We have the best QB in the NFL!

OP
OP
Rainger

Rainger

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 5, 2011
Messages
3,847
Reaction score
2,111
Location
Brisbane OZ Down Under Hawk
RationalNiner":3h49jlub said:
I think you guys are getting ahead of yourselves. He has the potential to be the best but he isn't yet. Rodgers, Brees, Manning, and Brady are all better than him. I'd say he is top 5.
That's just crap you have nothing to prove that they are "BETTER" than RW. All you can use is Media talking heads and length of time in league and and yards ( which is a bullshit stat cause a QB throws 1 yard the receiver gets 80 and the QB gets credit for 80)

All the guys you mentioned are merely products of a passing league with lots of attempts. That does not make them better in the bigger picture of wins, percentage, rating, TD/ints etc.

Go look at the stats and not just attempts and yards. You have NO facts to back up that the 4 you mention are "BETTER" it is all subjective media hype that passing for 5000 yards means you are better. :pukeface:
 

MizzouHawkGal

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 16, 2012
Messages
13,477
Reaction score
846
Location
Kansas City, MO
RationalNiner":wod8g8ls said:
Seahawk Sailor":wod8g8ls said:
RationalNiner":wod8g8ls said:
I think you guys are getting ahead of yourselves. He has the potential to be the best but he isn't yet. Rodgers, Brees, Manning, and Brady are all better than him. I'd say he is top 5.

They have most certainly proved that with their head-to-head match-ups, haven't they?

Football is a team sport. Give Manning or Brees Seattle's defense and they would go undefeated.

Besides that, calling someone the best in the league, especially when that player plays QB, after only 2 seasons is premature.

I'd like to see how Russell does later in his career when/if the run game takes a nosedive or when your defense regresses. It's been 2 seasons. If he keeps it up and continues to improve over the course of the next 3-4 years, sure, I'll call him the best.
Manning? No. Brady? Yes, given he was in Wilson's situation pretty much and did go 16-0. But what if Wilson goes 15-1 and wins another Superbowl? What then, given currently that isn't insane talk. What if he does the impossible and goes 19-0? I assume that would stifle the Dilfer comparisons, no?
 

mistaowen

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 28, 2010
Messages
6,335
Reaction score
612
rainger":2o33r4ga said:
RationalNiner":2o33r4ga said:
I think you guys are getting ahead of yourselves. He has the potential to be the best but he isn't yet. Rodgers, Brees, Manning, and Brady are all better than him. I'd say he is top 5.
That's just crap you have nothing to prove that they are "BETTER" than RW. All you can use is Media talking heads and length of time in league and and yards ( which is a bullshit stat cause a QB throws 1 yard the receiver gets 80 and the QB gets credit for 80)

All the guys you mentioned are merely products of a passing league with lots of attempts. That does not make them better in the bigger picture of wins, percentage, rating, TD/ints etc.

Go look at the stats and not just attempts and yards. You have NO facts to back up that the 4 you mention are "BETTER" it is all subjective media hype that passing for 5000 yards means you are better. :pukeface:

The only QB I would put ahead of RW in terms of 'career' is Brady, cause he has for over 10 years put the Pats into the AFC ship/Superbowl like 80% of his career. Dudes career stats and record is ridiculous. The best part, though, is RW is on track to have a similar career as Tom and will have 5x the defense he ever had til at least 2018.
 

AROS

Administrator
Administrator
Moderator
Joined
Feb 23, 2007
Messages
19,069
Reaction score
7,939
Location
Sultan, WA
Russell Wilson will end up having a bust in Canton at the end of his career. I would bet my life on it.
 

RolandDeschain

Well-known member
Joined
May 1, 2009
Messages
33,132
Reaction score
957
Location
Kissimmee, FL
RationalNiner":2htcqjf6 said:
I think you guys are getting ahead of yourselves. He has the potential to be the best but he isn't yet. Rodgers, Brees, Manning, and Brady are all better than him. I'd say he is top 5.
Wilson's not the best right now. I completely agree. I think a lot of people are, in the spirit of mixing up correlation with causation, thinking that Wilson's going to be the best active QB playing within a year or two which right now seems entirely possible, but it certainly isn't the case at present.

