3	at Bills	33-18 Loss	1	32	208	3
4	vs. Rams	17-13 Loss	30	21	41	0
5	at 49ers	33-21 Win	3	36	151	2
6	vs. Jets	28-3 Win	9	14	33	0
7	vs. Seahawks	6-6 Tie	18	16	52	0
8	at Panthers	30-20 Loss	21	36	141	2
10	vs. 49ers	23-20 Win	3	28	83	1
11	at Vikings	30-24 Loss	29	24	72	1
12	at Falcons	38-19 Loss	6	30	116	3
13	vs. Redskins	31-23 Win	4	18	87	1
14	at Dolphins	26-23 Loss	13	31	83	0
15	vs. Saints	48-41 Loss	12	32	132	2

[th] [tdo=4]2016 Cardinals Rush Defense (Home vs. Road) …[/tdo] [/th] [/color][/b]

Place	Carries Against	Rushing Yds Allowed	Avg. Yds/Carry Allowed	Rushing TD’s Allowed	Avg. Points Allowed
Home	184	619	3.36	5	18.38
Away	189	771	4.1	11	29.66

[tdo=4]2016 Cardinals Defense (Home vs. Road) …[/tdo]

Now, obviously a lot of those numbers are heavily influenced by the strength of opponent and player health (obviously) ... but that said, the differences are pretty apparent. I think that most of us can readily admit that the Seahawks have been a vastly different team at home ... vs. on the road. Well ... the same thing can be said for this Arizona Cardinal team as well. On the road, they are allowing nearly a yard more per rush on average and have yielded 6 more rushing TD’s in 2 less games. Their traditionally stout defense is also giving up an average of 11 more points a game on the road vs. at home. If this Seahawks team has any aspirations of advancing deep into the playoffs … then finding and establishing an effective running attack is a necessity. Doing so requires as much practice as they can get against quality competition (and the Cardinals represent the last decent defense they’ll face in the regular season). The first step in the journey to the Super Bowl could very well begin this Saturday … and it all starts with a commitment to #3 handing the ball off.

I just don't understand why we don't go and sign ray rice. He's not that old and that elevator incident is old news. Rice was a beast on the ravens.

 

[Rob12]

It's going to be tough. I think with the run game in its current state, we have about a 25 percent chance. Guess I'll take those odds.

 

[IndyHawk]

I just don't understand why we don't go and sign ray rice. He's not that old and that elevator incident is old news. Rice was a beast on the ravens.[/quote]He hasn't played in years and he's not in game shape anyway.We have the rb's we got so lets see how it goes.

 

[Seahawkfan80]

Week to week it appears that the Seahawks are facing the best defensive front in the league.

We all know that 16 teams are not the best in the league, so at some point, fingers need to be pointed in the O-Lines direction. The mere fact that we are still rotating RT at this point of the season is a harbinger.

It's hard to envision the way this team is playing right now as a SB champion. Up...Down...Up....Down, what?.....are we on a friggin merry-go-round?

We should be able to run on AZ and SF to close out the year but that is hardly confidence building competition, as it will get way tougher going forward.

I don't think most here are taking the reboot & rebuilding of the O-Line into account...Cable has made it abundantly clear, that the O-Line has pretty much put the Run Pushing duties on the back burner since mid season last year, and the Seahawks O-Line last season was marginally better, as it had fewer Rookies being tossed into the heat of battle.
Russell Wilson seems to have lost some of his confidence in the Pass Protection.
The Run Game is NOT on the same level as when Marshawn Lynch was here, so Rawls & co is going to have to pick it back up, and Wilson is going to need a game plan designed around a much sparser run game, plays that are designed for him getting the damned ball out a little quicker, because the O-Line is not ready for prime time as of yet.... Designed plays I'm speaking of are plays like the ones the Seahawks O used to counter Aaron Donald and the Rams really good Defensive front.

Aren't ya glad we play on Saturday this week. If only Gilda Radner were still alive.

 

[NFSeahawks]

Not really sure why you listed a graph of the Cardinals run defense when talking about the Seahawks running game, it would have been more appropriate to put a chart of the Seahawks run numbers this far.

I think a run game is pretty crucial in feeling more comfortable on offense.

 

[Optimus25]

I just don't understand why we don't go and sign ray rice. He's not that old and that elevator incident is old news. Rice was a beast on the ravens.

He hasn't played in years and he's not in game shape anyway.We have the rb's we got so lets see how it goes.[/quote]

On this note though i would be surprised if we don't sign cj spiller and dump Collins. Spiller and prosise are virtually identical, both go by cj lol, unfortunately even similar in the injury prone department, but rawls, reece, spiller, and potentially procise sound dynamic enough for a SB run to me, whereas collins is just such a project type depth guy. The jets released him early December, so he's right there. But he looked pretty good to me in that game he played for us.

 

[mrblitz]

it could be homerism on my part, but i actually believe that they're going to be able to run the ball in the playoffs. even when collins gets a carry or three. i'm anticipating a 4.5 to 5 yard per carry team average during the playoff run. make it so!

 

[LeftHandSmoke]

it could be homerism on my part, but i actually believe that they're going to be able to run the ball in the playoffs. even when collins gets a carry or three. i'm anticipating a 4.5 to 5 yard per carry team average during the playoff run. make it so!

Am guardedly optimistic too. We had a recent run of games before the Rams and the GB debacle, and after Rawls returned, where we averaged north of 150 yds/game in 4 of 5. We won't see the Rams again, so that's good reason too for optimism.