That being said, Wilson's career trajectory extrapolated out over 15 years of playing would make him the greatest to ever play. We'll see what actually happens over time, of course, but compare his first two years statistically to guys like Montana, Young, Elway, Peyton, and Marino...It's scary-looking.

(49ers fans, don't start misquoting me! I said would make him the best to ever play, he's got to continue on that path with future improvement at an increasing level, etc.; far from a guarantee that it will happen, so relax. Nobody is coming close to calling him the greatest of all time right now. I can already smell half your fan base getting outraged over what I just said; so, stop.)
 

fenderbender123

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 9, 2012
Messages
12,367
Reaction score
2,525
Aros":1t63x4yw said:
Russell Wilson will end up having a bust in Canton at the end of his career.

This is the only time it's acceptable to say 'Russell Wilson' and 'bust' in the same sentence.
 

Hasselbeck

New member
Joined
May 2, 2009
Messages
11,397
Reaction score
4
rainger":3b1zi8zi said:
RationalNiner":3b1zi8zi said:
I think you guys are getting ahead of yourselves. He has the potential to be the best but he isn't yet. Rodgers, Brees, Manning, and Brady are all better than him. I'd say he is top 5.
That's just crap you have nothing to prove that they are "BETTER" than RW.

Do you have something aside from you being a die-hard Seahawks, and subsequently a Russell Wilson, fan? Because his opinion provides as much "proof" as yours.

Russell Wilson is a special player, and in regards to the Seahawks.. he's borderline irreplaceable at this point.. but just going "WILSON IS THE BEST, YOUR OPINION IS CRAP" isn't exactly a strong argument.
 

Sgt. Largent

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 1, 2012
Messages
25,560
Reaction score
7,612
fenderbender123":u1ayee7q said:
Aros":u1ayee7q said:
Russell Wilson will end up having a bust in Canton at the end of his career.

This is the only time it's acceptable to say 'Russell Wilson' and 'bust' in the same sentence.

- Russell's about to bust a cap in someone's ass?
- Russell's taking us to the SB or bust?
- Russell just busted a move on that foo?
 

Attyla the Hawk

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 11, 2013
Messages
2,559
Reaction score
47
He is the best QB for this team. Of that I have no doubt.

There isn't another QB in the league I would trade Wilson for right now. Everything he brings to this team is absolutely core to who we are and what we do. I don't see any other QB that brings this variety of high level quality.
 

themunn

Well-known member
Joined
May 18, 2012
Messages
3,948
Reaction score
466
If the NFL were to finish today, there's no doubt in my mind that Manning, Brady, Brees and Rodgers would be considered better QBs than Wilson due to their body of work, but RIGHT NOW? There's no way in hell I could consider Brady or Manning better QBs than Wilson.

Manning is as much a product of his environment as Wilson is, his receiving corps turned short passes into long touchdowns consistently last year (which is why when faced with a defense that tackles well in the Superbowl he faded), he simply doesn't have the arm to take the top off anymore.

Brady too is now on the decline from the very top. People point to his receiving corps last year as the reason he had a down year, but whilst our own receiving corps is "sneaky good", it's easy to forget that Wilson's rookie season had him open the season with Braylon Edwards, Charly Martin and Ben Obomanu on the gameday roster, and finished the season with Deon Butler and a rookie Jermaine Kearse replacing the three of them - and he still threw more touchdowns and less interceptions than Brady did last year.

Whether he is better than Rodgers or Brees is up for debate, at the moment neither of them are showing significant signs of decline, but both have had far greater passing options than Seattle has (until now, at least). Still, to this day I've yet to see either of them do something and think "wow, I wish Wilson could do that", whereas I have seen both in situations and thought "Wilson wouldn't do that", or "Wilson would have avoided that sack". The defense has been able to cover up some of Wilson's poorer games, however, every QB has poor games - remember when Brees went to Atlanta in 2012 and threw FIVE interceptions?
I don't think Wilson had a single poor game last year - he had some where he didn't play well for times and the stats suggest he had a poor game, e.g. Tampa Bay and Houston. However, anyone that watched those games will remember Wilson simply taking the ball on the ground against Houston and destroying them, or coming back from 21 points down against Tampa Bay to win in overtime. He didn't have the best game against Arizona, but even then he looked poised to drive down the field for victory before the refs made a poor call on the incomplete interception.

You can look back at his rookie year and see the poor stats against SF and think he had a poor game, but again that's a game where if not for drops by the receivers he would have had a nice game - and against the toughest opposition in the league. You really have to go back to that game against the Rams where he had 3 unfortunate interceptions, but really didn't play well all around anyway, but that was the 4th start of his career, he is literally 850% more experienced as a pro since that game in terms of competitive games.
 

253hawk

Active member
Joined
Sep 13, 2013
Messages
3,322
Reaction score
15
Location
PNW
I think it's difficult to say he's 'the best' right now because the league is still in pass happy mode where yardage and points by immobile QB's are the status quo, and have been for at least the past decade. He plays with a whole different dynamic that is in the minority of playing styles in the NFL, but his success will eventually lead to more GM's looking at drafting players with that frame and skill set (or at least less wary in doing so.)

All I know is that he's 6-0 against Brees, Manning, Brady and Rodgers with 112.3 average rating, 12 TD's and 0 INT's. Show me another QB in the league with those numbers against the elites.
 

hawksfansinceday1

Active member
Joined
Mar 3, 2007
Messages
24,629
Reaction score
3
Location
Vancouver, WA
RolandDeschain":31c5t816 said:
Wilson's not the best right now. I completely agree. I think a lot of people are, in the spirit of mixing up correlation with causation, thinking that Wilson's going to be the best active QB playing within a year or two which right now seems entirely possible, but it certainly isn't the case at present.

That being said, Wilson's career trajectory extrapolated out over 15 years of playing would make him the greatest to ever play. We'll see what actually happens over time, of course, but compare his first two years statistically to guys like Montana, Young, Elway, Peyton, and Marino...It's scary-looking.

(49ers fans, don't start misquoting me! I said would make him the best to ever play, he's got to continue on that path with future improvement at an increasing level, etc.; far from a guarantee that it will happen, so relax. Nobody is coming close to calling him the greatest of all time right now. I can already smell half your fan base getting outraged over what I just said; so, stop.)
Really good post man.
 

253hawk

Active member
Joined
Sep 13, 2013
Messages
3,322
Reaction score
15
Location
PNW
First .gif of the season, just because.

The only QB in the league with his name on the official towel.
ibfUYO1euBiDi3.gif
 
OP
OP
Rainger

Rainger

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 5, 2011
Messages
3,847
Reaction score
2,111
Location
Brisbane OZ Down Under Hawk
Hasselbeck":3ifgtvm2 said:
rainger":3ifgtvm2 said:
RationalNiner":3ifgtvm2 said:
I think you guys are getting ahead of yourselves. He has the potential to be the best but he isn't yet. Rodgers, Brees, Manning, and Brady are all better than him. I'd say he is top 5.
That's just crap you have nothing to prove that they are "BETTER" than RW.

Do you have something aside from you being a die-hard Seahawks, and subsequently a Russell Wilson, fan? Because his opinion provides as much "proof" as yours.

Russell Wilson is a special player, and in regards to the Seahawks.. he's borderline irreplaceable at this point.. but just going "WILSON IS THE BEST, YOUR OPINION IS CRAP" isn't exactly a strong argument.
Well that was selective editing of my post to make your point.

I also made some points that you conveniently didn't add.

I also said:

"All the guys you mentioned are merely products of a passing league with lots of attempts. That does not make them better in the bigger picture of wins, percentage, rating, TD/ints etc.

Go look at the stats and not just attempts and yards. You have NO facts to back up that the 4 you mention are "BETTER" it is all subjective media hype that passing for 5000 yards means you are better."

But you dropped all that cause it didn't fit the agenda.

His point is that 4 QB's are Better. I contend that "better" is subjective. It is the media that says passing 50 times and for 400 yards a game is the standard. I think if you take away those stats and look at wins, td/ints, percentage, rating, running, mistakes, etc none of the others are "better" than RW. Also I did not say "Wilson is the best, your opinion is crap" in all caps as you conveniently modified my post to enhance your point. You must work in the media, that is how they operate.
 

Seahawk Sailor

Active member
Joined
Mar 3, 2007
Messages
22,963
Reaction score
1
Location
California via Negros Occidental, Philippines
themunn":hsynpp2v said:
People point to his receiving corps last year as the reason he had a down year, but whilst our own receiving corps is "sneaky good", it's easy to forget that Wilson's rookie season had him open the season with Braylon Edwards, Charly Martin and Ben Obomanu on the gameday roster, and finished the season with Deon Butler and a rookie Jermaine Kearse replacing the three of them - and he still threw more touchdowns and less interceptions than Brady did last year.

Good receivers always make their game manager quarterback look better than they are.
 

Anthony!

New member
Joined
Nov 19, 2013
Messages
4,050
Reaction score
0
Location
Kent, wa
RationalNiner":2cfflj46 said:
Seahawk Sailor":2cfflj46 said:
RationalNiner":2cfflj46 said:
I think you guys are getting ahead of yourselves. He has the potential to be the best but he isn't yet. Rodgers, Brees, Manning, and Brady are all better than him. I'd say he is top 5.

They have most certainly proved that with their head-to-head match-ups, haven't they?

Football is a team sport. Give Manning or Brees Seattle's defense and they would go undefeated.

Besides that, calling someone the best in the league, especially when that player plays QB, after only 2 seasons is premature.

I'd like to see how Russell does later in his career when/if the run game takes a nosedive or when your defense regresses. It's been 2 seasons. If he keeps it up and continues to improve over the course of the next 3-4 years, sure, I'll call him the best.

so first off you really cannot prove that those QBs could have gone undefeated with our defense. For one 2 of them play in the AFC which means they play much easier competition. Then as to Rodgers and Brees they are not in the NFC west which is far and away the toughest division and all of them have way more talent around them on offense then RW has. so sorry NO
 

HawKnPeppa

New member
Joined
Oct 31, 2009
Messages
4,733
Reaction score
0
Anthony!":z1xz639t said:
RationalNiner":z1xz639t said:
Seahawk Sailor":z1xz639t said:
RationalNiner":z1xz639t said:
I think you guys are getting ahead of yourselves. He has the potential to be the best but he isn't yet. Rodgers, Brees, Manning, and Brady are all better than him. I'd say he is top 5.

They have most certainly proved that with their head-to-head match-ups, haven't they?

Football is a team sport. Give Manning or Brees Seattle's defense and they would go undefeated.

Besides that, calling someone the best in the league, especially when that player plays QB, after only 2 seasons is premature.

I'd like to see how Russell does later in his career when/if the run game takes a nosedive or when your defense regresses. It's been 2 seasons. If he keeps it up and continues to improve over the course of the next 3-4 years, sure, I'll call him the best.

so first off you really cannot prove that those QBs could have gone undefeated with our defense. For one 2 of them play in the AFC which means they play much easier competition. Then as to Rodgers and Brees they are not in the NFC west which is far and away the toughest division and all of them have way more talent around them on offense then RW has. so sorry NO
'Those QB's' either would not have survived, or somehow managed to survive, but not win many games behind last year's OL. I don't know of any current QB that could have pulled out that string of wins during that 7-game stretch. That was some amazing shiznit!
 
Top